Talk:PlayStation 3/Archive 20

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Accomplishments / Entitlements / Skill Points

Does anyone have any info on this, the only game that currently supports in-game xmb "Accomplisment" messages is Devil May Cry 4. Sony at GDC 07' said during their Home demonstration that accomplishments were Sony's version of 360's Achievements. This is the first game to have this feature. This section is to be a sub category under Home since the Accomplishments are Home based. DevonTheDude (talk) 06:44, 26 February 2008 (UTC)DevonTheDudeDevonTheDude (talk) 06:44, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

DMC4 doesnt have the final accomplishments system(hopefully), as they take over the entire screen when being displayed. It'll probably be released with home anyway. john.n-irl (talk) 19:24, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Yea they do take the entire screen but only at the end of each level, not while the game is in progress. There are smaller messages (non XMB messages) skill points in games like Burnout Paradise, Uncharted, Ratchet and Resistance. DevonTheDude (talk) 23:44, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

Here is more progress on Accomplishments/ Entitlements: Dark Sector is going to use Entitlements which are another version of PS3 Accomplishments http://kotaku.com/364390/dark-sectors-ps3-entitlements DevonTheDude (talk) 23:44, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

40gb Black

It's not a gloss finish like the other consoles, it is a matte finish--213.40.133.120 (talk) 08:34, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

The PAL 40GB version in Australia has a Gloss finish with Matte Grey trim and a painted PLAYSTATION 3 logo.--Eeleye (talk) 06:12, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Another is, that the PLAYSTATION 3 logo is painted on not engraved like it is on the 20, 60 and possiably the 80gb version.

Also I believe that the 80gb version is no longer made. So Playstation 2 compatability is severly limited so if you plan to buy a PS3 do not get rid of your ps2 —Preceding unsigned comment added by AD7BK (talk • contribs) 22:46, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Sales/Shipped

The sales chart should be seperate from the shipped chart. when they're put on the same chart it's misleading. does anyone have quarter shimpments to make a seperate shipped chart?200.109.223.204 (talk) 00:15, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Not really(?) NimiTiz_e 01:35, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Got new end of the week of February 23rd 2008 #'s, the PS3 beat out the 360 again, barely: Wii: 209,561 (+339%) [47,702] DSL: 116,674 (-30%) [166,899] PS3: 94,106 (+17%) [80,214] 360: 87,569 (+11%) [79,204]

citation: http://n4g.com/News-116557.aspx

These figures come from vgchartz(first line of the article) john.n-irl (talk) 13:09, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

People are getting beside the poin, there is a large gap between sales and units shipped, and we should have both. Seanor3 16:59, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Playstation 3 Slim

Are you guys gonna add a part on the article about the Playstation 3 Slim? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.90.174.173 (talk) 03:45, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Uhhh what are you talking about? You sure you don't mean PSP Slim? there's no such thing as PS3 Slim. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Camilo101 (talk • contribs) 17:49, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

There was a rumour about a PS3 slim being made, but it was just a rumour so no need to put it in, unless it actually happens. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chris huh (talk • contribs) 17:54, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Unless its confirmed, nothing is added. NimiTiz_e 16:09, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

It will be confirmed soon. I heard DLB talking about it on P.O.B. 70.90.174.173 (talk) 01:01, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

Why someone deleted my section, I dont know who but the PS3 slim is if anything in development and is YEARS out not a few months. As I stated the Cell, RSX, and Blu-ray Diode need to shrink down to at least a 45nm process before this can happen (for size, power consumption, and heat reduction). The internal fan in the PS3 is huge b/c the heat the 90nm chips put off, and 65nm (only the cell processor) for the 40gb. I also mentioned that SCEA has NEVER released a slim Playstation in the beginning of the Playstation product life cycle (i.e. the first 3-4 years of a console's life span). The only exception is the PSP. There is a NEW PS2 slim thats going to come out soon, it is the redesigned Ps2 slim with a built in power supply (the current model is external, like a laptop/ xbox 360 power supply). This new Ps2 is supposed to ship for $99 but is still not at market yet. There is lots of info on gaming publications to back up my allegations.

Well, so long as it stays a rumour there is no need to mention it. Thus far all that you've mentioned seems like original research, so yeah, we'll wait until something official comes out. Chan Yin Keen | Talk 18:32, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

Sony opens PS3 to in-game Ads

In-game advertisements, like the ones often seen in EA games, could soon become far more commonplace as Sony opens up its in-game advertising platform on PlayStation 3.

The move will allow major game advertisement companies IGA, Double Fusion and AdScape to sell 'dynamic' advertisements to go into games on the PS3, who will compete to strike deals with major publishers EA, Activision and Ubisoft.

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=183294

Denzelio (talk) 10:50, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Here's another article http://kotaku.com/360864/sony-allowing-competition-for-ps3-in+game-ads

Does anyone know if these ads are; in-game, in Home and in the XMB (ala 360's blade ads)?

These are for in game ads only. The XMB does not and from what I can tell will not have any ads at any point in the future. Home will most likely feature ads, but that is my opinion, we won't know until Home is out. —Preceding unsigned comment added by WhereAmI (talk • contribs) 20:29, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

80 GB Motorstorm Bundle to be replaced with 80 GB Metal Gear Solid Bundle - June 12th

The new 80 GB PS3 Bundle will remain the same but with a few changes,

Metal Gear Solid instead of Motorstorm.

DualShock 3 controller instead of the Sixaxis controller

the system contains the same emulated PS2 b/c as the other 80 GB system.

http://www.kotaku.com.au/games/2008/02/metal_gear_solid_4_ps3_bundle_announced-2.html

http://kotaku.com/361158/metal-gear-solid-4-the-ps3-bundle-the-cardboard-box - (picture included)

This 80 GB cancels out any rumored 120 GB model or slimline models for the moment.

Denzelio (talk) 03:09, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

I noticed an IP added something today about Emotion Engine being restored to this new 80 GB model. Has that been confirmed? Do we have a source for this information as well? Best, --Le Grand Roi des Citrouilles^Tally-ho! 01:42, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

I dont see why they would include it in the new MGS4 PS3 pack, especially when the pack is $499 with a game and an 80gb PS3 (better than the current $499 just for the console with out DShock3). I would speculate that the next model above the 80gb (the Elite version for the PS3) would likely have it. In Japan the value of the 60GB and 20GB has surpassed the 40 and 80gb trade in values. This shows that people do want full b/c back. DevonTheDude (talk) 00:01, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

PS3 In-game Music / Custom Soundtracks

The list of in-game custom soundtracks music is growing, I'm not referring to In-game XMB music but just "Custom Soundtracks". Here is the first games that currently or will support custom soundtracks: 1. High velocity Bowling 2. Super Stardust HD (ver. 1.1) 3. MLB The Show 08' 4. Wipeout HD 5. Burnout Paradise (ver 1.3) 7. GTA 4 (maybe) 8. LBP (maybe) 9. Echochrome (maybe)

All the "maybe" are unconfirmed, but may support the custom soundtrack feature, I am 100% positive the first 4 games do support the feature.

http://kotaku.com/361224/wipeout-hd-features-custom-soundtracks http://blog.us.playstation.com/2008/02/13/mlb-08-the-show-weekly-update-my-mlb-music-demo-details/

Here is a quote from the official playstation blog moderators on HV bowling "Very nice observation! One of the things that we are shipping with (and may be the first) is the ability to play your own music from within the title." (this is posted in the comments section of the blog) http://blog.us.playstation.com/2007/11/13/bowling-anyone/

Another quote, "an update to PlayStation 3 downloadable favorite Super Stardust HD. The update adds rumble support for the DualShock 3 and adds custom soundtrack support, among other visual changes" http://kotaku.com/343521/super-playstation-store-update-hd

Dualshock 3

As announced yesterday (2.26.08) the Dualshock 3 controller will arrive day and date with GT5 prologue (April 15th 2008) for an MSRP of 54.99. I included the link to the official news direct from SCEA: http://blog.us.playstation.com/2008/02/26/destination-playstation-news-mgs-ps3-bundle-kratos-psp-and-dualshock3-release-date-by/ http://kotaku.com/360931/dualshock-3-dated-for-us (for the April 15th date citation)

"Yes - Software Emulation"

This is partly wrong on the 60GB PAL and 80GB NTSC models of the PS3. It should be made clear note in that chart of PS3 SKU's that the Graphics Synthesizer of the PS2 is present in both of these models allowing the PS3 to gain near perfect backwards compatibility with PlayStation2 software. The absense of high-bandwidth EDRAM from the PS3's hardware prevents a viable PS2 emulation software solution from being produced for the PS3. Thus the GSX's inclusion in the higher end models(60GB PAL and 80GB NTSC) is extremely necessary to achieving backwards compatibility with PS2 software. It's a mix of hardware and software, not completely software. Whereas the early 20GB and 60GB NTSC models included both the PS2's Emotion Engine CPU and the Graphics Synthesizer GPU, however the GSX GPU from the PS2 is the most important part of this formula, as the Cell has about no trouble emulating the Emotion Engine. TonyFreakinAlmeida (talk) 17:00, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

• • Talking about software, perhaps we could include a section on the programming language that the PS3 uses for games? I don't see any mention of that, surely this is important as far as tech specs go? If there is no opposition then perhaps can someone find out the programming language used for games and mention this?

I condsider it an interesting point as ease of programming is instrumental to game quality. For eg, Xbox360 games can be coded in C++ (I believe, correct me if I am wrong) and one can also use established DirectX libraries and API's, so any PC game programmer worth his salt would find Xbox360 programming reasonably easy. Since I am unsure of PS3's language, I can't comment on its ease of use?74.210.56.135 (talk) 07:09, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Programming languages are not strait-forward. At a fairly basic level the CPU code will have to be in Cell, but it could be written in any language, provided you have a compiler. If someone could find out what language is most common however, I think it would be a good addition to the article. John.n-irl (talk) 07:36, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Official PS3 Accessories

An official Sony Playstation Bluetooth headset is set to ship on the day that Socom: Confrontation arrives (Summer 08'). This bundle which will retail for $59.99 is similar to the Warhawk headset deal offered in August 07'. The BT headset will be also available as a standalone product @ $49.99 for the headset and charging dock. The headset is slated for an early August or late July 2008 release which will likely be the time Socom: C comes out too (since it comes w/ a headset packed in). http://akayuki.com/2008/03/11/ps3-bt-headset-psp-gps-unit-details/

Here is a link to the image of the headset http://akayuki.com/wp-content/ps_bluetooth842.jpg DevonTheDude (talk) 21:28, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

That pic looks too fake/unofficialjohn.n-irl (talk) 22:20, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

More confirmation: http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2008/03/11/rumor-socom-confrontation-bundle-includes-new-bluetooth-headset/ DevonTheDude (talk) 23:52, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Confirmation or rumor? Says rumor john.n-irl (talk) 18:16, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

I would expect true confirmation at Sony Gamer day in May 08' DevonTheDude (talk) 20:53, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

And if it is announced by sony or a reliable source it can go in the article. Also, if you could please type ":" before your comments, makes talk pages easier to read. john.n-irl (talk) 20:59, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

"Exactly, I am waiting till then. Sony did talk about a headset in the past prior to Warhawk's retail release, maybe this is it. It wont be posted till it's official thats what I expect at Sony gamer Day 08' in May." DevonTheDude (talk) 23:48, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, thought you meant for it to go in. My mistake. I do recall them talkin about a headset that wasn't the Jabra...i think. And I didn't mean quotations, the colon. john.n-irl (talk) 23:57, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Editing the Page

When I added the NPD results for February the Hardware section vanished, among other things, but when I went to edit the page again to rectify the mistake it said that all of that info was still there. What did I do wrong??????????Einstein the afrodude (talk) 00:21, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Fixed, possibly an error in wp, all the hardware text was still in your version of the page, just not being displayed.john.n-irl (talk) 01:15, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

The ref tags weren't closed properly, it was <ref> <ref> instead of <ref> </ref>. --Silver Edge (talk) 01:20, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Loss of money

Though I have no citation, I've heard that sony lost money from the PS3. Many people bought it for the blu-ray playing abilities. Sony was actually losing money from selling the PS3's because they expected people to buy games. Though I don't see anything about this in the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.159.22.4 (talk) 18:23, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

This is common practice in the VG industry, and is mentioned in the Sales and Production Cost section john.n-irl (talk) 19:09, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

SCEI has taken losses (at launch) on every playstation model that has come to market including the PSP. 69.228.116.112 (talk) 21:48, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

SCEI is expected to begin turning a profit on PS3 hardware this August 2008. DevonTheDude (talk) 04:40, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

80GB PS3 for Europe this Summer?

http://www.n4g.com/ps3/News-127990.aspx

Retailers have told CVG that they expect the 80GB PS3 - currently out in the US - to hit UK stores by the end of the summer.

UK cash and carry superstore chain, Costco, told a CVG reader that it was clearing out its supply of 40GB PS3 units in preparation for the arrival of the 80GB consoles some time soon. But it's not the only retailer expecting the bigger console in the near future.

A HMV staffer told CVG that, although he had been given no confirmed release date by the retailer, he expects the 80GB console will "very likely" hit the UK soon, especially considering the 40GB PS3's inability to play PS2 games. The 80GB model in the US does include the functionally to play PS2 games.

Denzelio (talk) 04:13, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

User's repeated query

Hello its user: Political Dweeb again, I’ll try communicating this point in an understandable manor.

Is using a PS3 memory card on a Play station 2 possible? Because then a PS3 memory card can get transferred PS2 memory card game data by using a PS3 memory card adaptor and transfer cable.

Here’s source’s website address below http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080210075026AAWMhJk)

Please let me know because then people like me and anyone else here could transfer their Play station memory card data onto other Play station memory cards instead of deleting the data.Political Dweeb (talk) 10:00, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not a forum, this would not really be relevant for the article. John.n-irl (talk) 20:57, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, to put you out of your misery, no you cannot use a PS3 memory card on a PS2, because a PS3 memory card does not exist. Perhaps you mean 'can one transfer PS2 data onto the PS3?' To that question yes. However you have to buy a little adapter to plug into the PS3, that has a dongle that takes a PS2 memory card. Then one copies the PS2 card data onto the PS3's hard drive. I believe you can also work with the PS2 card directly whilst playing a PS2 game, or, just save it to the PS3's HD, dispensing with the adapter and PS2 card once the data is transferred.74.210.56.135 (talk) 07:03, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

PS3 sales vs Xbox 360 for 2008

I think it should be clear that so far the PS3 had consistently sold more than the Xbox 360. Official NPD results for January and February show this. And on a week to week basis this has also been true. Plus, it should be included that the 80GB has been selling out at Amazon as well as they other numerous signs of sales increase.201.248.250.105 (talk) 22:14, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Do you think Xbox 360 sales are relevant to this article? Details of the hardware shortage and the resulting Xbox 360 sales slow-down are probably properly documented elsewhere, it wouldnt seem to be in the scope of this article would it?

Wageslave (talk) 06:29, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

What I meant was just to show that the PS3 sales are on the rise, and not as far behind as they were this time last year. In addition, the last factual info on sales in the Sales section is about sales in January. Furthermore, the NPD results from February and March are already out and should be included somewhere.68.153.178.245 (talk) 14:20, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

New SKU model AK8CBEH1101

"The Federal Communications Commission has let slip news of one more addition to the PlayStation 3 hardware family. At some unspecified date, we'll be welcoming little AK8CBEH1101 into the gaming world, kicking and screaming with a new antennae gain for both the Bluetooth and Wi-fi modules. Hopefully, that means less SIXAXIS wonkiness, the kind that leads to Drake walking off a cliff unintentionally. The rest of the new spec is under a confidentially agreement, due to expire on April 14, so we'll hold tight until then for this potentially underwhelming reveal."

http://www.kotaku.com.au/games/2008/04/at_least_one_more_playstation_3_model_coming.html

Denzelio (talk) 11:12, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

Could be a new 40GB with Dualshock 3 packed in, or maybe a "premium" model with large HDD and EE+GS PS2 chipset included (for full B/C)(60 and 20GB trade-in values have skyrocketed in Japan due to full B/C). DevonTheDude (talk) 03:19, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

Sixaxis is now Discontinued in the U.S. (replaced with DS3)

Now that the DualShock 3 controller has been released in the U.S. the Sixaxis controller has now been discontinued.

"A Sony rep tells me that the Sixaxis is indeed on the way out: “Sixaxis will no longer be offered after it’s completely sold through at retail (likely by the summer timeframe).”

http://multiplayerblog.mtv.com/2008/04/02/sony-non-shocker-sixaxis-discontinued/

http://gizmodo.com/375452/lightning-review-playstation-3-dualshock-3-rumble-controller

Denzelio (talk) 21:37, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

Article outdated?

May I ask why this featured article is almost a year out of date? Just curious.65.12.233.213 (talk) 01:59, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

May I ask what parts of the article appear to be out of date to you? Frvernchanezzz (talk) 07:20, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Just the parts discussing the models available; given that the 80 gb is now being phased out and a new model is being developed. Also, no mention of the 80 gb bundle w/ MGS4 coming out soon.65.12.233.213 (talk) 22:25, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

I believe it was in the article at an earlier date, no idea why it was removed(if im not imagining it). Th position of the 80gb model is not clear currently. However if there is anything you feel the article needs(be it bundles or models), feel free to edit the article, citing relevant sources. John.n-irl (talk) 23:59, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Can never please everyone can you. The section involving models is primarily to show the differences in which the PS3 models offer both in hardware and compatible software, the table also shows which models are and are not still in production, the table isn't really meant to show which games or Blu-ray come with each system.Denzelio (talk) 12:59, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Code of Death - 80010514 Error

This article should include some detail on Error 80010514.

"Sony appears to be having problems with failure rates on the new 40GB PlayStation 3 model, according to retail sources. Speaking to Dutch site Gamed.nl, Belgian games retailer Games Mania has said that while the new 40GB model is selling well, some 40 per cent of the new consoles sold so far have been returned due to hardware defects that result in the console being unable to read Blu-Ray and other discs."

http://www.gamer.tm/news.php?id=1700 http://www.gamed.nl/view/33860

The story is further covered on respected game site Destructoid here http://www.destructoid.com/ps3-owners-does-the-code-80010514-mean-anything-to-you--80697.phtml

Where Destructiod Editors say "However, it should be known that at least a couple people on staff know of others who have had issues with their PS3's giving up the ghost."

Another post on the topic is here: http://www.maxconsole.net/?mode=news&newsid=26751

Where they say "The error code most people have been getting for this is '80010514', sometimes referred to as the "code of death." Most forum members have said Sony will replace the unit with no fuss, however if your PS3 is out of warranty it apparently costs $150 to be fixed." —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wageslave (talk • contribs) 17:22, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

"Interestedly, at the time of this writing the PlayStation.com forums are temporarily closed..." [1]

Wageslave (talk) 18:04, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Interestingly, this is coming from teamxbox.com...

"teamxbox.com" is actually an IGN.com property. Not some random site.

Wageslave (talk) 14:36, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

Interestingly must be 360 fanboys who insist on adding this to the article to claim PS3 is as faulty as the 360. Unless there are statistics or a percentage released of how often this actually occurs to owners then it can never be truthfully explained, this could be a very minor problem. Until known any explantation in the article would be misleading. As this is the first time many of us have heard of this particular numbered problem, that and the fact it's usually a faulty hard drive sector (faulty HDD) not the actual system at fault.

http://www.destructoid.com/ps3-owners-does-the-code-80010514-mean-anything-to-you--80697.phtml

http://www.destructoid.com/apparently-the-80010514-error-doesn-t-mean-anything-to-sony-either-80938.phtml

Denzelio (talk) 22:34, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

The xbox 360 is not relevant to this discussion.

If you've noticed, I didnt add the information here to the article, I would hope that the regular, neutral editors of this page would add the information themselves. Clearly it is notworthy, and, the datelines on the articles above span about 5 months. This isnt a "new" discussion.

"Statistics or percentages" are not necessary to warrant inclusion in the article at all. What is know should be included. When new information arrives, that should be integrated.

Wageslave (talk) 22:50, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Concerning the forums, the forums have been planning this down time for a few number of weeks. No conspiracy im afraid. John.n-irl (talk) 23:01, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

So you agree without "Statistics or percentages" the problem can only be mentioned as a minor problem that happens to a rare few people, so really it may only be as harmful as any other error code nothing significant. Along with the fact it is usually the HDD (replaceable) not the system is it worth mentioning?.Denzelio (talk) 23:20, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

I dont agree that your arbitraryly chosen threashold ("stats or %") should need to be met to be included. It is verifiable. It meets Wikipedia standards for inclusion.

Wageslave (talk) 06:31, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

http://blogs.pcworld.com/gameon/archives/006781.html - PC World says that the problem does indeed exist (which is true), but it falls well "within the acceptable failure range for any piece of electronic equipment". I would say is is a bit of a POV issue to be adding this into the article. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 03:29, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

There are half-a-dozen sources Destructiod, and IGN's teamxbox.com site, and others. PC World, while a fine and repuatable source, that particular page is a Blogger's opinion, no more or less valid than the other sites. The threshold for adding information to the article is Wikipedia:Verifiability "The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth. "Verifiable" in this context means that readers should be able to check that material added to Wikipedia has already been published by a reliable source.".

Clearly the information is being published in reputable sources. Presenting "both sides" of the situation may be in order.

Wageslave (talk) 14:42, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

Wageslave is a obsessive disruptive edit troll that normally spends his time hiding any references to the Xbox 360s technical problems. He is also becomes quickly abusive to other editors. Remember to document any abusive editing and insults from him for an upcoming Arbitration against him.--8bitJake (talk) 01:12, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

UNITS SOLD IN JAPAN

you should change the number of units sold in japan becase sony today confirmed that the ps3 has sold 2 million units in a year and a half from release. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.3.114.33 (talk) 19:12, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

Do you have a citation for this?

Wageslave (talk) 19:59, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Chrome Trim on 40GB system as mentioned in the comparison image

It's NOT chrome. it's silver paint. huge difference. one is shiny. one is not. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.255.75.127 (talk) 23:43, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

Beyond the luster of the two, there is certainly no chrome on the PS3. The article should be change to say "silver paint". As "chrome" is not a colour.

Wageslave (talk) 19:58, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

The 60 and 80GB PS3s do not have "silver paint". they are electroplated. the 40GB version does have silver paint. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.255.75.127 (talk) 04:14, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

That is not electroplated, and it certainly isnt chromium plating.

Wageslave (talk) 06:02, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Actually, it is a chrome finish - Frvernchanezzz (talk) 06:05, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Based on my personal inspection, it is not electroplated, nor is it chromium plating chrome.

Perhaps if you can find a citation that says it is chrome, and not "chrome-like" (commonly confusing colour with a process & material...) then we'd be cool. At present, I believe that is inaccurate. And, putting on every instance of "chrome" is unsightly. If you'd like to revert my change, I belive the responsibility would lie with you finding some kind of evidence to support that being included in the article.

Anywho, see what you can do :) Thanks.

Wageslave (talk) 06:09, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Sorry dude, but the onus is on you to find 100% verifiable proof that is in fact not a chrome finish. And no, your "personal inspection" is not even close to being good enough. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 06:12, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Firstly, "100% verifiable proof" isnt how Wikipedia works. Please read this WP:V, it says "The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth". So, no one is required to find "100% verifiable proof" here or anywhere else on Wikipedia.

Secondly, the claim that it *is* chromium electroplating needs a citation or source for this information, your opinion (nor mine) are sufficient to include this fact. Facts without citations are removed.

So, we have really two options. To include at every instance of "chrome" or for whoever thinks it should be "Chrome" (you) and not "silver" (me) to find the citation.

No one wants to see the all over the page, so, we'll just give you some time to support your claims. If you dont choose to do so, wikipedia editors should remove the claim or add the {{Fact}} tags..

Its not a major issue, maybe the regular editors / readers could find it in their regular travels.

thanks! Wageslave (talk) 06:24, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

It's not an issue at all, mate. The "regular editors", as you put it, have had no complaints about it so far - and rightly so. "100% verifiable proof" is indeed how Wikipedia works - the threshold for inclusion is verifiability not truth. You were the one who came here insisting it is not chrome, but you did not bring any verifiable evidence to support your claims. Furthermore, it is verifiable that this is a chrome trim; it's reported all over gaming sites/press/forums.

And even if it isn't an actual electroplated chrome finish (which all sources indicate it is), it most certainly is chrome "coloured". Your changes of "chrome" to "silver" are no better, because it most certainly isn't the mineral silver.

The underlying issue here is that you, as the editor who wants to change a long standing, unopposed section of the article, must bring reliable sources that can be verified, to support those changes - which you have not done; and until you do so, it will continue to say "chrome". Frvernchanezzz (talk) 06:45, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

There is a claim in the article (that it *is* chrome) that has no citation. I'll wait a while and return to add {{Fact}} tags if there arent any citations. Thanks.

Wageslave (talk) 14:22, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Those tags will just be removed since sources are not needed for things that are glaringly obvious, e.g. the sky is blue does not need a citation. You need to provide sources to support your claim that it isn't chrome; and trust me, you won't find any. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 07:12, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Erm, back to the ORIGINAL discussion, the 40GB version of the PS3 does not have a chrome finish like the 60 and 80GB models do. it just has silver paint. could this be corrected in the chart? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.255.75.127 (talk) 00:09, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Yes it could be corrected. You could do it yourself if you know how; I would do it, but to be honest, I've never seen a 40GB version in real life or on the net, so I don't know if it's true. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 07:12, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Wageslave is a obsessive disruptive edit troll that normally spends his time hiding any references to the Xbox 360s technical problems. He is also becomes quickly abusive to other editors. Remember to document any abusive editing and insults from him for an upcoming Arbitration against him.--8bitJake (talk) 01:11, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Just a question...

I know the discussion page is for discussing the article, but if the PS3's ability to read PS2 and PS1 games is based on emulation, does that mean it can read pirated copies?--Axe995 (talk) 05:04, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Nope they won't work. Also we don't really condone piracy on Wikipedia so you shouldn't be asking those types of questions on here. Nintenboy01 (talk) 01:42, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

As far as im aware, Wikipedia neither condones or supports anything. If the PS3 can be used for it, then it would be a fact that should go in the article, as it doesnt, it wont. John.n-IRL 01:49, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

RSX/Cell Processor Chipset Sizes

I posted earlier that as of the 40gb model only the Cell processor uses the 65nm chipset, someone erased my citations and info about how the RSX chipset is still using a 90nm process. DevonTheDude (talk) 06:44, 26 February 2008 (UTC)DevonTheDudeDevonTheDude (talk) 06:44, 26 February 2008 (UTC) My citations were from Kotaku.com

Found more info on the Cell processor shrinking down to 45nm, it will reduce power consumption 40% to to the older 65nm chipset. "Production is due to start in the summer so expect them on the shelves in time for Christmas." There is also a handy graph detailing the differences in power use between 90nm, 65nm, 45nm chipsets. I got all this info from here: http://n4g.com/tech/News-118530.aspx

• Graph of Cell B.E. Power Consumption
  Graph of Cell B.E. Power Consumption

PS3 to get smaller Cell and/or RSX chips in August?

http://www.engadget.com/2008/04/21/ps3-to-get-smaller-cell-and-or-rsx-chips-in-august/

Denzelio (talk) 13:20, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

VERY POOR SALES

i think that its about time that this page should start including the fact that the PS3 has kinda... u now... flopped... or just hasnt achieved any of the success expected.... i mean did u know that the PS3 is steadily outselled by Gameboy advance!!! there was a month (not a lot of time after its release, in 2007... it should sell very good during these months, since it was its launch year) in which it was outselled by all consoles... EVEN BY THE GAMEBOY ADVANCE [2] [3]!!! the game boy advance had sold over 84.000 copies (very good for an 8 year old console) while the PS3 had sold less than 82.000 copies (not good AT ALL for a less than a year console). sad isn't it? up to date the ps3 is still being outselled by all consoles (including the game boy advance)... yes this is kind of TRAGIC news for the PS3 AND Sony... u know something, i live in the United States (Boston) and because im interested in video games i have asked a lot of stores clerks about which consoles sell and which don't. All of the clerks said that the wii selling very fast and that it dissapears immidiently from the shelves. they also say that the xbox360 is selling well but that it is not selling as much as it sold during 2006 and last but not leat they say that playstation 3 isn't selling at all. in my school everybody has a wii and a ds! nobody owns a PS3... furthermore, the wii was crowned as the fastest selling video game console EVER in japan, the united kindom, europe and the United States (just behind the DS... ironic huh?). get used with it! Nintendo has dominated the market weahter u like it or not... ohh... and.. have u heard this.. one very important economic analysist announced that the Wii will sell way more than what the PS3 and the XBOX360 will sell COMBINED during 2008... [4]. ooops... not good news for sony... just reminding u that wii cannot be found anywhere because when the new units arrive in the stores they just vanish... IMMIDIENTLY... demand is MASSIVE for both the wii AND the ds (it is actually so massive that it has well surpassed the produced quantities since its release) which have ultimately dominated the market. all cards have been played and there is no chance for the ps3 or the psp. All these must somehow be written on the ps3 wikipedia page, cause these are FACTS... Not my imagination... check it out wherever u want on the internet... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.203.71.224 (talk) 11:49, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Sales are covered thoroughly in the Sales and production costs section. It's sales performance is compared to both the Wii and the 360 in that section. Wikipedia is not the place to speculate as to whether these figures are better or worse than SCE expected/hoped for. If you can find a press release or a quote somewhere with Sony saying that they are disappointed by the PS3 that that would certainly have a place in the article. Also, you may want to do some research as to how the PS3 is doing outside of the US. Europe in particular. ChimpanzeeUK (talk) 12:11, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Commentary on PS3 sales are not required to come directly from SCE. The industry discussed -- widely -- the PS3's poor sales.

Wageslave (talk) 16:00, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Like I said, the PS3's sales performance is very well documented in the article. I don't see the need to add an opinionated commentary on them. Currently it is impartial and states the facts which is what the article should do. ChimpanzeeUK (talk) 18:31, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Actually, having just read through the article again, I noticed it already says what "87.203.71.224" wants added. I have also just added a bit myself about Sony making a loss on each console sold. Happy? ChimpanzeeUK (talk) 18:55, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

If you had actually even bothered to look into console sales this year you would know that the 360 has moved to third place and the PS3 has taken second place, The PS3 has been outselling the 360 since January, So by no means is the PS3 selling poorly. Perhaps you should place an article in the 360 discussion saying a certain console that had been outsold by the Gameboy Advance on one month, is now outselling their console in every region each week since the start of 2008.Denzelio (talk) 10:46, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

That was a very pathetic attempt at trolling. I would suggest some one delete his comment as it serves no purpose what so ever but to cause arguments. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Butters x (talk • contribs) 21:35, 29 April 2008 (UTC)

obvious troll is obvious--192.249.47.11 (talk) 16:51, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Praise Section

In case a Criticism section was ever added, a Praise section should also be added to equal out the Neutrality. I found some information on the GTA franchise of games.

Sam Houser

Rockstar Games founder

"One of the problems with the 360, and it affects games like Grand Theft Auto if you think about how much content we put in the actual machine, is the fact that they don't have a significantly larger storage medium than the previous systems. It's a slightly bigger DVD disc." http://ps3.kombo.com/article.php?artid=6694

http://www.1up.com/do/feature?cId=3167500

Also due solely to Blu-ray storage capacity GTA 7 will be exclusive to PS3 http://www.hdgamenews.com/2007/10/sony-secures-exclusive-for-grand-theft.html

Denzelio (talk) 11:02, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

The quote from Houser isn't praising the PS3, it is criticizing the 360. And the rumour that the next GTA game will be PS3 exclusive has been debunked. Heavily. Besides, I don't think a praise section would be appropriate. ChimpanzeeUK (talk) 11:40, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

My god, don't you people listen! The point is not to have 'praise' and 'criticism' sections, it is to have a well-constructed reception section. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs ^(talk) 11:43, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Exactly. Also, to the OP, citing a blogger isn't generally accepted. I'd be careful which reports you take as fact. ChimpanzeeUK (talk) 11:46, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Can't blame me for being right wing with a Praise section, after that far out idea of a Criticism section. I just thought I'd at least include one positive for the PS3, being that Developers DO recognize that the PS3 has the largest available storage capacity with Blu-ray and it's potential of for the creation of games(as games get larger not smaller), and systems that don't have the required storage space will eventually be left behind. As noted by a Developer of a well known gaming franchise. again the Reception section is fine the way it is.Denzelio (talk) 15:15, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

I can see why you bought it up but I think David's right: It just needs a well-balanced Reception section. ChimpanzeeUK - User | Talk | Contribs 15:37, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Recognize Blu-Ray as winner of next gen optical media format war.

Change last sentence in paragraph 2 from "and its use of a next-gen optical media, Blu-ray Disc, as its primary storage medium." to:

and its use of the next-gen optical media, Blu-ray Disc, as its primary storage medium. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.74.8.87 (talk) 05:05, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

This wouldn't be accurate. There are other types of next get optical media, it's just that Blu-Ray is now the most popular. HDDVDs still exist, even though they aren't used. ChimpanzeeUK - User | Talk | Contribs 11:07, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

PS3 sales update - Now 13 million worldwide

http://www.themoneytimes.com/news/20080425/sony_plans_new_role_for_playstation_3-id-1021088.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by Beta (talk • contribs) 16:40, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Sounds more like shipped than sold, but it'll do for now until Sony announces something more concrete. --RoyalFool (talk) 18:07, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Criticism Section

Kojima

This article should include some of the criticism people have had of the PS3. At present, there are none.

Of the PS3 Kojima has just said; "But when we actually started developing the game, we realized there were a lot of restrictions and so it turned out how you see it today."

and

"I remember saying three years ago that we wanted to create something revolutionary, but in reality we couldn't really do that because of the CPU. We're using the Cell engine to its limit., actually."

http://kotaku.com/381412/kojima-disappointed-with-metal-gear-solid-4

Carmack

Of the PS3's development environment, John Carmack has said;

"Developers are forced to sweat blood to take advantage of the Cell"

http://kotaku.com/gaming/video/carmack-hates-the-ps3-173732.php

"Xbox 360 has far and away the best development tools," Carmack said. "PS3 is probably marginally more powerful, in terms of raw flops and graphic operations, but that’s not really the best way to look at things. When you look at these development cycles that stretch over years and years, being 20% easier to develop on is much more important than being 20% more powerful."

http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2005/10/18/1556

"But the honest truth is that Microsoft dev tools are so much better than Sony's. We expect to keep in mind the issues of bringing this up on the PlayStation 3... they're not helpful to the developers... I suspect they're not going to overwhelmingly crush the marketplace this time, which wasn't clear a year ago. A lot of people were thinking it's going to be a rerun of the last generation, and it's now looking like it might not be. I've been pulling for Microsoft, because I think they've done a better job for development support, and I think they have made somewhat smarter decisions on the platform. It's not like the PlayStation 3 is a piece of junk or anything. I was not a fan of the PlayStation 2 and the way its architecture was set up. With the PlayStation 3, it's not even that it's ugly—they just took a design decision that wasn't the best from a development standpoint."

http://kotaku.com/gaming/carmack/carmack-prefers-360-to-ps3-227899.php http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200701/N07.0109.1737.15034.htm?Page=3 http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3156329

Newell

Valve's Gabe Newell has said:

"Statements about 'Oh, the PS3 is going to be twice as fast as an Xbox 360' are totally meaningless . It means nothing. It's surprising that game customers don't realize how it treats them like idiots.

http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=510&Itemid=2

Controller Ergonomics, Lack of Features

"PS3 Packs Promise, Lacks Punch" From Wired; "But for ergonomics, I like the Xbox controller better" "Microsoft's controller also includes force feedback, which PS3's lacks. This is a disappointment" "the Friends list is not integrated into games. On the Xbox, if you meet players in an online game, you can add them to your universal buddy list with one click, then invite them to join you in any game. Not on PS3 -- you must maintain separate Friends lists for each game"

http://www.wired.com/gaming/gamingreviews/news/2006/11/72183

Conclusion

In short, I think there needs to be a criticism section. And it should (at least) include the following: Kojima's comments (or others) about performance, Carmacks' (or others) comments about development troubles, lack of in-game Friends Lists and Lack of Custom Soundtracks.

Further, some commentary on the state of the game libary should be included. There is ample commentary on PS3 lacking quality games. I could find links very readily, but this is getting long enough.

These ideas and commentary are widely reported and many citations to these effect can easily be found.

Wageslave (talk) 18:40, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

There are so many well respected people criticizing the system that it seems quite biased NOT to have a section on it.

While I criticism section in itself is not a bad thing, all of these quotes are 1 to 3 years old, and don't accurately reflect the present situation. Lots of developers are now getting the hang of it and are deciding to start with the PS3 before porting to the 360, for their upcoming games.201.248.250.105 (talk) 03:07, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Some of the comments are, however Kojimas are very recent. John.n-IRL 03:34, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Wageslave, get a life. We've all seen your contributions; every edit is an attempt at making the PS3 look bad, and the 360 look good. You edit while misquoting sources, using outdated sources, using no sources, removing sources that criticize Microsoft (not just on 360 pages, but also pages related to Apple). Your actions are enough to warrant an RFC. Please stop. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 05:01, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Your comments are inaccurate and a clear violation of WP:AGF and WP:PA . The sources provided are credible and relevant and meet wikipedia standards. Wageslave (talk) 17:46, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Wageslave, the problem Frvernchanezzz seems to have with your edits is that they seem to have a strong pro-microsoft goal. While often you do use sources, it usually involves ignoring other sources, or ignoring the "bigger picture"(for this I would refer you to your edits at L.A Noire). I would recommend trying to look at your edits from someone else's point of view, just try be more neutral. Sorry if I seem out of order saying this, however I'v seen your edits over the past while and feel this should be said. John.n-IRL 18:39, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

My goals are completeness, accuracy and neutral-POV. Please, WP:AGF and WP:PA. The material I've provided here meet Wikipedia standards, they should be included. Wageslave (talk) 19:07, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

My comments were not meant as a personal attack, and assume good faith does not mean stand by while you feel that an editors edits are detrimental to the quality of a page. While I do not doubt that your goals are as you said, I do not feel that your edits reflect this. Either way, if you wish to continue this discussion I will do so at your talk page. As for the proposed section on the PS3 article, I would suggest that what is here is not recent enough or have enough substance for inclusion in the main PS3 article. Kojimas comments are more suited to the MGS4 article. John.n-IRL 19:16, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

What wikipedia policy requires "recent"? Wageslave (talk) 19:51, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Depends on the context its being used in, certainly for this particular issue the time of a comment is of great importance, since many issues seem to have since been addressed. John.n-IRL 21:07, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Wageslave is not well intentioned, if you look at their edits will se large Fanboyism with LOTS of disruptive edits. My vote for reject his proposed section. --Ciao 90 (talk) 17:46, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Just try to ignore his ramblings, man. But if you see an edit that is blatantly obvious POV, or original research, then it is within your rights to revert him. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 05:47, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

This argument is a ad hominem attack. A violation of WP:AGF and WP:PA. The material provided is clearly within the goals of wikipedia. Relevant, verifiable and neutral.

Wageslave (talk) 18:07, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Kojima, Carmack and Newell are luminaries in the industry, I think their comments deserve inclusion here. Perhaps a "criticism" section is unnecessary (and, i've recently seen note that "criticism" as a section is frowned upon by policy (which seems agreeable)). Perhaps in the "reception" or "software" sections.

I would like to ask the editors to include these three points; A) Kojima's comments about the PS3, B) Carmacks' comments about the Development Environment and C) Newell's comments.

Of C, you may like to review his comments here; http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/10/11/gabe-newell-calls-ps3-waste-of-everybodys-time/ http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/08/25/gabe-newell-trashes-ps3s-cell-architecture/ http://kotaku.com/gaming/ps2/newell-on-ps3-a-total-disaster-228789.php

These are three industry heavy weights who've been critical of the architecture, ability and development environment. The article should have these included in order to meet neutral-POV.

Wageslave (talk) 19:12, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Do not include a criticism section. This is almost always a bad thing leading to lots of fighting, and moreover, and more importantly, is not a good way to include criticism. The right way to include the criticisms above is to add them to the relevant section, for example, Hardware. User:Krator (t c) 07:41, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

The fact is, the article does have a "Reception" section. Criticism should be added as part of the prose in that section. It doesn't take a genius to realise that Carmack, Kojima and Newell's comments are valid in this section dealing with (initial) reception. The only real question is whether their comments add anything of value to the article. The only one I would consider to be worthwhile is Carmack's commentary that the development tools of the PS3 were lacking, which ties in to Newell's commentary. Ong elvin (talk) 08:49, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

A reception section is absolutely necessary for any article. Some of the above are correct in stating the comments might be out of date, but that doesn't mean that they can't be incorporated into the first part of reception. I would say this is important and merits inclusion, and I don't see what the fuss is about; everyone knows the PS3 got horrible press out of the gate, but the reception section mentions it has made a comeback now (although this should be stressed more- right now it reads in a fuzzy, nonlinear fashion, which isn't good for gauging actual reactions.) Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs ^(talk) 11:43, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Do not even consider a pointless 'Criticism' Section unless you will add one to Nintendo Wii and the Xbox 360 at the same time. Does anyone even care about these meager statements, selectively chosen while the console is still in it's infancy and not yet thoroughly explored and used to it's true potential, evidently when that day arrives there will be only praise and at that time will you want to add a 'Praise' for PS3 section.. The article already includes criticism in the First Section also within 'Launch', 'Sales and production costs' and 'Reception'. There is no need for another Criticism section.Denzelio (talk) 13:07, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Listen to yourself. I can't speak for the editor who brought this up and his bias, but WP:OTHERCRAPEXISTS is not a reason to not improve this article in accordance to WP:NPOV; this is a featured article, and therefor should be held to a high standard in terms of comprehensiveness. Apparently, fanboys on this page keep on screwing up the reception, so once again it needs a makeover. The indisputeable facts are that the gaming and industry press lambasted the PS3 when it first came out, and found that its architecture were hard to work with. Now, with Blu-Ray winning the format war, perception has turned more favorable (witness EGM's "BattleStation!" article, and later on the 'return of the PS3' piece.) But this reception section doesn't do an adequate job of summarizing either end of the spectrum. I'm on the border of POV tagging or bringing it to FAR. The point is not to create a criticism section, its to make the article more rounded and comprehensive. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs ^(talk) 13:16, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

I like your comment more rounded and comprehensive, If you read the comments you will see they are all Negative, all to one end of the spectrum. With criticism already present in my 4 previously mentioned sections, wouldn't you instead be trying to balance the article with Pro comments, Truly their is no section that outlines the PS3 is the most Technological System(Pro comment). Besides if you add yet another Criticism area i fear the fanboys will start another editing war, Isn't that what you are trying to avoid. Lastly what is wrong with the reception there are 3 negative paragraphs and 3 positive paragraphs, to avoid another editing war they need to stay equal, therefor the old 3 will need to be replaced with these comments, besides who has more of a reputation respectable magazines or a single developer who easily speaks POV, Wikipedia will be lowering it's standards to choose a developers comment possibly containing POV' or not over that of a more respectable magazine that always remains neutral, Reception is better the way it is.Denzelio (talk) 13:57, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Developers are important people, and their comments should be noted. I'm not saying that we should only be adding the above criticism; unfortunately, FAs often come under the "i'm done here" phenomenon. I think the entire article needs to checked through and updated, in particular the reception, as it does not adequately deal with the crappy reception at launch and subsequent "revival" for lack of a better word. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs ^(talk) 14:31, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

The chosen developer's comments were all worded heavily on the side of POV as well as not only leaning towards but mentioning Microsoft frequently which would be out of place under a PlayStation 3 article, and could only exist in a 360 vs PS3 article. Kojima's comments were not criticism as the PS3 in terms of Storage and CPU power was the only option so he just set his standards to high, therefor that comment wouldn't go under Criticism, basically 50GB of Storage space still not enough and the CPU hasn't been fully explored so you can't say with our first game we already fully mapped the PS3s potential(therefor criticism).I agree every so often the article should be updated and checked, Positive and negative comments should remain equal to avoid editing wars. These comments are all heavily POV centered and including them would only create a pro-longed editing war, Being just developers comments how long would they remain current for before becoming outdated not long at all, not to mention they aren't from a respectable source like a magazine and are basically worded like I prefer 360 or PS3, they would need to be centered only around the PS3(PS3 article), like Kojima's were but that comment was not criticism. These developer comments mentioned could only exist in a 360 vs PS3 article and should not be used.Denzelio (talk) 15:23, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Just putting in my two cents. I think criticism is useful in the reception section so long as the criticism comes from NPOV sources. Obviously a criticism from Nintendo would not be neutral. A criticism from a prominent game developer who develops for multiple systems would be extremely valuable though. What if that developer had a falling out with Sony? No clue. There's no bright line test for this. But I see no reason why Carmack (who knows his hardware and game technology extremely well) should not be included as part of the reception. Especially since game developers are a powerful driving force for whether a console succeeds or fails. Arguably, PSX succeeded because N64 did such a poor job responding to what game developers wanted (CDs, low development costs, more developmental freedom) and now PS3 has failed to recognize why they succeeded in the first place. But that's just my personal opinion on the PS3 and shouldn't change the need for a robust "reception" section that includes both positives and negatives. Randomran (talk) 19:06, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Nintendo I wouldn't consider to be completely neutral, since they're competing in the console market, albeit indirectly by targeting a different market. But I think Randomran puts forth a good point. Third party developers can be considered neutral (or at least almost neutral) because in the end they are not directly tied to any console company. Carmack I think should especially be considered an authority on hardware. Ever since the days of Commander Keen, he has created games that regularly demand powerful hardware to run them. Denzelio, even though this isn't a PS3/X360 comparison article, the fact remains that X360 competes directly with the PS3. Comparison is inevitable, and I believe it would be wrong to leave it out completely. Such comparisons fit better in the PS3 article than the X360 article. Why? Put simply, the X360 was released first. The market got to try the X360 first. When new products come out, people compare them to previous products; you can't compare it to a product that hasn't been released yet. Ong elvin (talk) 02:38, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Comparing this article to the Wii, XBox360, GameCube, and Playstation 2 seems to lead credence to WP:POV issues with this article. I suggest that criticism and technical issues sections are warrented based off of a bit of secondary research.Nmourfield (talk) 20:48, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

June 2008 80GB version

Two separate local retailers are telling me that there's a new 80BG version of the PS3 coming out in a bundle package with a game (I can't remember which one they said now) in June 2008. I'd like to add it to the article, but I don't know where I'd find a reputable online source for the information to properly cite it for this article. —scarecroe (talk) 20:26, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Region-Free

Should have a note about its region-based restrictions, with the word "region-free" in there to make it easy to CTRL+F. --68.161.161.206 (talk) 05:13, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

PS3 as Blu-ray player

The New York Times Technology columnist, in a story comparing Blu-Ray players, noted that the PS3 has the features of third-generation players, but costs much less. Somebody should add this (my computer won't show the bot-guard) to the page, and I'll make sure any player comparison pages include the PS3. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.69.118.1 (talk) 22:34, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

New America sales total of 4 million

http://blog.wired.com/games/2008/04/can-grand-theft.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.125.22.179 (talk) 12:50, 29 April 2008 (UTC)

New Australia PS3 sales total - 238K

http://au.gamespot.com/news/6190304.html

Denzelio (talk) 07:36, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Technical Problems

There should be a Technical Problem info...as the PS3 has had its shares of complaints...i am one of them......as my PS3 just stoped working....other peoples's wont read any disc's ect. Sidinayarak (talk) 23:07, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

So should EVERY consumer electonic item, as there will always be SOME failures. There should only be a technical problems section, if there are notable techical problems (like the 360 RROD), PS3 has no such problems, with 13m consoles shipped, the failure rate is still well below 1% —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.174.171.21 (talk) 11:35, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

Australia/NZ 40GB PS3

This version has PS2 backwards compatibility through software emulation... you download the patch for it from the PS Store. If someone could find a source, and add it to the article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 125.237.172.55 (talk) 07:56, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

As far as I know, this isn't true. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 10:04, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

Retail configurations

According to Sony, http://www.us.playstation.com/PS3/Hardware, the 80GB version is NOT avaiable for purchase right now. That would make it a "NO" for 'in production'. Whether or not they are going to start making them again with some changes or a new marketing scheme is a future issue which can be addressed by adding a new column. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Joltima (talk • contribs) 07:38, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

If you demand that the 80GB should be "YES", then the 60GB needs to be "YES" as well, due to information by Sony, http://www.us.playstation.com/ps3/about/specs. They removed the 20GB information, so it can be confirmed that the 20GB is discontinued. I doubt there can be any arguement to this. Both 60GB and 80GB need to be the same for 'in production'.

Reference 48

Insufficient information based on Bloomberg. This only applies to Japan and not to the United States. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Joltima (talk • contribs) 08:02, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Recent New INfomation about Number of PS3's sold

At the recent Sony Playstation Day London '08 Head of SCEE David Reeves announced that; The ps3 had outsolde the Xbox 360 in europe. It's sales in europe now amount to 5 million not the 2.8 million quoted in the article. This brings the total worldwide sales to around 15.2 million though an exact amount will be detailed in Tokyo next week

All info can be found at eurogamer - [5] Just a simple number update - Killthemonkeys Hope this is how you are supposed to do it I could not find an edit link on ht eactual page --Killthemonkeys (talk) 19:51, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

Loads of articles seem to be saying the same thing:

http://www.gamershell.com/news_49966.html

http://www.psxextreme.com/ps3-news/3025.html

http://blogs.theage.com.au/screenplay/archives/009416.html

http://palgn.com.au/article.php?id=11368&sid=a0d5f62072534b52de04cd70f2d68a14&title=PlayStation+Day+08%3A+PS3+eclipses+Xbox+360+sales+in+Europe

http://www.g4tv.com/thefeed/blog/post/685214/Europe_PS3_Outsells_360.html

http://www.totalvideogames.com/news/PlayStation_Day_Report_13183_3307_0.htm

Sales as of 31/12/2007:

PSP: 34 million, PS3: 10.5 million, PS2: 127 million

—Preceding unsigned comment added by Beta (talk • contribs) 00:27, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

Hardware/Firmware Censorship?

Supposedly there's some sort of censorship that can be put into effect on specific consoles. Prime example would be Uncharted where its also mentioned. Should it also be mentioned here? --Vylen (talk) 13:28, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

Which Joker thinks this is funny?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Playstation3vector.svg If you scroll down to the descriptions you will see this: "The $600+ paperwieght is shown here... along with the stylish lettering from the "Spiderman" movies."

You will also notice that this is the main picture of the Article (the one on the very left as the article loads) Thus it is prominently displayed.

Now I might be a wikinoob but I know that S. Solberg J.'s description of the PS3 is very un-NPOV. Can someone take note of this and do something about it. Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.1.217.95 (talk) 18:21, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

I can't see what you're talking about, sorry. Could you be more specific perhaps? The Vandal Warrior (talk) 18:27, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

Theres a summary under the picture in the link and reads: The $600+ paperwieght is shown here... along with the stylish lettering from the "Spiderman" movies. The picture is featured in the ps3 article prominently. I happen to own a PS3 & I find that really offensive. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.1.217.95 (talk) 19:09, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

File information

Description	A 60GB version of the PlayStation 3.
Source	Self-made
Date	8 April 2007
Author	S. Solberg J.
Permission (Reusing this file)

That's the summary. It's not there. The Vandal Warrior (talk) 19:14, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

I think he meant the vandalism on the image's original location at Wikimedia Commons, which was reverted at 12:47, 2 May 2008 (UTC). --Silver Edge (talk) 05:08, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

Thank you Silver Edge. 82.57.176.205 (talk) 17:59, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

Sales numbers

I reverted it back to the 12.81 million number because those were official numbers from Sony that were released today (May 14) from the financial year ending March 31. I think it's better to use Sony's most recent numbers, rather than that other source, who most likely rounded up to get the 13 million figure anyway. I don't think it's a very reliable source as they don't even state where their numbers come from. But if you wanna revert, I won't start an edit war. I just think it's better to use Sony's numbers than some random website. Frvernchanezzz (talk) 13:27, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Sony sells 12.85 million PS3s

http://ps3.thegamereviews.com/story-947-Global-Playstation-3-Sales-Near-13-Million-.html

http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/technology/2008/05/14/sony_triples_profits_but_playstation_3_is_still_losing_money.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.203.141.224 (talk) 18:11, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

I was gonna comment on that blog, but it said comments are closed. So I'm posting my opinion here: "That's really only because the 40 GB Playstation 3s that have been out for a while now. No PS2 games can be played on those *ahem* [new] Playstation 3s. Although in June, we hope that to change." 71.90.128.212 (talk) 21:10, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

References

{{reflist|colwidth=25em}} really needed???--Kozuch (talk) 11:05, 17 May 2008 (UTC)