Talk:List of rivers of Scotland

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Which is right? I have included the tables from both the Brit and the Scottish sites. There seem to be descrepancies, in the case of the Don and the Tay.

	River	Length (miles)	(km)
1	River Severn	220	354
2	River Thames	215	346
3	River Trent	185	297
4	River Aire	161	259
5	River Great Ouse	143	230
6	River Wye	135	215
7	River Tay	117	188
8	River Spey	107	172
9	River Nene	100	161
10	River Clyde	98	158
11	River Tweed	96	155
12	River Eden, Cumbria	90	145
13	River Dee, Aberdeenshire	85	137
14	River Avon, Warwickshire	84	136
15	River Don, Aberdeenshire	80	129
16	River Bann	76	122
17	River Ribble	75	120
18	River Tyne	73	118
19	River Tees	70	113
20	River Dee, Wales	70	112

By length

The ten major rivers of Scotland, in order of length, are:

1. River Tay 193 km (120 miles)
2. River Spey 172 km (107 miles)
3. River Clyde 171 km (106 miles)
4. River Tweed 156 km (97 miles)
5. River Dee 137 km (85 miles)
6. River Don 132 km (82 miles)
7. River Forth 105 km (65 miles)
8. River Findhorn 101 km (63 miles)
9. River Deveron 98 km (61 miles)
10. River Annan 79 km (49 miles)

--MacRusgail 20:44, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

EB suggests 120 miles (193km) for the Tay [1], 82 miles (132km) for the Don [2], 106 miles (170km) for the Clyde [3]... In fact, EB appears to agree with all the figures from the Geography of Scotland page.

The results are both contingent on e.g whether or not estuaries are included and the above is unsourced. I looked at various stats and unsurprisingly there are differences in measurement, as acknowledged here and there in the Collins Encyclopedia of Scotland, which does not provide a comprehensive listing.

• "Source 1" is the existing unsourced list.
• "Source 2" is the Gazetteer for Scotland (2016) which is supported by the School of GeoSciences, University of Edinburgh and The Royal Scottish Geographical Society
• "Source 3" is Almanac of Scotland which states "All measurements have been recalculated using data supplied by the Scottish Environmental Protection Agency (SEPA) and ordnance survey maps as published in August 2010. Data obtained from this page prior to September 2010 is obsolete and should not be used." It is not clear who the author(s) are.

All the below are in km.

River	Source 1 Length	Source 2 Length	Source 3 Detail	Source 3 Length
River Tay	188	191	TAY-TUMMEL-GAUR	184.9
River Clyde	176	170	Clyde	168.4
River Spey	172	160	Spey	168.6
River Tweed	156	155	Tweed	161.8
River Dee	137	154	Dee	142.7
River Don	132	131	Don	134.9
River Nith	112	112	Nith	100.8
River Findhorn	101	99	Findhorn	103.2
River Deveron	98	98	Deveron	100.2
River Annan	79	78	Annan	78.3
River Forth	105	63	Forth	135.7
River Ness	Not included	10	NESS-OICH-GARRY	108.9
River Beauly	Not included	26	BEAULY-GLASS-AFFRIC	93.4
River Conon	Not included	19	Conon	88.3
River Dee, Galloway	Not included	19	DEE-KEN-WATER OF DEUCH	88.0
River Lochy	Not included	No data	Lochy-Spean	86.9
River South Esk, Angus	Not included	79	South Esk	84.8

Complications: Source 3 notes for the Forth that measurement is to the "Firth of Forth at the easternmost point of Inch Garvie by the Forth Bridge" whereas Source 2 stops at the tidal waters near Stirling. Our article states that the river is 47km long but provides no source.

Part of the Tweed is in England, which source 3 notes but all seem to ignore for measurement purposes.

It is clear that Source 2 is not using 'from source to sea' measurements, but rather the length of the river that is called 'River x' e.g. "the Beauly River is formed by the meeting of the River Glass and the River Farrar at Struy" and ignores any upstream length. Source 3 however is explicitly from source to sea (and in the case of the Forth perhaps a bit more besides).

Lists:

• All agree that the Tay is longest.
• Source 2 has the Clyde as second longest and the Spey third, but Source 3 reveres the order.
• All agree the Tweed is 4th and the northern Dee 5th but then things get complicated with different orders depending on where the Forth lies, and the inclusion or otherwise of the Highland rivers and southern Dee provided by source 3.

Luckily Source 3 provides fairly detailed notes which help explain some matters such as the Forth/Tay comparison used. It also explains some Source 2 anomalies e.g. why have the Beauly exclude upstream tributaries but not e.g. the Findhorn, which name is not that of its headwater streams? I have posted a new table in the article using Source 3 data which appears to be the most comprehensive and consistent source, although its credentials may be weaker than Source 2.

Arguably the article could include a third definition and listing for 'only that part of the course that is called River x' - it may be possible to obtain this from source 3 with careful examination. Ben MacDui 07:45, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

Island sections

I have added a few more of the largest watercourses in Orkney, Shetland and Lewis and separated out into island groups. I was going to delete the reference to Mill Dam Burn on Shapinsay as being utterly insignificant - in a list of rivers of Scotland - but haven't - the accompanying image would need to go to. Is there any good reason to keep it? Geopersona (talk) 06:21, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

I think the photo should go anyway - it is not at all representative of the article (though fine for the Mill Dam article). Anyone got anything to replace it that would fit the bill? cheersGeopersona (talk) 05:30, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Catchments

Following the approach taken in the companion List of rivers of Wales I have divided the list into various catchments to aid navigation around it. Hope folks find this agreeable. Geopersona (talk) 19:07, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

I'm now in course of adding more rivers to the list, working my way up the east coast. Some surprisingly big ones had previously been omitted. Geopersona (talk) 20:49, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

Have now done most of the additions of river catchments anticlockwise around the coast from Berwick to Mull of Kintyre and, due to the larger number of entries, have found it necessary to sub-divide the pre-existing sections to aid navigation within the list. I've attempted to make the divisions sensible ones from a geographical perspective - others may be able to suggest an improved way to achieve these ends. cheers Geopersona (talk) 13:53, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

Completed to Gretna. Geopersona (talk) 20:55, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

What to include and what to leave out?

Please see the discussion Small streams - where do we draw the line? A proposal on the talk page at List of rivers of Wales. It is pertinent to this page too and its English equivalent. thanks Geopersona (talk) 08:12, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

This page has proved very useful. Is the data available somewhere to add a listing by discharge volume?

New map?

List of rivers of England boasts a new map by Notuncurious whom I have asked on that article's talk page whether a similar map for this article might be possible. It would be good to have a map which portrays rivers more clearly - the current map wasn't constructed to serve the role it finds itself in. Geopersona (talk) 05:22, 17 December 2010 (UTC)