Talk:Android (robot)/Archive 2

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Archive 1 Archive 2

Ambiguity & Androids in Fiction sections need cleanup

These sections contain several duplicative entries. Jon 18:45, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

I will try to clean up the Ambiguity section in the next few weeks. Can we agree to limit the lists of fictional androids to 4 or 5 per section? There is a separate article for that after all, the list of fictional robots. Robotman1974 19:33, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Merge with Bio-Androids

I vote no. -- Macmelvino 02:19, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

I also vote no, in fact I feel more android sections should exist for the variations on the main theme such as nanobot (liquid metal) androids and other vartiations.

  • I vote yes. Seeing as how all these android variations are purely fictional, and can only have fictional references, they hardly merit seperate articles. The future existence of Bio-Androids and Nanobots is also far from certain, whereas work is being done already to produce electromechanical androids. I think it will suffice that the other types be mentioned as variations of fictional androids within a single article. Robotman1974 06:28, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Also vote yes. Even if they exist, bio android are only a variation of androids. And about anonymous comment, nanorobots also would merge, but that doesn't change my opinnion.

—Nethac DIU, would never stop to talk here—
20:19, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

  • I also would have to vote yes. Radagast83 15:40, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
I have merged Bio Android into this article. After more than 5 weeks, the votes were 3 merge and 2 don't merge. No convincing arguments were given against the merge. Also, I have removed some entries from the "Androids in fiction" section of this article as they were duplicated in what is now the "Bio androids" section. Robotman1974 19:30, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Someone must make a note somewhere that "Robot" in Polish means SLAVE. In the years since RUR was written, the word ROBOT has lost the meaning SLAVE, and now refers to a machine created to do work, and not an artificial man.

I vote no because I think bioandroids(or any kind of biorobot) are cyborgs. I say that because I actually work with cybernetics. - Yes, he is right.

Metropolis

Just curious, but why doesn't Metropolis (film) get a nod in the fiction section? As far as I know, it is the first mention of android (rather, gynoid) in film; it's pretty much where the idea came from.

192.153.24.130 19:32, 21 September 2006 (UTC)-

Usage of the term/notion of "Android"

I have the Online Etymological Dictionary referencing but not actually citing a usage of "Android" from 1727. It also translates (I think) that usage as meaning "automaton resembling a human being." This could be significant to understanding from where this usage much earlier than the one offered in the wiki-article comes. Does anyone know where this usage is citable, and whether it occurs any other time(s) between then and the 1880s? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by PhilosophyMonkey (talk • contribs) 18:17, 25 November 2006.


Yes - I just found an 1883 US patent for "Androides or Automation Shoe Factory" where the "Androides" are mechanical factory workers with human appearance. This predates Villiers' 1886 novel L'Ève future. See [1] Cbaer 17:02, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Lists

The fiction lists in this article need to be cut down or removed entirely IMHO. There are already separate articles for collecting such info, such as List of fictional robots and androids. Robotman1974 17:32, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

I'll agree with this, provisionally: let's leave here any androids that can be considered in some way seminal or pivotal, such as Maria, Otho, Data, and the humanoid Cylons.BobGreenwade 18:07, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

Androïd was a current word in French in the 18th century. There is for instance an article in Diderot and d'Alembert's Encyclopedia with the heading Androïd, signed by Diderot himself, that discusses Vaucanson's automatons. Knutel 10:46, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

Picture

Hey just a thought, would anyone have an objection if the picture of Jude Law was changed to one of Data from Star Trek the Next Generation? The trivia section allready lists him as probably the most famous android in fiction and to be fair Jude Law's character is hardly as well known or recognisable as an android. --150.101.103.208 06:39, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

I don't see a problem with that. ConnertheCat 22:16, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

When is an android not an android?

Is it when it's a Humanoid robot? Merge anyone? Or am I missing something? Tree Kittens 07:56, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

An android is a completely artificial autonomous robot that resembles a human/humanoid. Ran4 (talk) 21:36, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
It may not need to be completely artifical, but if it is controlled by a natural human brain it is almost certainly a cyborg.
There are some edge cases. I would probably call RoboCop an android, since despite being controlled by a natural human brain, said brain operates in conjunction with a computer with ability to override decisions from the brain.
There are also significant questions of how closely it must resemble a human to qualify as an android. Obviously being visually insitinguishible would qualify it. But general usage would qualify things as clearly non-human as C3PO as an Android But Asimo is merely humanoid.
I personally tend to think of androids as robots that aesthetically resemble humans rather closely, but not attempting to pass for a human. Thus CP30 and the android shown in the first picture of this page immediately trigger the word android, while Trek's Data, and the "Actroid" would not immediately trigger the term android for me (although I would not dispute the terms appropriateness), but I suspect that has something to do with the particular set of SF I've read. Hope this might help 129.74.229.20 (talk) 01:13, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

He/She vs It

Eh...

I have issue with use of the term "he" or "she" when describing androids. The paragraphs concerning the EveR series make use of "her" a number of times, and, for me, really give of a strong POV vibe. I'd rather not make the change to make it a lot less NPOV in case some consensus had been reached previously of which I am not aware, but I thought I'd bring it up anyways. Magaroja 17:35, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree, as of yet there is no consensus regarding gender use in robotics. "it" should be used instead.Ran4 (talk) 21:34, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

I would think 'android' might as well be rooted in the idea of androgeny(my guess w/o a reference), and therefore an android would be considered gender non-specific. I believe a mandroid is considered a modified android with male modifications, while a femandroid has entirely different modifications. --Neptunerover (talk) 03:48, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Change of direction for this article

Given the rapid progress in making real androids, should this article now focus on them, and move fictional androids to their own separate article? There is certainly enough information about current projects to make a full article on its own. Damburger 06:39, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

I'd vote hell no —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.173.89.190 (talk) 22:24, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
I like this idea. The article could be split into two, one dealing with fictional androids, and would fall into the "science fiction" genre, and one with real androids, which would be in the engineering/ technology/ science genre. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Callivert (talk • contribs) 12:07, 10 November 2009 (UTC)
I'm setting my calendar to revisit this issue . . . in 2025. 98.82.3.114 (talk) 17:24, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

Androids are not necessarily robots

The article states flatly that an android is a sort of robot. This isn't correct. Androids can be robots, but they don't have to be.

A robot, as the term is usually used, implies the ability to sense and respond to its environment. Early android makers created elaborate clockwork dolls that imitated human beings wonderfully but were (being clockwork) completely oblivious to their environment. 4.246.245.97 (talk) 04:04, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

That's a very good point. Do you have any suggestions for re-wording the opening sentence? How about "An android is a machine, robot[1], or synthetic organism[2] designed to look and act like a human." if there are no objections to this wording, I'll change it. (I'll check back in a couple of days).Callivert (talk) 04:17, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

Redefining the terms robot, android and cyborg

I was always somewhat confused about the various definitions of these terms. For example, Data on Star Trek TNG calls himself an android, but I'm convinced that Data is a humanoid robot (i.e. a mechanical entity with a power supply, an iridium sponge brain or neural net, hydraulics, designed to resemble a human being and having artifical intelligence, able to power down via the hidden on/off switch). An android (see Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?) is a biological creation with organic parts and systems resembling a human and having human-like intelligence. The only difference between an android and a human being in this circumstance is gestation/growth/maturity span and lifespan, or possibly lack of DNA. A cyborg is part human and part mechanical, which would make anyone who's had a hip replaced with a titanium joint is a cyborg.

So, here are the definitions I propose:

1. Robot: a mechanical artificially intelligent creation that may or may not resemble a human. 2. Humanoid robot: a mechanical artificially intelligent creation that intentionally resembles a human. 3. Android: a biological entity 'designed' to resemble a human and having some degree of intelligence. 4. Cyborg: part biological and part mechanical entity, may resemble a human, but not necessarily. 5. Droid: Star Wars mechanical entity with intelligence, may resemble a human, may resemble a wastebasket or vacuum cleaner.

Anyway, that's what I think about this and I'm sticking to it.

Regards, Sxfield (talk) 04:13, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Aiko

Maybe we should add something for the new Android, Aiko? :) 99.255.44.133 (talk) —Preceding undated comment was added at 14:36, 13 December 2008 (UTC).

First android?

This article states that the first android was created by "Intelligent Robotics Lab" a Japanese company. I challange this. The reason I challange this is that we first need a proper definition of what is and what makes an android. If it is "a robot that looks and acts human" then this machine does not qualify. I say that the World's first android has not yet been created. Surely a true android is something akin to Data (Star Trek) and not simply a robot that is designed to interact simply based on a complex set of instruction. I think that an android is something that can pass as a human to most people, not something that merely is shapped like a human and can speak in a human voice.

Comments? fr33kman -s- 01:56, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

I removed the claim, but for a different reason. The gynoid article claims 1986 was the first crude female android, with a cite - if this is disputed (and i wouldn't be suprised if it was, considering the uses it was put to), then citations need to show this. At the moment, there is no evidence against it, and no ecidence for the Intelligent Robotics claim.YobMod 10:16, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

you're setting the bar too high. If you take "looks and acts human" to mean human IN EVERY WAY - in the style of, say, Data from Star Trek, then no such thing will be created in the foreseeable future. I think people accept that rudimentary androids will have a limited behavioural repertoire. Callivert (talk) 10:59, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

Defining android as "a robot that looks and acts human" and loosely defining what it means to look or act human allows for the evolution of the subject, without wrecking the general class definition.TrueAndroids (talk) 17:41, 24 February 2010 (UTC)TrueAndroids

Android: needs disambiguation

"Android" is new operating system which Google is created for mobile phones Regards - Mukesh. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 116.73.43.160 (talk) 03:29, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

Should add a disambiguation page linking to this page and to the Android OS page Market1G (talk) 15:16, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


Curiosity

What if, u put a face recognition android in front of a mirror ???

Who know answer. Bye —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.40.121.109 (talk) 02:01, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Well it would have stored images of its face. It would have its name, associated with the face. Then it would match the two and output. ]] (talk) 17:34, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

Terminology

What would the animal equivalent of an android be? K-9 might be a caninoid and there are robo-cats. Jackiespeel (talk) 18:52, 10 February 2010 (UTC)

That's a good question, but as far as I know there isn't a word for it. "animaldroid" or something might do the trick, but I think wikipedia should avoid coining new words. So if we wanted to make a page on that topic, we'd probably have to call it something prosaic and dull like "robots that resemble animals". Callivert (talk) 23:18, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

Even if K-9 is discounted as purely fictional, there are Animatronics and 'spy-fly-bots' to add to the cats. Anyone wishing to develop the concept and devise a suitable term which can be imported to WP? Jackiespeel (talk) 19:00, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

Android Consciousness

Ultimately, androids will logically be sorted into unconscious and conscious androids as has been done in AI (weak/strong).Also I added an external link to a youtube channel collection of android videos. I hope this is ok.TrueAndroids (talk) 04:36, 22 February 2010 (UTC)TrueAndroids

The link doesnt really fit in with external link policy, and should be left out (under Conflict of interest, neutrality / reliability, social website / web 2.0, etc. Videos placed by notable neutral sources could be ok, but the link should be to the original source. Clovis Sangrail (talk) 03:14, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

Not an android

There's a picture of Brent Spiner wearing white makeup, but the article says he's an android!129.139.1.68 (talk) 13:34, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Propose rename page to: Android (robot)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.

Android OS gets 5x as many hits as this page, and would probably get 20x more hits if Android wasn't the first hit when searching (obviously most people want to learn about Android OS).

I suggest the first page should be a disambiguation page or Android OS (with a link on top to Android (Robot) and Android disambiguation). If we want to be a service to our readers we should have the most common searched item come up first. What do you think? Thx, Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 17:39, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

The relevant guideline is WP:PT. I am not convinced that the OS, not the robot, is indeed the persistent primary topic for this search term. The interest in operating systems is relatively transient - Android OS had very little traffic one year ago and might have much less traffic again in a few years when other systems have become more popular. The "robot" meaning, in contrast, is likely to remain of interest for the foreseeable future.  Sandstein  20:02, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
The guideline doesn't mention persistent. A year from now we can expect Android OS to have an even higher multiple than it does now. If in 50 years from now it loses its popularity, then the OS page should be de-emphasized. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 20:36, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
I agree with Daniel.Cardenas, that atleast for the next few years, Android is a very popular term and refers to the OS that exists and is in high demand, whereas Android robots are mainly fictional at this stage, as the current state-of-the-art humanoid robots are more likely to be referred to as robots rather than androids. Shervinemami (talk) 15:35, 29 May 2010 (UTC)
Android OS is a brand; android (robot) is the actual word itself that the brand derives from. I'm sure Apple the company gets more hits than apple the fruit, too, but "apple" goes to a description of the fruit. It's exactly the same situation here. If the entry for "apple" gets modified to "apple (fruit)" so that people looking for the company don't get confused, then there'd be a more convincing case for changing the name of this page.124.168.215.244 (talk) 13:01, 1 July 2010 (UTC)
That analogy is not very similar. The fruit has been around for thousands of years, fictional human robots haven't been around that long and are not as important as the fruit that everyone eats. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 16:16, 1 July 2010 (UTC)
  • The page has now been moved, and Android now redirects to the disambiguation page. That leaves about 700 other Wikipedia articles that contains links to "Android" that now need to be checked individually and fixed to take readers to the correct article. --R'n'B (call me Russ) 12:30, 15 August 2010 (UTC)
Can you set up a bot to fix this or give pointers on how to set up a bot to fix it? I would just have the links go to (robot). Thanks, Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 17:33, 15 August 2010 (UTC)
Not really. The problem preventing a bot from fixing the links is the same problem that led to the renaming in the first place: editors who created links to Android may have meant the OS, or some other meaning, rather than a robot. Consider, for example, the following sentence in AOL Instant Messenger (which, at this moment, happens to be the first article on the "what links here" list):
Stand-alone official AIM client software includes advertisements and is available for Microsoft Windows, Windows Mobile, Mac OS, Mac OS X, iPhone OS, Android, BlackBerry OS, and Linux.
If we "fixed" that link to Android (robot) it would be even more wrong than it already is.  :-) Editors have to look at each link in context to determine what was intended. You can, however, look at WP:DPL#How to help for pointers on how to fix ambiguous links correctly and efficiently. --R'n'B (call me Russ) 19:57, 15 August 2010 (UTC)
P.S. One thing that occurs to me, though, is that Androids could possibly be redirected to Android (robot) rather than to the disambiguation page. I doubt anyone searching for information about the OS would use the plural form, although there is still the band and possibly other meanings to consider. --R'n'B (call me Russ) 19:59, 15 August 2010 (UTC)
(ec) Next time perhaps a little note to the interested projects would not go amiss ??
Nothing on here would ever convince me that the OS is the primary topic. The problem here is that Android is not just robots, it also covers synthetic organisms, and Android (robot) is not really correct. It is ridiculous that the Android can have been hijacked in this way. Irregardless of search numbers the fact is that idf a company names its phone "The Robot" are you going to tell me that it also should be made into "Robot (robot)"?. Android OS should redirect to Android (operating system) as should Android (phone) etc. Android should have been set as one of the vital articles of Robotics.
Chaosdruid (talk) 21:35, 15 August 2010 (UTC)


So is there an easier fix for androids, like a bot, or should it be done manually for the 40 or so links. Thx, Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 21:20, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

I went thru the list and picked out the software related items. I think it would be good if a bot pointed the rest to robot article. The worst that the bot would do is to restore the link to the incorrect article. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 21:46, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Now...

... I see two options:

  1. Make the robot page the primary, living at Android
  2. Make the disambiguation page the primary, living at Android.

Please decide. I am leaning towards #1.--Commander Keane (talk) 05:04, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

I lean toward #1 simply because the OS is only a more popular page right now because it's fairly new. We need to avoid recentism if possible, and keep in mind the likely long-term picture. Moving the pages back and forth every few years is not really an acceptable solution as that only creates more cleanup with redirecting and fixing links every time the page is moved to yet another title. The robot is far more likely to be the long-term most popular search term. ···日本穣? · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe · Join WikiProject Japan! 06:13, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
If you have this discussion on Android (OS) you will get a different perspective. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 18:04, 19 August 2010 (UTC)


(EC) I would also go with No 1 - I can only hope that people can see that this is recentism and also that Android is a vital article for robotics and technology as a whole. The whole issue here for me is already stated above and as I am on a short wikibreak I cannot really spend too much time replying as am due to leave in 10 5 mins (damn ECs lol) for a family event...Chaosdruid (talk) 18:08, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
I would also like to know why Daniel.Cardenas has prodde Android (board game) ? Is there some sort of Android conspiracy here that is attempting to remove all but the OS references ? Chaosdruid (talk) 18:12, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
There are no references on the board game, which indicates it doesn't meet wp:note guideline. The prod has been removed so at this point it is irrelevant. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 19:09, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
  • I support option #1 as the long-term primary topic, and will also request in the future Daniel is less hasty in his moves. Not only should this discussion have been at Wikipedia:Requested moves, but also, the requester should never make their own proposed move unless support is unanimous (or very nearly so). --JaGatalk 22:28, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
The discussion was up for more than a couple of months. Do you want to wait a year before actions are taken? That is not the wikipedia does things. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 13:27, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
  • I support option #1. I just went through the whole list of articles that contain links to "Android"; the breakdown was roughly 80% robots, 20% cellphones. If you ask "which article is a reader more likely to be looking for?" the answer obviously depends on who the reader is (as Daniel suggested); computer and phone enthusiasts will be looking for one article, while robotics, science fiction, and comic book enthusiasts will be looking for a different one. I think we should discount both groups of enthusiasts, and instead ask which article the general reader is more likely to be looking for, and that I think is the article on the common (in the sense of "common noun") use of the word. --R'n'B (call me Russ) 11:19, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
http://stats.grok.se/en/201008/android%20%28robot%29
http://stats.grok.se/en/201008/android_%28operating%20system%29
OS - 18K page views. Robot - 560 page views. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 16:16, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
Yes, we all already know where you stand on the issue, and showing us pageview comparisons between a very recently-released OS which has commercials all over TV, in print, and so on, and a term which has been in use for 40+ years is obviously going to support the most recent, hyped term. Once things calm down as far as the hype goes, however, it's likely the OS will not be the main term people are looking for. This move smacks of recentism. ···日本穣? · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe · Join WikiProject Japan! 16:21, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
Yes, we already now where you stand on the issue, and avoiding facts isn't going to help. Wikipedia is about common sense and what is best for the readers. The facts speak loudly. If the difference were 100x would that make any difference? Do you expect fewer commercials for android phones next year? Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 20:08, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
It doesn't matter if I expect fewer commercials or not. I think the number of hits right now is because the OS is quite new so people are interested in it. That interest will likely go down, though, once the hype of the new product is over. ···日本穣? · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe · Join WikiProject Japan! 00:49, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
What is your definition of quite new? Its been around for a couple of years and interest has been continuously building. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 01:16, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
Daniel.Cardenas, I have been in your position before (with Texas Rangers). It is not a good idea to underestimate Wikipedians desire to keep established topics (in this case the OS is named after the established term "Android") in the central location.--Commander Keane (talk) 23:41, 21 August 2010 (UTC)
I see that Texas Rangers points to a disambiguation page. Don't know what the point is. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 00:01, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
Daniel.Cardenas, do you choose option 1 or 2 above (or something else)?--Commander Keane (talk) 03:38, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
Option 2. :-) Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 04:43, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

{{adminhelp}}

I know it is not a formal 'Requested moves' scenario, but could an uninvolved admin close this discussion? It is basically choosing from the points (1) and (2) above, or you can suggest a formal requested moves process.--Commander Keane (talk) 03:14, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

I would suggest starting a WP:RM, as this seems to be nice and controversial. I also suggest it because of User:Daniel.Cardenas' comment: If you have this discussion on Android (OS) you will get a different perspective. He's right. I would start a discussion at Requested Moves. — GorillaWarfare talk 04:12, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

There is plenty of precedence on Wikipedia that a common word takes priority over a trademark. Google hits have nothing to do with it. E.g., Apple, Word, 486. To take Apple as an example, Google hits overwhelmingly refer to the company, but it would be absurd that an encyclopedia entry for Apple not be about the fruit! Google hits will be biased towards companies and products, as people are more likely to create web pages about them than fruit or androids; and they have companies advertising and marketing them. An encyclopedia should not be biased towards corporate advertising.

There may be no consensus to move back, but there was also no consensus to move it in the first place! So why does it stay at the new location? Mdwh (talk) 02:08, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

Requested move

The following is a closed discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was no consensus to move. There are convincing arguments that the word android can equally connote the OS or the robot (with, it seems to me anyway, a suggestion that the OS is the more popular one now). Best to leave it disambiguated. --RegentsPark (talk) 21:53, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

Android (robot) → Android — Revert a recent (and improperly performed, see above) move per WP:PRIMARYTOPIC; although the OS is currently very popular, the concept of Android (robot) is the persistent primary topic, as it will still be around after interest in the OS wanes. JaGatalk 09:50, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Based on web searches and traffic statistics Android OS is by far the primary topic. 25 times more traffic. For a bing search, Android OS is on the first two pages of search results, nothing about a robot. The comment about improperly performed is wrong. The requested move is therefore improperly requested. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 12:37, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Based on the above arguments I've requested that the O.S. be the primary topic. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Android_%28operating_system%29#Requested_move .   Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 13:48, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

  • Support the proposed move of Android (robot) to Android. Everyone knows that the people responsible for naming the android product did not think they were coining a new word. It is named for the pre-existing concept, just as Apple for a computer, Blackberry for a PDA, and Yukon for a vehicle. bd2412 T 14:02, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Support move per reasons given. Current Google hits are inadequate to measure the lasting relevance of the topic. The "robot" meaning is clearly the primary meaning of the word.  Sandstein  14:55, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Oppose. As I just posted on the request to move the operating system to the base name, the primary topic criteria are inconclusive here (see Discussion below). If we want to emphasize traffic here (which I think is a fine idea), we could use a method I've used before: leave the disambiguation primary since the robot article has been moved on August 15 (possibly move the dab to the base name, since it is temporarily malplaced), and create two redirects for use exclusively on the disambiguation page. Let sit for a few months, and check the stats to see how readers searching on "Android" use the term. -- JHunterJ (talk) 15:12, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Support The robot sense has been the primary topic for decades. See the discussions about Ubuntu (philosophy) and Ubuntu (operating system) for precedent. --SarekOfVulcan (talk) 16:00, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
Ubuntu points to a disambiguation page. If you are using that as an example your vote should be Oppose.   Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 19:09, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
Except that "ubuntu" didn't have a decades-long track record in the English language before a software project decided they liked the word.--SarekOfVulcan (talk) 21:23, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Support as above. Everything on the dab page (except, perhaps, for the drug) gets its name from this usage. Deor (talk) 18:20, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Support. Apple is still about the fruit, even though the top results on Google are all for the computer company. That's as it should be. Powers T 20:46, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
    • Note: I would suggest that the hatnote on this article (once it is moved to the base name) include a direct link to the OS so that people interested in the OS need not go through the disambiguation page. Powers T 20:47, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Support normal usage of the word. 76.66.197.248 (talk) 03:56, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Support per all the reasons already given. I see no reason to repeat the same arguments again. ···日本穣? · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe · Join WikiProject Japan! 04:34, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Comment: "That's the way it used to be", "Apple is like this", "Ubuntu is/isn't like this", "Google didn't coin a new word" are not criteria for primary topic given at WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. Usage by the readership is the driving force, not first, earliest, latest, most important, etc. Also, neither the move nor this request appear to be improper; "I disagree" is not "that's improper". -- JHunterJ (talk) 11:39, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Support. Best example I've yet seen of why Google can't be applied blindly. The robot meaning is clearly the primary topic. Andrewa (talk) 13:08, 2 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Oppose, while I do not agree that the OS is primary, there does seem a case for placing the disambiguation page at the base word. older ≠ wiser 06:16, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Oppose, what do wikipedia readers want to find when they search android? 25 times more often it is the OS. Where android points to does not need to indicate importance, primary, or long term meaning. It should point to what is most convenient to wikipedia readers. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 20:49, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
    See the "Discussion" section below for the explanation why the 25x number is incorrect. Traffic to articles is not the same thing as traffic through the search box or disambiguation page. -- JHunterJ (talk) 01:56, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Oppose and leave the disambiguation page at Android. Readers are not reaching Android (operating system) from Google via Android; Google puts Android (operating system) far above Android in the search results. When it had the page name Android (disambiguation), the disambiguation page got many thousands of page views per month, going back years. Put the disambiguation page at Android so that incoming links to Android can be fixed. 69.3.72.9 (talk) 03:29, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Ghits are a lousy indicator of primary topics, biased as the Web is towards its own. This is a no-brainer, and the original move was quite definitely a bad idea. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward: not at work) - talk 08:49, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Support. --Tesscass (talk) 18:34, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
  • Support A random sampling of people I know, of whom I asked "If you were to be asked what Android meant, what would you say", resulted in everyone of them saying "it's a robot" or similar. OK, it was not a scientifically performed survey - but it did cover people of different ages from teens to people in their 60s, from people who are tech-savvy to people who would assume that a mouse was a rodent and not part of a computer system. None of the people I asked even thought of the OS, even when I asked them (after the initial question) "and what about the operating system?", the reply was "what?" or "there's an OS called Android?". So my thought is that most people typing "Android" into Wikipedia will be looking for the robot rather than the OS, and it's also the first thing that I think of. -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 20:07, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Discussion

The hit counts are useful, but not conclusive. Android: 54,722[2]; Android (robot): 4818[3]; Android (operating system): 454,756[4] but Android OS: 7043[5] and Google Android: 9119[6]. Readers using the search box are unlikely to type in "Android (operating system)" in the search box, so most readers are reaching the OS page through wikilinks (because the traffic from "Android" is much less than the traffic from "Android (operating system)", so they're not coming through that way). Google book searches favor the OS, Google scholar searches do not. Google search on "Android" gets 713M hits[7], android -robot gets 222M hits[8], android -"operating system" gets 212M"operating+system", so on par there too. -- JHunterJ (talk) 15:12, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Not sure what you mean by "on par there too". If I look at the search results for android -"operating system", the first two pages are all about the OS. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 02:13, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
"On par" meaning "roughly equal". 222M is in the ballpark with 212M. The first pages are a tiny fraction of those GHits, but you can suggest some better refinements of those search terms if you find other GHit stats (not just first pages) that support the O/S move. The scholar searches will not support it, though. -- JHunterJ (talk) 10:56, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
Since a sampling of android -"operating system" yielding 100% of the OS one can conclude that they are not on par and actually google hits shows much more OS hits than robot. Daniel.Cardenas (talk) 16:37, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
Since 212M is about 222M, one can also conclude that they are on par. The GHits, as noted, are not conclusive. -- JHunterJ (talk) 17:03, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Here are some page view statistics for September 2010 to date:

Incoming links to Android have been changed to go to disambiguated page names, so the number of page views should drop, as they have dropped already for Android (disambiguation). 69.3.72.9 (talk) 14:42, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Removed Google Android statement

I have removed this:

The Google Android system has come to life with an actual Google Android powered robot named Humanoid[1]

It isn't an android so doesn't belong here. Chaosdruid (talk) 21:15, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

Albertus Magnus 1270

"The term first mentioned by Albertus Magnus in 1270" diff a course syllabus that didn't even contain the claim was used as a source for four years. Now gone diff :-/ 24.29.92.243 (talk) 00:59, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

Introduction/nomenclature Issue

"Although "android" is used almost universally to refer to both sexes, and those of no particular sex, "android" technically refers to the male form, while "gynoid" is the feminine form."

The above is potentially dramatically incorrect, as

""automaton resembling a human being," 1842, from Mod.L. androides (itself attested as a Latin word in English from 1727), from Gk. andro- "human" (see andro-) + eides "form, shape." Gk. androdes meant "like a man, manly;" cf. also Gk. andrias "image of a man, statue." Listed as "rare" in OED 1st edition (1879), popularized from c.1951 by science fiction writers."

Man, at the time, being used generically as (hu)man, considering the "andro" prefix. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:5B0:23FF:3EF0:0:0:0:38 (talk) 05:24, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

Android

The use of the pagename Android is under discussion, see Talk:Android_(operating_system)#Requested_move. 65.95.13.139 (talk) 02:41, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

Page Compromise

Read the Android article. It seems like someone has edited this page with poor intentions. I fail to see why Justin Beiber has anything to do with Androids. This page needs fixed. Looks like a prank to me, or even an anonymous attack. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Catboydale (talk • contribs) 20:41, 8 November 2011 (UTC)

Page repaired, thank you. It was vandalised about 1 hour before your post. Danim (talk) 21:44, 8 November 2011 (UTC)

Not that far from a GA

If somebody was to reference the Japan section, at least froma cursory look at reference density, this could be a GA candidate. Not sure about the comprehensiveness and language, but if somebody is interested, I could help a little. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk to me 01:16, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Article organization

I strongly object to the real android projects being organized by country. The country where something was built has very little connection to the development of the technology and its progress. A chronological listing probably makes more sense, allowing us to start with Disney's Mr. Lincoln and progress thru time to current experiments, but if someone has better ideas, I'm open to them. D O N D E groovily Talk to me 19:41, 7 December 2011 (UTC)

I am fine with that, as long as you are willing to do the job and reorganize the article - go ahead! --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk to me 20:40, 7 December 2011 (UTC)

Etymology: First used in Star Trek?

However, the word "android" was first used in the Star Trek: The Original Series episode What Are Little Girls Made Of?
The Oxford English Dictionary traces the earliest use (as "Androides") to Ephraim Chambers' Cyclopaedia, in reference to an automaton that St. Albertus Magnus allegedly created.

I assume the first quote is incorrect? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.165.88.117 (talk) 04:40, 23 March 2013 (UTC)

  1. ^ http://digitalanalog.in/2011/01/14/google-android-comes-to-life-in-tokyo-through-its-robot-humanoid/
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