Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Science/2007 March 6

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March 6

Some help with thermal fuses?

Well, my coffee roaster packed it in yesterday. After some futzing around online and getting help from various places, I've figured out that the problem is (99%, unless there are concurrent problems) a thermal fuse. I need to replace it via mail-order, as I live far from any major cities.

The fuse is rated 193 degrees C, 10A, 250v. There is a site that I've seen that sells thermal fuses, and they rate them all with three values: Tf degrees C, Tc degrees C, and Tm degrees C. I don't know which one is the actual cut-off value (I suspect Tf). They further say "It is also critical that the Tc (continuous temperature) not be exceeded as it could cause deterioration of the link or pellet and lead to eventual failure of the device."

So now I'm not sure what I need. I'm assuming a fuse with a Tf around 193, but I have no idea what the "continuous temperature" of the machine is, or whether that's really a factor. Is anyone on here a thermal fuse expert? --MattShepherd 00:21, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Are you sure it's not better just to replace the whole unit ? After all, if one component has failed, it's likely at it's designed life span, meaning you can expect other components to fail soon. StuRat 00:24, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

I would say no. Yes we live in a disposable culture but FUSES were designed to be user serviceable. If you replace the fuse and it quickly blows again then I'd consider chucking it, but fuses can blow for a variety of reasons, not least of which can be as random as a power spike. I would suggest send a quick email to the company you want to buy the fuse from, they should be the experts. Thermal fuses, and fuses in general, aren't really a fine science, but fall within a tolerance, not all the time but getting it roughly right is good enough a lot of the time.. Vespine 02:50, 6 March 2007 (UTC) can be as random as a power spike. Does the old fuse have any other info on it?

This page (look waaaaay down at the bottom] has a brief description of the three values. As you've correctly surmised, T_f is the temperature that the thermal fuse 'blows'; that is, exceeding this temperature will cause the fuse to open the circuit. T_c is the continuous operating temperature; if the fuse is regularly exposed to temperatures exceeding this value, it is apt to degrade. (I'm not sure precisely what the test conditions are to determine this value; I suspect that several hours above this temperature may toast the fuse.) T_m is the maximum operating temperature for the fuse. If the fuse is rapidly brought to a temperature that exceeds this value (note that this temperature is above T_f), it is apt to function incorrectly. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 04:04, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks to all. I have lots of (anecdotal) evidence that these units last for years and years, and mine has punked out after less than 24 months (but after warranty, bah). After talking to a repairperson, I'm very confident that the fuse fix will be fine.--MattShepherd 20:12, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

peripheral nervous system

How are are affernt/ efferent divisions related to the autonomic/somatic subdivisions of the PNS?

My understanding is that effernt/afferent division is based on fiber directionality (towards/away from CNS). I'm not clear on the somatic nervous system (voluntary/involuntary/both?) and the autonomic nervous system (glandular/internal?)

If we take the somatic/autonomic divsions individually, does that only refer to the motor/efferent fibers (to make the distinction), after which the corresponding sensory/efferent fibers are also in the same somatic/autonomic subdivision?

Is this complicated by the fact that there are many more interactions involved, for example more than one efferent fiber for the motor neuron/efferent fiber?

Lastly, is the manner in which I interchangeable use motor/efferent and sensory/afferent correct? [maybe i should have asked this first ;)]

Thanks for any help in advance.

Aren't you going beyond the scope of the research avalaible as of yet? But I like neuroscience and the study of the brain. :) --Parker007 08:02, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

I'll try and make my point clearer:

Is it...

1. PNS -> divided into somatic/autonomic only [autonomic into sympathetic/parasympathetic] OR

2. PNS -> afferent/efferent + somatic/autonomic [there are afferent and efferent components to both somatic and autonomic] OR

3. PNS -> afferent/efferent -> efferent into somatic/autonomic [sensory neurons JUST afferent; no somatic/autonomic distinction]?

To answer your initial question, there is no one-to-one mapping between afferent/efferent and autonomic/somatic. Like you said, afferent & efferent strictly define the (relative) directionality of transmission in a neuron. The term "relative" is important here, because while the CNS is generally the default reference point, it's not always the case. For example, you can speak about afferent and efferent with respect to an autonomic ganglion, in which the preganglionic neuron is afferent and the postganglionic neuron is efferent to the ganglion. Alternatively, you can consider that two-neuron pathway with respect to the CNS, in which case both pre- and postganglionic neurons would be considered efferent. However, you're right that, in general the terms "motor" and "efferent" tend to get used interchangeably just as "sensory" and "afferent", even though they're not strictly equivalent. The pairs of terms also tend to get used in combination, leading to a sense of redundancy (ie, "motor efferent" and "sensory afferent"). Hope that helps, David Iberri (talk) 22:02, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Muscle repair and calories

Does my body burn a lot of calories when it repairs itself after my workout? I know my heart rate and metabolism are up after a workout, but not counting those factors. Does anyone know the approximate calories burned in the next few days after a workout from muscles repairing themself? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 76.167.136.84 (talk) 04:03, 6 March 2007 (UTC).

I think this would be a hard number to identify. The body is constantly creating new cells and repairing itself. The additional calories necessary to heal wounds (or muscle damage from excercise) is probably very difficult to isolate from the normal operation of the body. It may even be insignificant. Caloric burn through excercise is usally calculated as a function of the amount of work done so it's much easier to estimate (and even that isn't very accurate). --Tbeatty 06:12, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Electrically conductive fluid

I can't seem to find information on this. I need an electrically conductive fluid that is not a liquid metal. I've tried using salt water but it doesn't conduct well enough to produce a high current. Any ideas? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.231.205.94 (talk) 04:33, 6 March 2007 (UTC).

Try electrolyte? --Wirbelwindヴィルヴェルヴィント (talk) 04:41, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Please provide more information so that people can make appropriate suggestions. What volume or area? How much current is desired at what voltage drop? AC or DC? What is it powering? There are conductive fluids which might work in some applications but might be too toxic or corrosive for others, or which might produce hazards from the gasses they give off. Salt water can conduct an amazing amount of current, by the way, such that it boils rapidly. A "salt bucket" was an early, primitive and hazardous current control device used in electrical testing applications, with obvious electrocution hazards. Edison 20:43, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

I'm looking to conduct around 5-10 amps of DC current across about a 1 cm gap. I've been trying salt water, and salt water + vinegar but they will not conduct even 1 amp. I've been using tungsten rods but only the sides of them, they are 1/8 in diameter. Perhaps my electrodes are too small? I seemed to get better current when I tried large pieces of tin foil as electrodes in a bowl of salt water, but they managed to corrode very fast.

We cannot give you detailed advice without details of the requirements and the limitations. Does the gadget have to have low voltage and a small surface area? What is the application? What is the source voltage? What is the allowable voltage drop in the liquid? Why can't you increase the area to, say, 32 square inches, so that each each square inch only has to carry 1/3 ampere or less? Why can't you increase the voltage? Early experimenters used mercury, not that I would suggest that now because it is highly toxic. Salt water will carry 10 amperes if the area and the voltage and the salt concentration are sufficient. A weak solution of sulphuric acid in water carries a huge current in car batteries. Other electrolytes carry currents as large as you want in other battery chemistries, or in electroplating. Chemists out there- any other suggestions? (edit) Study the Material Safety Data Sheets for any substances you experiment with and avoid possible harm from shock, explosion, or toxic effects of chemicals used. Many electrolyte solutions emit gases which may be toxic or explosive when current is passed through them, requiring ample ventilation. Edison 05:06, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Memory relationship to the Brain (More and more information)

• How can the brain keep storing more and more information? I mean it never runs out of space even as you grow older.

I believe you forget old things to make room for new things. The brain is pretty good about having you forget unimportant things (things you don't access often) and remember the important stuff, usually. Thus, you are more likely to forget the plot of a movie you saw many years ago than how to walk. StuRat 13:11, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Memories are stored in synapses, which are highly dynamic structures that join neurons. Existing synapses can be strengthened and weakened on a whim and new synapses are made all the time. I don't know if the literature supports the idea that memories need to be forgotten to make way for new ones. In fact, "forgetting" often involves the formation of new synapses, which runs contrary to that hypothesis. --David Iberri (talk) 02:43, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Well, the brain certainly doesn't have an infinite capacity, so can't store everything we ever see in full detail. The only option then is to forget old things to make room for new things. We also all have fuzzier memories of things that happened decades ago than things that happened yesterday, which seems to support this idea. You might be able to recall what you had for lunch yesterday, but can you recall what you had for lunch on March 7, 1997 ? As for forgetting being caused by the formation of new synapses, this also supports this concept, as the new synapses (containing new memories) are formed at the expense of the old ones synapses (containing old memories). The one issue I'm not clear on, is whether things are constantly being forgotten to make room for anticipated new memories, or if this forgetting only happens when a new memory forms. There might also be a feedback mechanism ("Warning: Brain is at 99% capacity, begin forgetting lowest priority memories immediately to make room !"). StuRat 12:46, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

I have to state the the lunch you ate on March 7, 1997 would be a short term memory due to its lack of importance. But how long does short term memory last? Regarding the plot of a movie you saw years ago, when we are able to make connections we can usually recollect all information. That's my theory. For example, if I want to know what I ate last week, I will have to make several connections, in order to get that particular piece of information. For example, what happened during that day etc. --Parker007 20:18, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

But the meal info is long gone, and lots of other memories, and no hypnotherapy will ever be able to recall them. StuRat 21:26, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Memory relationship to the Brain (location)

• Where exactly is the memory stored in the brain? --Parker007 07:32, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

In the CPU =P nah but i heard that we only use 10% of our brains. im not sure if this is still true today.Maverick423 16:22, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

How could you store memory in the CPU? Put it in your RAM, hard disk, or keydrive. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 17:08, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

There are 10 times more glia than neurons in our brain, that's where the term we use 10% of our brain comes from, and it is false. --Parker007 17:28, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Neat now i can throw that old rumor out and learn something new =) the process of memory in progress Maverick423 17:35, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Karl Lashley did some early studies to find the locus of memory storage, but came up relatively empty handed. In his experiments, he trained mice (rats?) to navigate a maze, then lesioned parts of their cortex and tested their ability to navigate the maze again. Despite the location of the lesion, the mice were able to navigate the maze relatively well. It was only with broad lesions of multiple cortical areas that memory impairment began to show. This led Lashley to believe that memories were arbitrarily scattered across the cortex, which is contrary to modern belief. IIRC, current thinking is that memories are distributed throughout the brain, particularly in the cortex. For example, a mouse's memory of navigating a maze may involve visual, auditory, olfactory stimuli, etc. These distinct aspects of the spatial memory would be scattered in an organized way throughout the different cortices of the brain (visual cortex, auditory cortex, etc.), and recalled in concert when the memory was required. An explanation for Lashley's results is that when one part of the cortex is lesioned, a piece of the memory is lost, but others remain and are able to compensate for the lesion. --David Iberri (talk) 02:43, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

“ brain activity related to a spatial memory task was shifted from the hippocampus to the striatum after participants slept... ”

This is a quote from a recent study paper: http://parker0007.googlepages.com/SleepReorganizesMemoryRepresentation.pdf and specifically they have a diagram showing which parts of the brain was activated during finger tapping experiment via the use of fMRI. --Parker007 20:32, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Special Drug for LTP? (brain)

• long-term potentiation (LTP) is an increase in the chemical strength of a synapse that lasts from minutes to several days

• Is there a special drug that can iduce Long-term potentiation in the brain? --Parker007 07:46, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Induce or enhance? Long-lasting cognitive improvement with nicotinic receptor agonists: mechanisms of pharmacokinetic-pharmacodynamic discordance <-- this article reviews the idea that drugs acting on nicotinic acetylcholine receptors might be able to enhance LTP. This might be relevant to acetylcholinesterase inhibitors that are used to treat Alzheimer disease. There are similar articles ([1],[2] , [3]) about Levodopa that have implications for treating Parkinson disease. Drugs acting at AMPA receptors are a third class of drugs that can enhance LTP; AMPA receptor potentiators for the treatment of CNS disorders. --JWSchmidt 21:41, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Neuron, glia, and the Brain

• The brain is composed of two broad classes of cells, neurons and glia, both of which contain several different cell types which perform different functions.

• If this is so, then why do scientist say Brain areas such as the hippocampus, the amygdala, or the mammillary bodies are thought to be involved in specific types of memory.? --Parker007 07:52, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

These statements don't appear to be contradictory, but perhaps you could explain why you think the first statement negates the second? − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 17:05, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Why do these statements seem contradictory to you? One is about the basic classes of building blocks, the other is about how different large assemblies of these building blocks perform different functions. A basic set of building blocks, such as the LEGO blocks, can be assembled into a large variety of different things. Would you have a problem with statements like CPU chips are composed of two broad classes of elements: transistors and interconnects and Different areas of CPU chips perform different functions, such as arithmetic calculations, short-term data storage, and interpretation of instructions both being true? --mglg_(talk) 17:19, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

You are misrepresenting this relationship—they aren't performing functions as distinct from one another as arithmetic calculation and storage. Parker007 says all these areas are memory-related. Secondly, there are two different classes of brain cell, but each class contains different types (or subclasses) of brain cell. This leaves a lot of room for variation. Analogously, there are several different types of epithelial cell (see Image:Illu epithelium.jpg), and they all have different functions. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 17:51, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

What is pseudophrene?

• What is pseudophrene?

• Does it have a more common name (or trade name)?
• What is it used for? Robbielatchford 11:35, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Do you mean Pseudoephedrine? --Kainaw ^(talk) 13:03, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

A cheap knock-off "phrene" ? :-) StuRat 13:06, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Reckon thats the one, I did wonder why Google only pulled 9 hits, and most of them were about frogs. Thanks for the help. Robbielatchford 00:00, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

blucat: Do you mean Psuedoephedrine? A patentable version of Ephedrine, the active ingredient of Epherda, the name of the plant? Drug Class Sympathomimetic, Bronchilator, used clinically for asthma ,broncholitus, and hay-fever. (trade names Sudafed, Sinutab). Used by many to delay ejaculation, and generally used/abused by most party goers for increased sexual satisfaction? Much better than Viagra -- (no citation -- oops ..)

Agronomy/Crop Science

What are the minimum and maximum limits of nitrogen (N) contents in the ear leaf and grain of maize crop? Please include the references or source. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 212.85.201.250 (talk) 14:07, 6 March 2007 (UTC).

an explanation for the variation of boiling points in hydrides of group 15 elements

The group 15 elements are N, P, As, Sb, Bi. These elements combine with H to form the hydrides. If a graph is plotted for the variation of the boiling points, the graph will keep on increasing and then suddnly will decrease. The reason for this is because N been an electronegative element, when combined with H will result in gaining a partial negative charge and H will get a partial positive charge. Due to this dipole interaction, the atoms are tightly bound, therefore resulting in a high boiling point. But P is not as electronegative as N and so the atoms are not as tightly bound, resulting in a low boiling point and the sudden reversal of the graph. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 124.43.210.121 (talk) 14:59, 6 March 2007 (UTC).

• Is that a question or a statement? --Shanedidona 15:38, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Differntiate between "Metal Scrap" and "Metal Waste"

I want help to differntiate between Metal Scrap and Metal Waste.

Scrap metal can be used for other things, and waste metal cannot? − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 17:02, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Our scrap article suggests that they are synonymous. There may be localized distinctions, such as the terminology used by a given company, but there does not appear to be a standardized distinction. Note also that the American Heritage Dictionary includes Discarded waste material, especially metal suitable for reprocessing. as a definition of "scrap". — Lomn 18:35, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

In the context of recycling, metal waste is leftovers from manufacturing (roll trimmings, casting sprues, and the like) while metal scrap (or scrap metal) is metal from broken machinery and the like. It's like the difference between pre-consumer and post-consumer waste in paper recycling. --Carnildo 00:11, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Magnets and heat

Hey i recall going to the Museum of Science and Industry in Chicago and in it they stated that magnets can also loose their magnitisem with heat temporarly. but in the article it doesnt state that the magnet can regain its magnetism or if it can permenatly lose it. so i ask what is the max tempreture (if any) that a powerful permenate magnet can endure before losing its magnetism completly.Maverick423 16:32, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Well, it rather depends on the material in question. Ferromagnetic materials (those that can maintain aligned magnetic domains, that is, can be "turned into a magnet") become paramagnetic above their Curie temperature. This means that they can still become magnetized in the presence of external magnetic field (in other words, a magnet would attract them), but they cannot maintain the magnetic alignment once the external field is removed. So yes, a ferromagnetic material would "permanently" lose its magnetic alignment if raised above its Curie temperature. However, if it were cooled down it could be re-magnetized. I think the situation is similar for ferrimagnetic materials. -- mattb @ 2007-03-06T16:52Z

Ferromagnets (normal magnets) lose their ability permanently, although it can be remagnetized. The critical temperature is the Cure point. [Mαc Δαvιs] X (How's my driving?) ❖ 16:54, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Mac Davis probably meant the Curie point. Nimur 19:08, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Passing two magnets at similar or opposite positions for prolonged periods (days weeks years) will this cause loss of magnitismMaverick423 17:22, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

In fact, Tesla even patented a motor based on this effect; [4] --BenBurch 19:43, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

An iron nail, heated red hot with a torch, falls off a permanent magnet. When it cools a bit, the magnet attracts it again. As Ben said, Tesla worked with this and so did Thomas Edison. Reciprocating motion is very easy to devise and implement, rotary motion a bit harder. There is the issue of energy lost getting an keeping the apparatus near red hot, but I have wondered about possibilities for such a motor using substances with a lower Curie point than iron, or used near a hot environment (a foundary or blacksmith shop, the planet Mercury, near blast furnaces or other furnaces, or in chimneys). It could use an electromagnet or a permanent magnet to provide the magnetic flux which produces the attraction, then modulate that force by the temperature variation in the metal from just above to just below the Curie point. Edison 20:51, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Death Mimicry?

I recently heard about a crystal like chemical that can be absorbed through the skin and drastically slows down the body's processes. I was going to use this as an example for a discussion coming up in one of my classes but could not remember the name of it, I have looked for it on google and as I do not know the name of it could not find it on Wiki. Please help me as I really want to be able to bring this up, I do belive it starts with an "a".

thanx,maxx. 66.99.49.226 18:13, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

That sounds REALLY unlikely - I'd look for something else to talk about in class. SteveBaker 18:54, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Asbestos and arsenic can lead to illness and death. Nimur 19:09, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

no, it only mimics death, not actually causing it, also I understand that it is sometimes used to stop a heart in hospitals when there is a need to regulate an abnormal heart beat. -maxx- 66.99.49.226 19:46, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

So, a paralytic agent then?--VectorPotential^Talk 20:45, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Sounds like you mean Curare? --BenBurch 22:07, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Except it doesn't start with an "a" (: The only way I can think of to reconcile this is that both of our answers are acetylcholine inhibitors, and that does start with an "a" --VectorPotential^Talk 23:28, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

How about atropine? Don't know that it would absorb through skin, though... --Ocarinacavegirl 03:31, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

YAY!!!!! we found it!!!! i didnt know if it could be absorbed through the skin, i just thought it might be possible if you mix it with some other agent/ dissolvant.

Mysterious fog

Hi. Again, I usually help out, but I'm hoping that you could help me again. One day, when it was very cold (about -20°C), with winds of about 30 km/h, and very few clouds, I witnessed a thick fog gliding over the ground, staying only about 10cm over the ashphalt road. The snow was thick, and most of it was loose. I had no idea what the fog was, was it snow, condensation, chimney smoke, furnace vapour, evaporation, latent heat, car exaust, washer fluid, greenhouse gas,or something else? Thanks. AstroHurricane001^{(Talk+Contribs+Ubx)} 18:23, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

• Depending on your location, might I suggest smog?--VectorPotential^Talk 18:28, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Well, I don't really think it was smog, for several reasons. I live in Canada, and smog usually isn't that problematic on cold winter days. I saw it on an ashphalt road, and practically nowhere else. Also, I've never seen smog drift along the ground slowly in a mistlike manner. In some areas the fog drifted as high as one metre (about 4 ft), and smog usually goes higher than that. I'm thinking it was probably mist or exaust, or something like that. Thanks. AstroHurricane001^{(Talk+Contribs+Ubx)} 18:38, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

its possable someone forgot to turn off the automatic watering on their yard? they ussally form steam in colder weather conditions and if its under the snow it can appear to come out of nowhere as the vapors escape.Maverick423 18:40, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Well, in such cold conditions, evaporation from a warmer body of water would produce nice drifting ground-fog - so maybe there was a warmer pool of water nearby - the outflow from somekind of drain that might contain warmer water perhaps? As for why it stayed 10cm above the asphalt - asphalt is dark and absorbs heat from the sun during the day - and will stay quite a bit warmer than the ambient air for hours after sunset. So there might well be a thin (10cm) layer of warmer air just above it - which would eliminate the visible water vapor in the fog for a short distance. I don't think there is anything too surprising going on here. SteveBaker 18:52, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

very cold air, very black asphalt very bright day. Sun heats asphalt enough to evaporate/sublimate ice from cracks on road surface raising relative humidity of near-surface air, which rises, and cools to produce near-surface fog. I would susped that this rapidly reaches an equilibrium condition as the fog cuts off the sunlight. -Arch dude 19:55, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

If you look at Fog you will find an entry for "ice fog" which is likely what you saw. --BenBurch 20:10, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Hi. I think you might be right. There was snow on the ground, and it melted into water. However, I think the most probable causes are snow, condensation, or car gas exaust. It could have been snow because the snow may have been blown onto the streets and since the air is cold, the snow might have been trapped between the snowbanks with cold air pressing it down, warm air from the road pushing it up, and winds moving it. However, I usually don't expect snow to remain afloat in air for minutes, even hours. It might have been condensation, because some of the water may have evaporated, forming a thick fog on the road. It might also have been gas, because condensation might have formed on the relatively warm gas, which might have stayed. I saw the car gas rapidly fade at first, but the fog from the cars lingered, probably for several minutes. Later in the day, some of the road was dry, and the fog dissapeared. Car gas dissapeared in seconds. Also, I don't think it was a sprinkler, because most people don'tleave out their sprinklers after weeks of sub-zero temperatures under a foot of snow, ice, and more snow. So, does this sound plausible? Thanks. AstroHurricane001^{(Talk+Contribs+Ubx)} 21:55, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Hi. I saw the same effect when the snow was melting and the water was being heated by the sun. Thanks wikipedia. AstroHurricane001^{(Talk+Contribs+Ubx)} 21:13, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Underwater flatus increases odor?

Just curious why flatus released underwater (like in a bathtub, pool or even shower) always smell so much worse then ones released in air? --24.249.108.133 21:15, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Answers from when the question was asked before. Anchoress 21:18, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Muscle question

Could someone please tell me what the most sensitive muscle in the human body from fingers(included) to elbow is. Thanks a lot.Question101 22:10, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

i dont know but i find jabbing someone (with little or no force) on the sides above the hips about a hand lenght from the belly button shows very powerful results. =) but i think this is just a pressure point as to being a acctual muscle.Maverick423 22:47, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

What exactly do you mean by "sensitive muscle"? Physiologically, muscle sensitivity is related to the number of motor neurons innervating it. Is that what you're referring to? --David Iberri (talk) 02:29, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

My prof just said "whats the finnest muscle from elbow to hand"? I would really appreciate an answer cause I really need a bonus right now. Thanks Question101 12:50, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

hmm... i dont know that there is anything sensitive in the arm, the only thing that hurts when i push on it is my broken wrist from last week >.< but try the solar plexus, right inbetween the bottoms of the ribs and right below the long thing from the neck bone extending down to connect the ribs (forgot what its called). -maxx- 66.99.49.226 13:43, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

From the phrasing, It seems that you are looking for either the thinnest muscle that extends from the elbow to the hand, or the smallest muscle in the forearm. I take "finnest" to mean finest. Well, there is one muscle, the palmaris longus which is basically just a strip of tendon with a tiny little muscle attached at the end, which goes from the elbow to the palm of the hand. It is indeed very dainty. Overall the smallest muscle in the forearm is probably the third palmar interosseous muscle, which is attached to the root of your pinkie finger on the ring finger side. ^tucker/_rekcut 16:45, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Maybe they were asking for the one with the finest control, a muscle that can provide a huge or a tiny force or anything inbetween :) HS7 19:57, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

I don't know but getting punched in the upper arm hurts like hell. --Candy-Panda 06:12, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Bad guts last night - physical symptoms

I was out on the town last night and I ate a very dodgy pizza. It wasn't so much that I got food poisoning from it - but it was very, very greasy. I woke up in the middle of the night (maybe four hours after eating it) with stomach cramps and had to evacuate my bowels several times in rapid succession (not exactly diarrhoea, just nasty-smelling, sloppy, greasy poop). Accompanying my intestinal distress was a feeling of extreme dizziness and my whole body felt ice-cold, despite being soaked in sweat.

I'm not asking for medical advice here (I'm fine now, once I cleared it all out of my system) but does anyone have an explanation for the dizziness and cold sweats I experienced? Never had anything like that before. FYI, alcohol was not involved. --Kurt Shaped Box 22:42, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Food poison?? hmmm or maybe an excess of grease. it sounds more like food poison to me though. (trust me i know) but i didnt exactly get the ummm same results as you did with the rushing to the bathroom. maybe it was a mixture of both?Maverick423 22:49, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

I don't think it was food poisoning - it came on way too quickly for that, in my experience (I've had food poisoning before). I think that it was just a case of the bulk and grease pushing out everything before it... --Kurt Shaped Box 23:21, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Maybe you're becoming lactose intolerant? Clarityfiend 00:24, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

I doubt it. I eat takeaway pizza all the time with no problems. This one was a *bad* pizza (topped with doner meat) from a place I don't normally go to - the sort that makes you think "why am I even eating this crap?" as you're eating it. My excuse? I was really hungry, it was late and I'd paid for it... :) --Kurt Shaped Box 00:46, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

A gastrointestinal doc explained it to me like this: Inside your intestines are tons of little fingers. They like to grab the poop and pull it along. When it gets all soupy in there, they can't grab on to anything. So, they grab each other and start to twist and pull at your insides. Coincidentally, moving the intestines around was once a popular form of torture because it causes such extreme pain that the body goes into shock and you end up with hot/cold flashes, sweat, numbness, dizziness, ringing in the ears, and seeing spots (among many other symptoms of shock). So, the doc said, eat plenty of fiber. --Kainaw ^(talk) 01:44, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

I suspect you had an immune system response to your food. It's not uncommon. You'd have to see a doctor to figure out why but you probably wouldn't get an exact answer. People with irritable bowel syndrome often have the same response but to different triggers. Fever often is accompanied by dizziness/delirium and the fever is part of the immune response. --Tbeatty 04:39, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

It sounds rather like dumping syndrome. --DrGaellon (talk | contribs) 17:45, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

the grease sounds like the pizza was very fattening--Lerdthenerd 10:53, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Easy Terminology Question

Hello, I have been searching for terminology for the following concepts:

1. One thing to multiple things. 2. Multiple things to one thing.

The concept in 1. is also that the first one thing is not altered when it expands to multiple things. It just leads to them, like one idea leading to further multiple ideas for example.

In 2. the concept is also that the multiple things are not altered when added together, like multiple ideas converging into one conclusion. Obviously the "thing(s)" could be any noun.

Is there a simple terminology, perhaps in physics? The closest I've gotten is inductive/deductive (specific to general and vice versa), but that's not the same thing.

Thank you!

Chuck

216.38.138.162 23:04, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

This is a database concept. You are referring to "one-to-many" and "many-to-one" relationships. There's also the "one-to-one" and "many-to-many" relationships. Every few years, some guy comes along and tries to coin a terminology for the concepts, but they've used the words "one" and "many" for far too long for some new term to come along and take over. --Kainaw ^(talk) 00:09, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Removed the email address from this question, as it is practically asking for spam. Nimur

I don't think he means the database concept — he is not necessarily proposing a system of correspondence, which is all database relationships are. --24.147.86.187 02:29, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

And don't forget "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one." - Spock. StuRat 12:39, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

1. Reduction ? Analysis ?

2. Emergence ? Synthesis ? Gandalf61 17:26, 7 March 2007 (UTC)