Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2016 June 4

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June 4

I have three questions about Africa

1. How long could it be until all the countries in Africa have LGBT rights? 2. Which region of Southern Africa is considered the western part? 3. A long time ago, I met someone from Botswana who told me his name meant born a Friday. I can't remember his name. Any ideas? 50.68.118.24 (talk) 05:59, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

1. An infinite amount of time

2. See West

3. KOFI : Akan name common in Ghana, meaning "born on Friday."

JUMA : Swahili name meaning "born on Friday." [1]

AFUA f Western African, Akan - Means "born on Friday" in Akan.

MWANAJUMA f Eastern African, Swahili - Means "born on Friday" in Swahili. [2]

For more, see Ghanaian_name#Examples_of_Ghanaian_day_names & Akan_names#Day_names_2 & this. The Quixotic Potato (talk) 06:33, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

TQP, someone from Botswana is very unlikely to have a Ghanaian or Akan name. Rojomoke (talk) 09:04, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

@Rojomoke: I've never been there. I live in Amsterdam, a city with inhabitants from ~180 nationalities, and over here many people have a name that is more commonly associated with another country (even when the last couple of generations of their family were born in the Netherlands). My country is so tiny that I wonder if there are any frequently used names that are not also used in other countries (although there may be some spelling differences). The Quixotic Potato (talk) 12:58, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

@The Quixotic Potato:, you don't need to have been there to realise that those countries are over 3000 miles apart, and speak entirely different languages. It's like answering a question about Dutch by saying "Here's how it works in Greek". Rojomoke (talk) 13:33, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

While English is the official language and Setswana the national language, there are over 20 other languages spoken in Botswana. My brother's baby has a Scandinavian name (which is also used in Japan). My sisters name is frequently used in Iran. The Quixotic Potato (talk) 13:34, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

Right, but in reality, you've provided no relevant information, and simply posted exactly what someone would get if they Googled "botswana born on Friday" -- one of those dozens of web pages about "African baby names", as if there is such a thing as a language or culture called "African". No value to one actually seeking an answer to a question. --jpgordon^{𝄢𝄆 𝄐𝄇} 14:12, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

I almost never sure of anything. I wish I was as certain as you are! The Quixotic Potato (talk) 17:15, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

"Correct" and "relevant" are also helpful qualities when volunteering on the Reference Desk. --jpgordon^{𝄢𝄆 𝄐𝄇} 19:35, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

Being polite and having a good friend or foe-system are also quite useful once in a while. Just like the concept of doubt and the ability to recognize when it is time to stop digging. The Quixotic Potato (talk) 19:28, 6 June 2016 (UTC)

Entirely different, well, Setswana and Swahili are both Bantu, and Akan is probably a member of the broader family. </pedantry> —Tamfang (talk) 21:00, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

I know many Ghanaians, but I didn't know till now that their names were derived from the day of the week on which they were born. So far as I knew, boys born on Sunday might be called that, as Nigerian (Yoruba) girls born on Christmas Day might be called Abiodun. The man whose name was Sunday was Pakosi, but this does not match up with the Twi word for that day - maybe someone is familiar with this name and can explain what it means. 151.224.167.104 (talk) 10:43, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

1. Regarding the possible if not probable timescale of universal LGBT liberalization, the progress of dismantling Apartheid was a comparable civil rights project that took 8 years, counting from negotiations started in 1990 by President de Klerk, elections in 1994 won by Mandela and the ANC to 1998 with completion of televised hearings by the TRV.

2. The Southern African Development Community comprises 15 states of which 4 (Congo, Angola, Namibia, South Africa) have a western coastline. South Africa today is a single sovereign state but historically it had East/West divisions during the Boer War when the Transvaal, OVS and Natal resisted the British Cape Colony on their West. AllBestFaith (talk) 14:30, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

Christianity makes no sense, it's illogical?

Take for instance, the story of Adam and Eve. Why would god create two perfect beings, and a perfect garden. Then put a tree with fruit of the forbidden knowledge. They wern't suppose to eat the fruit, but god put the tree there anyway. And of course, the christian version of god is supposed to be completely omnipotent, he knows all the future, the past. So when he did all that, clearly he knew well in advance that Adam and Eve would Sin. The whole thing just reads like a crappy novel, or a broken record.

Yet, it's responsible for trillions of dollars and billions of people.... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.243.44.34 (talk) 16:44, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

There are a lot of attempts to answer this question (here's one). One response is that the idea of God being all-knowing and all-powerful is just one interpretation of the Bible and that he may not have known that Adam and Eve would sin (see problem of evil). Another is that he knew that they would sin but that humanity would be better off sinning and repenting as opposed to being innocent from the start (felix culpa). clpo13_(talk) 16:58, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

The original poster is arguing against biblical inerrancy, not against Christianity in the more general sense. Not all Christians believe in biblical inerrancy. Robert McClenon (talk) 17:32, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

Other things Christians have said: "Free will is better than being unable to sin" (I don't know, I rather like being unable to eat my mother on a desert island instead of having to constantly suppress an instinct to do it to avoid hell), "God works in mysterious ways". Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 20:28, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

Jesus was the Logos or logic of God (John 1:1), that which is not Logos is anti-Christ. I don't think "Saint" Paul is logical. As for the metaphor of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, it took away our innocents. Jesus (if he existed) was pretty cool and logical: he upset the tables of the moneychangers, told his disciples to carry no money (the Essenes despised money and didn't carry any either) and said, "you can't serve god and money. Raquel Baranow (talk) 20:45, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

"We don't answer requests for opinions, predictions or debate." This does not appear to be a factual question. --71.110.8.102 (talk) 07:06, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

True, but this kind of question is likely one of a young boy or girl who is starting to build their own independant thinking, which is a good thing, so I think an answer like the one by Robert McClenon makes sense encyclopedically. Akseli9 (talk) 07:27, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

Not only Christianity, also Orthodox Judaism believes Genesis is wholly true (although some Jewish scholars believe there is a deeeper meanihg hidden beneath the words).--Carnby (talk) 12:14, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

This might have been true in the mid - nineteenth century but I don't think it's true now. Darwin's Theory of Evolution is widely accepted by Christians. 151.224.132.45 (talk) 12:42, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

Officially yes, but in practice young children are still taught the story of Adam and Eve is true. Sometimes, if a boy or a girl continue attending the church, he or she will be taught it may not be wholly true. I remember ten years ago in Catholic churches in Italy during Masses there were continue referrings to Adam and Eve's original sin.--Carnby (talk) 12:50, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

Note that the God in Genesis is not the omnipresent God we think of normally. It says He "Walked through the Garden, looking for Adam and Eve". This doesn't match the modern concept of God. So, whoever wrote that bit had a much more human-like God in mind. StuRat (talk) 19:02, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

I would say that "all religions are illogical", in that they are based on faith, that is, believing something contrary to what logic (in the form of science) tells us. StuRat (talk) 19:13, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

Non-overlapping magisteria may be a relevant article. --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 09:00, 6 June 2016 (UTC)

That theory never gained general acceptance and appears to be becoming outmoded [3]. I liked this quote:

“ For the scientist who has lived by his faith in the power of reason, the story ends like a bad dream. He has scaled the mountains of ignorance; he is about to conquer the highest peak; as he pulls himself over the final rock, he is greeted by a band of theologians who have been sitting there for centuries. ”

Yes. Consider a bunch of highly-evolved, yet (by modern standards) uneducated apes, 2-4,000 (or so) years ago, trying to explain the existence of the Earth, and sky, with all their complexities. Why would you expect them to come up with anything logical? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:31, 7 June 2016 (UTC)

apes... it's my people you talk about. richarddawkins.net is this way :) And I read somewhere, the Genesis story is actually less eccentric than what was du jour in the ancient world (think Cronus devouring his kids, Zeus birthing Athena from his skull etc. This gave me nightmares as a 2nd(?)-grader) Asmrulz (talk) 01:00, 9 June 2016 (UTC)

Exhumation of Mohammad

Since his place of burial is known, is there any possibility that he could be exhumed for archaeological purposes? Surely there would be a huge amount to learn. Even doing a radar scan or x ray of the casket like they do with Egyptian mummies? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.223.128.20 (talk) 21:57, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

There was a claimed plan to exhume the body but not for archaelogicial purposes [4] and the plan was just a “proposal by an academic which was published in a specialized magazine and is not a government decision.” Frankly in the current climate, such an idea still seems more likely than any exhumation for archaelogical purposes [5]. Nil Einne (talk) 03:14, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

Nobody has suggested that the purpose of this is to learn something. When Aminah's grave was discovered it was saturated with petrol and destroyed Destruction of early Islamic heritage sites in Saudi Arabia. The Wahabi regime and Daesh have a common background - think Palmyra. More people (mainly Shia) have been murdered by the regime than by Daesh. 151.224.132.45 (talk) 11:42, 5 June 2016 (UTC)

???? Isn't that what I said? Okay I didn't clarify that the quote was just what the Saudi Arabian government claimed, I should have added a "supposedly" in there especially given the part about "academic". But even so I still feel my comment was clear enough, especially combined with any reading of the refs, that at the moment it seems far more likely the body will be exhumed to be moved somewhere else or even destroyed than it would be exhumed to be studied. Nil Einne (talk) 07:30, 6 June 2016 (UTC)