User talk:Vlatkoto/Archive 2.1

This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Macedonism

Exactly what do you want? Also why don't you have the Bulgarian babel box? - FrancisTyers 19:39, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

You've seen i gess the versions of the article. What do you think what is Macedonism, and what does the term means? And thanks for the help on the article.--Vlatkoto|Vlatko 21:48, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

I have no idea, it doesn't appear in any dictionaries that I know of. The whole article is uncited. - FrancisTyers 19:55, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

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Macedonism

Hi Vlatkoto. The problem is I don't know anything of the argument; honestly, I know what the article says, and nothing more. Also, I'm not even an admin. Ask FrancisTyers; I see that he's already made some edits, I wouldn't have idea what to do. I'm sorry I'm not of much help, but I don't see what I could do.--Aldux 20:27, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

Zdravo Vlatko

Te molam ako imas vreme i ako sakas, pomozi me na Stan Lazaridis toj e makedonec fudbaler od australija, jasno e deka e makedonec i deka toj samiot e svesen deka e makedonec, no ovie grci na wiki (kako normalno) odma idat so propaganda i go pravet Grk, a duri idat so 5 grcki useri taka da moram da imam i jas nekoja potpora. te molam i pozdrav! --Makedonia 19:55, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

Ethnic identity

An article on Bulgarian-Macedonian ethnicity dispute would be an interesting one. I encourage you to start it. I find myself surprised at how many people actually care what ethnicity a historical figure is. I really have no reference. You could say almost any historical figure in the history of England was not English and I couldn't give a rat's ass (local expression) — why the quest for ethnic purity? Your userpage could be considered pretty offensive by the way. Instead of using inflammatory user boxes, consider writing a paragraph on why you think "Macedonian unity" is a good idea. If you want help with the aforementioned article, let me know. - FrancisTyers 13:49, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

See WP:NAME. Don't you see that the overt nationalist symbolism on your user page may contribute to some of the bad reactions you get from other users? Consider the user page of User:FlavrSavr, it is much more reserved. One tends to have less time to spend defending nationalists than those who take a more pragmatic view. Why do you need the irredentist maps?

You have to realise that as an administrator I have no more power than you here. Administrators are not the arbiters of content on Wikipedia, we just have the power to stop disruption and a lot of duties involving deleting articles and generally cleaning up the place.

Regarding the articles you bring to my attention, I suggest you start looking for non-partisan academic sources that describe him as Macedonian. Good places to start are: Google Scholar and JStor. I see the article on Pitu Guli is currently unsourced. You might like to add the {{verify}} template and go about finding a source. Has he had a biography written about him? How did it describe him? Macedonian or Bulgarian? Favour non-partisan (that is not Macedonian and not Bulgarian) sources. When you have some sources that he is Macedonian, let me know and I will reappraise the situation. - FrancisTyers 14:25, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

[removed inflammatory and imprecise comment - FrancisTyers 14:53, 31 May 2006 (UTC)] ... there are no sources calling him Macedonian, except maknews.org. --Telex 14:39, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

We are trying to build an encyclopaedia, not settle old scores. I advise you to read over the policies, WP:NPOV, WP:CITE and WP:NOR. Following that, read the guideline at Wikipedia:Reliable sources. I told you, I don't care about this issue. If you bring reliable non-partisan sources to the table then I can do something. Otherwise nada. You'll note how I did some research on Pitu Guli, found a source, and subsequently cited it. Perhaps you didn't realise that he had a Greek name too, but more information makes the article better. - FrancisTyers 15:29, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

Why bother making the reaction. An eye for an eye... You would serve your cause better if you had a paragraph of text written in a reserved manner refuting Bulgarian irredentism. Anyway, I would encourage you to alter your userpage to take into account the sensibilities of other users, even if they don't accord you the same good courtesy. - FrancisTyers 15:45, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

Oh, and let me know when you find those Wikipedia:Reliable sources. - FrancisTyers 15:45, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

Just drop it. Really, I would plead with you to not escalate this any further. - FrancisTyers 17:14, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

I will not contribute to adding unsourced information to Wikipedia. You are welcome to remove (and I will support you) any unsourced claims of one person or the other being Bulgarian. But I am not willing to insert that someone was a Macedonian without a source. Besides, why can't someone be both Macedonian and Bulgarian? - FrancisTyers 17:44, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

Blocked

You have been blocked for three hours for attempting to impersonate another user. I suggest you use the time wisely, take a break from editing Wikipedia and find some good sources to improve the articles we've been discussing. If you think you have been blocked unjustly, I would recommend that you either bring it up here, or contact another administrator. I will be watching your page. Regards - FrancisTyers 18:11, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

What, hahahaha, realy how could i knew that, by the way I did not impersonate anyone, I just wrote what I tought. realy. This plock is unfear. Lots of the statements are similar and in some parts the same. This Block is not honest. If you want to say something personal feel free to do it, bu using this....Please be honest and unblock me.Vlatko 20:13, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

You typed a statement and made it appear to be by User:Telex. That is impersonation. - FrancisTyers 18:39, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

But , realy, I've done something like that. I did it with no purpose. I realised that not, it was an inertion mestake. As you can see and from the sttement, it was with no purpose. Mine mestake, sorry.Vlatko 22:06, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

I've unblocked you. Blocking is preventative not punitive. Please do not do it again. - FrancisTyers 20:19, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

No I don't :-) --Telex 21:38, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

You are in danger of violating the three-revert rule on a page. Please cease further reverts or you may be blocked from further editing.

User notice: temporary 3RR block

Regarding reversions[1] made on June 1 2006 (UTC) to Jane Sandanski

You have been temporarily blocked for violation of the three-revert rule. Please feel free to return after the block expires, but also please make an effort to discuss your changes further in the future.

The duration of the block is 24 hours. William M. Connolley 08:14, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Image

Image Tagging Image:MAKEDONSKI GRB02.JPG

This media may be deleted.

Thanks for uploading Image:MAKEDONSKI GRB02.JPG. I notice the 'image' page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you have not created this media yourself then there needs to be an argument why we have the right to use the media on Wikipedia (see copyright tagging below). If you have not created the media yourself then it needs to be specified where it was found, i.e., in most cases link to the website where it was taken from, and the terms of use for content from that page.

If the media also doesn't have a copyright tag then one should be added. If you created/took the picture, audio, or video then the {{GFDL-self}} tag can be used to release it under the GFDL. If you believe the media qualifies as fair use, consider reading fair use, and then use a tag such as {{Non-free fair use in|article name}} or one of the other tags listed at Wikipedia:Image copyright tags#Fair_use. See Wikipedia:Image copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.

If you have uploaded other media, consider checking that you have specified their source and copyright tagged them, too. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any unsourced and untagged images will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. FrancisTyers 16:26, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Copyrighted images

If you continue to upload copyvio images I will have no other option than to block you. If you are unsure of what license to release an image under, you can ask at the Wikipedia:Village pump. Please read WP:COPY very carefully. - FrancisTyers 22:18, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

Ohrid

Zdravo vlatko, i created the Ohrid municipality page, you should take a look and add aditionall information as you wish. Greetings!--Makedonia 13:17, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Kiro Gligorov

I don't understand you, what were you trying to say. Do you think Glogorov was lying? --Telex 15:37, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Userpage

Are you making a complaint about my actions? If so could you make it more specific. - FrancisTyers · 17:07, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Actually there are specific guidelines about what you can do with your userpage. You can read more about them here. I don't think I have done anything against Wikipedia policy, but if you think I have, you are free to use the dispute resolution process. - FrancisTyers · 18:09, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

vlatko

Citaj go ova. Te molam ako imas vreme i ako sakas, pomozi me na Stan Lazaridis toj e makedonec fudbaler od australija, jasno e deka e makedonec i deka toj samiot e svesen deka e makedonec najdov i izvori i duri pretsedatelot od Stirling Lions FK mi pusti eden email. no ovie grci na wiki (kako normalno) odma idat so propaganda i go pravet Grk, a duri idat so 5 grcki useri taka da moram da imam i jas nekoja potpora. te molam i pozdrav! --Makedonia 18:44, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:Skopje Real1.png

Thanks for uploading Image:Skopje Real1.png. However, the image may soon be deleted unless we can determine the copyright holder and copyright status. The Wikimedia Foundation is very careful about the images included in Wikipedia because of copyright law (see Wikipedia's Copyright policy).

The copyright holder is usually the creator, the creator's employer, or the last person who was transferred ownership rights. Copyright information on images is signified using copyright templates. The three basic license types on Wikipedia are open content, public domain, and fair use. Find the appropriate template in Wikipedia:Image copyright tags and place it on the image page like this: {{TemplateName}}.

Please signify the copyright information on any other images you have uploaded or will upload. Remember that images without this important information can be deleted by an administrator. If you have any questions, feel free to contact me, or ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. 13:27, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Image Tagging Image:Grb na Skopje.jpg

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Thanks for uploading Image:Grb na Skopje.jpg. I notice the 'image' page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you have not created this media yourself then there needs to be an argument why we have the right to use the media on Wikipedia (see copyright tagging below). If you have not created the media yourself then it needs to be specified where it was found, i.e., in most cases link to the website where it was taken from, and the terms of use for content from that page.

If the media also doesn't have a copyright tag then one should be added. If you created/took the picture, audio, or video then the {{GFDL-self}} tag can be used to release it under the GFDL. If you believe the media qualifies as fair use, consider reading fair use, and then use a tag such as {{Non-free fair use in|article name}} or one of the other tags listed at Wikipedia:Image copyright tags#Fair_use. See Wikipedia:Image copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.

If you have uploaded other media, consider checking that you have specified their source and copyright tagged them, too. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any unsourced and untagged images will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. 13:32, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Image:Skopje Real1.png

Are you saying you created Image:Skopje Real1.png? Even so, information is needed on the copyright status of the images you used to make it. --Telex 13:34, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Hey man, you are aware that even if you stitch the image together, it can still be copyright violation. This is what we call a derivative work. Basically unless you do everything yourself do not tag the image as {{GFDL-self}}. Please read Wikipedia:Image copyright tags and WP:COPY. Note: The copyright law in effect is not Macedonian copyright law, but American copyright law, so please try and familiarise yourself with it. I would appreciate it if you would go through all of your image contributions and fix the licenses. Regards. - FrancisTyers · 14:00, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

You can find your image contributions here. Note: Anything created with Google Earth may not be uploaded. Images must have detailed source information. If you are having trouble determining the status of any of the images, please post them in the section I will create below. Do not upload any more images until all the ones you have uploaded are checked. Ok? - FrancisTyers · 14:09, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

How are you going on this? - FrancisTyers · 15:25, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Images to be checked

Image:Skopje Real1.png

Maps

Vlatko, if you want to make maps, WorldWind is PD, as it's by the American government. It's almost identical to GoogleEarth (I think it's better). --Telex 14:11, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Greek Macedonia etc.

Stop adding United Macedonia to Greek Macedonia and related articles. - FrancisTyers · 18:59, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Which images would you like me to delete? - FrancisTyers · 19:54, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Macedonism

Listen, personally I think that it is just an epithet ethnic nationalist Bulgarians (and anti-Macedonians) use against Macedonians. I'm not going to spend time researching it though. You spend the time researching it and improve the article. There are eight papers that mention it. Work with that. There are books (that you can search inside!) — just do a bit of leg work, appropriately source it and the article will be much improved. The "historical context" is derisory. - FrancisTyers · 21:37, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Nice map

Thanks! I don't see anything offensive in expressing an opinion, do you? It's funny you're commenting on this while promoting an ultranationalist and irredentist concept on your userpage and sporting an userbox in support of a group sex position, but I and the other Wikipedians interested in Macedonia seem to be tolerant towards that.

Do you recognize every human's original right to self-determination? How do you associate it with the irredentist proposals and arguments of what we call Macedonism, of which you seem to be a devoted supporter? Todor →Bozhinov 13:52, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Hi, Vlatko. I have a question at User talk:TodorBozhinov#Nice map - could you answer it? I'd like the see the Macedonistic perspective on this one. Thanks. --Telex 16:24, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Влат^(д?)ко, политика и секс? Guns N' Roses. Todor →Bozhinov 17:39, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

3RR

You are in danger of violating Wikipedia:3RR on Macedonism. /FunkyFly.talk_ 20:53, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Compare the pages in article's history, you can see that I violited nothing, I made some changes.You are wrong. It is you that violited it.--Vlatko 22:54, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

You've made 3 reverts so far. The next one within 24 hrs of the 1st one will be a violation. /FunkyFly.talk_ 21:00, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:Delcevo-30g.jpg

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Your edit to Macedonism

Your recent edit to Macedonism was reverted by an automated bot that attempts to recognize and repair vandalism to Wikipedia articles. If the bot reverted a legitimate edit, please accept my humble creator's apologies – if you bring it to the attention of the bot's owner, we may be able to improve its behavior. Click here for frequently asked questions about the bot and this warning. // AntiVandalBot 20:57, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

Please do not add nonsense to Wikipedia. It is considered vandalism. If you would like to experiment, use the sandbox. Thank you. --—Khoikhoi 22:28, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

3RR

You are in danger of violating Wikipedia:3RR on Macedonism. /FunkyFly.talk_ 20:12, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

Macedonian as a native language

Why? Because I'm able to communicate with Macedonians and be perfectly understood without ever having studied the language. If I don't speak the Bulgarian dialect of the Rhodopes, does this mean I shouldn't mark Bulgarian as my native tongue? By this I don't imply Macedonian is a dialect of Bulgarian, because that may be somewhat offending, but rather that they are different codifications of one language. Just like the Banat Bulgarian language is a different codification of Bulgarian (and it has more differences from standard modern Bulgarian than Macedonian does... I can tell you that).

Putting the {{User mk}} template on my userpage is simply a symbol of what I believe in. And what I believe in is Bulgarian and Macedonian are one (ед^и/ен) language divided by politics. Why are you refusing to be tolerant and accept other people's opinion when we can live with your cranky United Macedonia ideas? Todor →Bozhinov 16:25, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

All right, you can call me Toše Božinoski (I'd have been renamed so if I lived in Macedonia after WWII), but don't call me slang words for gay — I'm not. Not sure if this qualifies as a personal attack, but you'd rather not repeat, we might check. Todor →Bozhinov 16:41, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

(Quoted from FunkyFly yet applicable to Vlatkoto) - Phases of grief: 1. Denial 2. Anger 3. Bargaining 4. Depression 5. Acceptance. Long way to go... --Tēlex 16:44, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

Wow Telex, you really are an enciclopedia. Wow :-).--Vlatko 18:41, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

Image Tagging for Image:Bitola New coat.JPG

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This is an automated notice by OrphanBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. 11:05, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Hey man, I think it would be best if you wrote to the Bitola regional government asking them what license the coat of arms is under. Another option would be to copy the image in a software program such as inkscape to produce an original version. The output should be in SVG format. See here:

"A coat of arms can be depicted in multiple ways, and may only be used on Wikipedia if the design is available under a free licence. Otherwise, the depiction is not usable on Wikipedia, as a free equivalent should be producible, and it thus does not qualify as fair use."

In this case, the coat of arms can be depicted, but not in the version produced by someone else. Does that make sense, feel free to ask if you are confused... - FrancisTyers · 22:27, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Ok, this "making yourself" only applies to coats-of-arms, and if you are uploading coats-of-arms they should really be in SVG format. Making them in this format is a good way to show that they are made by you and not copied from some other site. My advice: download inkscape and make a copy then upload as SVG. - FrancisTyers · 12:15, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Image Tagging for Image:MKD Coats (Prilep).svg

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This is an automated notice by OrphanBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. 19:08, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Ok, I licensed it under {{GFDL-user}}, I hope that is ok for you... - FrancisTyers · 19:26, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Policy

See WP:USER. - FrancisTyers · 17:12, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

License tagging for Image:MKD muni flag(Bitola).png

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Yo my man :))

kaj si be cimo.So praas?So ima po Wikipediava?:))Jas imam(nemam) nikakov internet i ne mozam nitu email da pisam nitu SMS.Pa aj si rekov ovdeka :).So ima po bugarijata?So napraj so ispitite?Nie ovde rabotime po celi denoj :(( i to e.Pozdravi gi site pa se slusame :).Cao <<<Written by Prilepski Munky ;-)>>>

Aman be, znaes le deka sekoj den si proveruvam postata da vida dali si pisal neso, ka taka da nemas internet , hehehe, e ke prezivees. A be so da kaza zesko pa od ucenje glava ne digame, imam oste 4 ispita, site na ppravka, samo za SAA neznam oti cak u sreda ke dava rezultata pa zatava go stavam u taa grupa. Inace arno , pieme kafeta dime po diskoteki i taka, Juleto so prai, renda le zelka, a ti banani jades le, a? Pozdrav. i pisaj pa. ele mi znaes emailo ako ne pisaj mi na Ragnarok.vt@gmail.com

Hej

Vidim da vrlo dobro poznajes srpski, pa se nadam da ti nece smetati da ovako pricamo. Ja se ne razumem mnogo u taj citav konflikt oko Makedonije, da li bi mogao malo da mi, ukratko, objasnis u cemu je problem i koje je najbolje resenje problemu? --serbiana - talk 05:33, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

Ok, nema problem, problem je u ovome, user Telex je od Arvanitovo poreklo, a to znace da je on Albanac, vidi Arvanite, takodje se on oseca i Grk. E sada u ustava Makedonije stoji da svaki drugi jezik koje se govori od vise 20% stanovnika je takodje oficijalan, no samo onoliko oficijalan kako sto je definisano sa zakonom i sa ostatkom od clana 7 od ustava Makedonije, Mislim da neces imati problema sa ovom makedonskom verzijom [ustava, samo clan 7 je pravi problem za darugih koji ga interpretiraju na engleskoj osnovi, od engleskom prevodom. Ostalih problema necemo moci ja i ti da ih resimo, vreme ce pak da si leti kao i do sada. --Vlatko 05:46, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

Article 7

Glad you agree about the template.

Regarding that notorious Article 7, as I see it, every language that's spoken by more than 20% of the total population is an official (службен) language besides Macedonian. Only Albanian suits this definition, so it is an official language (though always together with Macedonian, which means Macedonian is more official :))

Now, possibly the problems come from that long paragraph in the middle — it says every resident of a municipality where >20% of the population speak an official language different from Macedonian.... This is confusing... does that mean Albanian is co-official only in the municipalities where it is spoken by more than 20% of these certain municipalites' population (in addition to being recognized as official for being spoken by more than 20% of the total population)? What confuses me is that you have municipalities where languages that are not co-official country-wide (like Romany in Šuto Orizari municipality) are co-official regionally, and this doesn't seem to conform with the way I've interpreted Article 7.

In brief, I'm confused, and it's very likely that your constitution's written that way only to confuse people, so both sides (Macedonians and Albanians) would be satisfied :) Just kidding, but I wouldn't like to go further into that dispute. Todor →Bozhinov 21:26, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

I didn't say that, I said I was confused... three times :) I was just specualting above, and it seems strange. Albanian is certainly the only over-20%-nationally in the country besides Macedonian, so it should be the only other official language besides Macedonian. But regionally recognised languages seem to be co-official regionally although from what I understand only Albanian should be given that right. Well, it's absolutely confusing (~~4th time~~ 5th time)... Todor →Bozhinov 23:02, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

Your source

I've mentioned it on the source page, it sounds highly dubious to me, but if no-one can bring up a good reason to not include it, then we can include it. Btw, do you actually understand the science behind the paper or are you just looking at the conclusion? - FrancisTyers · 09:29, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Read this. - FrancisTyers · 10:06, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

An argument from authority really isn't going to cut it, and if you are just echoing what you read on some extremist site I suggest you change your tack. The letter to Nature I gave you [2] makes quite clear the scientific merit of the paper[s] involved. - FrancisTyers · 11:01, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Did you even bother to read the letter? The study is junk science, like "cold fusion". Come back when you've got a better paper. - FrancisTyers · 11:05, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

What?

Vlatko, what do you want from "the Funk" and me? --Tēlex 18:00, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Support us please

Hello! Could you please support our request at meta: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages (Belarusian - Orthography revision of 1959). Thank you! -- 82.209.xx.xx 10:39, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

Maps

Hey man, I see you've been making some maps for Macedonian municipalities. Please, if you make some more could you name them according to the schema on the Taijk Wikipedia? Also please upload them to commons so we can use them. You can see our work for example here: tg:Вилояти Чашка. We have stubs for all the municipalities made. But some don't have map images :( like for example: tg:Вилояти Желино. Thanks in advance, - FrancisTyers · 22:57, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Template

Well, doesn't it look better now? All that red was very hard on the eyes. --estavisti 13:41, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Image:Ascension of christ.JPG listed for deletion

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Image:Archangel Gabriel .JPG listed for deletion

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acefrizer@yahoo.com

htstuyjr

Image:MKD(LION).gif listed for deletion

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Kalash

Many Kalash claim that they are the direct descendants of Macedonians se Macedonian Descents In Pakistan.AVI [1] and "Pakistani Kalasch Y-Chromosome Haplogroup Frequency" (related to Jugoslaiav Macedonian)" HUMAN RACES CALCULATOR [2].194.236.207.147 18:33, 17 Januari 2007. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 194.236.208.147 (talk) 18:39, 17 January 2007 (UTC).

Second Montenegrin Wikipedia proposal

I have started up a second proposal on the Montenegrin Wikipedia, I think it should be time to restart it. If you want to vote, the link is: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages/Wikipedia_Montenegrin_2

Just wanted to let you know. Thanks again. --Crna Gora 06:45, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

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