User talk:RoundSquare/Archive 1

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I have sent you a note about a page you started

{{subst:Sentnote-NPF|1=Cynthia A. Johnson|2=Onel5969|3=Please take a look at how to do references and footnotes at [[WP:CIT] and WP:CITE.}}

Onel5969 ^{TT me} 01:54, 8 October 2019 (UTC)

I have sent you a note about a page you started

Hello, RoundSquare

Thank you for creating John Cherry III.

User:Willsome429, while examining this page as a part of our page curation process, had the following comments:

Thank you for creating the page, much appreciated!

To reply, leave a comment here and prepend it with {{Re|Willsome429}}. And, don't forget to sign your reply with ~~~~ .

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Willsome429 (say hey or see my edits!) 14:20, 5 November 2019 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Michael C. Taylor

The article Michael C. Taylor has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Fails WP:NPOL.

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. John from Idegon (talk) 19:50, 9 November 2019 (UTC)

Autopatrolled granted

Hi RoundSquare, I just wanted to let you know that I have added the "autopatrolled" permission to your account, as you have created numerous, valid articles. This feature will have no effect on your editing, and is simply intended to reduce the workload on new page patrollers. For more information on the autopatrolled right, see Wikipedia:Autopatrolled. Feel free to leave me a message if you have any questions. Happy editing! Beeblebrox (talk) 19:48, 17 November 2019 (UTC)

Counties

Generally, counties should not be used to identify locations of birth/death unless there are two similarly-named places within a state (in which case it would be disambiguated in the article titles). I suggest you go back and correct them in your articles. You should also tag them with the appropriate WikiProjects on the talk page (e.g. {{WikiProject Biography}}) for tracking purposes. SounderBruce 20:59, 24 November 2019 (UTC)

Nomination of Michael C. Taylor for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Michael C. Taylor is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Michael C. Taylor until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. John Pack Lambert (talk) 03:24, 30 November 2019 (UTC)

Reverted Edits

Hello. I reverted two of your edits because that appeared to be inaccurate. I you chose to undo this change please provide a source supporting this edit. Please take care to see that your edits improve the accuracy of the articles.--Truthtests (talk) 19:13, 19 February 2020 (UTC)

ITN recognition for Isaac Robinson (politician)

On 31 March 2020, In the news was updated with an item that involved the article Isaac Robinson (politician), which you created. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the candidates page. Indefensible (talk) 21:00, 31 March 2020 (UTC)

Years in Michigan

Thanks very much for your efforts yesterday on the years in Michigan articles. Some years are better developed than others, and more work is needed should you care to do so. Best, Cbl62 (talk) 17:18, 12 May 2020 (UTC)

Help with new articles

I appreciate that you are working to get new information on Wikipedia. However, you add to the enormous backlog of improperly sourced or unsourced information that burdens already overworked editors. Please do not create articles with information that is not sourced. For example, I just edited an article you created about Charles C. Johnson where you wrote that "at somepoint..." he was elected to something and then you wrote that the details of his death are unknown. First, "somepoint" is not a word, and second, if you don't have a source providing information, don't include it. If there are no sources accounting for the details of a person's death, don't write anything. If a person lived in the 1800s, we know he or she is dead. Writing that you don't have information regarding that person's death contributes nothing, is unsourced, and will require someone like me to go behind you, search exhaustively for information that supports your statement, then delete it when none is found.

Looking at your talk page, it is clear that you create a lot of work for other people. Your articles are often listed for deletion and you have already been requested to properly source your information, so you know what is right but are clearly choosing to disregard it.

Your interest in Wikipedia is commendable, but please, do it the right way.

The rule of thumb is this: if you can't source it, don't write it. Thank you for contributing to Wikipedia. God bless and happy editing! MarydaleEd (talk) 23:22, 30 August 2020 (UTC)

@MarydaleEd: Hello. I have some comments about this inclusion on my talk page, some of which I'd appreciate responses to so that I may improve my Wikipedia editing.

1. I thank you for letting me know that I should not leave a section about someone's death being unknown. I can see how that might imply more than I meant it to. I will remove such an addition from any article I may have included one in.

2. The statement you removed from the Charles C. Johnson article that contained the word "somepoint" was cited, though potentially improperly. The full sentence amounted to the fact that Johnson was once supervisor of Mecosta Township. This is in the source authored by the Michigan Historical Commission. The source does not list a specific time that Johnson served as supervisor, so I wrote that it happened "at somepoint", with a small typo. Was there a better way to cite this? If so, how so?

3. You say that my articles are "often listed for deletion." The only article I know that have made that has been listed for deletion (then eventually was deleted) was for Sterling Heights Mayor Michael C. Taylor. This was because I did not initially understand the notability requirements of Wikipedia. I now understand them better. Have other articles of mine been listed for deletion? If so what ones, and how would I check?

This sums up the comments I have in regard to this addition to my talk page. Thank you for noting improper practices I've partaken in, and I'd appreciate an answer to some of the questions I have asked. RoundSquare (talk) 00:51, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

I'm happy to help! Regarding the comment of Johnson being a supervisor of Mecosta Township, write simply "Johnson served as supervisor of Mecosta Township" and put your citation at the end of it and you've done a lovely job! When writing articles, people often feel pressure to compensate for information they feel is missing from the source, like the element of time. Don't be afraid to write in short and concise sentences. I hope this helps, and feel free to reach out to me if you ever have writing questions. I've been a professional editor for more than 35 years and I love to help writers. God bless and happy editing! MarydaleEd (talk) 01:45, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

@MarydaleEd: Alright, thank you, this will be helpful, but I have one more question. You also removed the statement that Charles C. Johnson had received an education from common schools. This is also something that is stated in the source authored by the Michigan Historical Commission. I also am not sure how I might have improved my citation of that fact. It appeared like so:

Johnson was born on October 3, 1864 in Plainwell, Michigan. Johnson received an education from common schools. In 1886, Johnson moved to Mecosta Township, Michigan.[CITATION]

What would be a way to properly cite this fact? As far as I know, I shouldn't have to put a citation marker after every sentence if all the facts in one paragraph come from one source. If I should, then why was the sentence about his education removed, but the sentence about his date and place of birth kept where it was? RoundSquare (talk) 02:11, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

We need to remember that in Wikipedia we want to provide verifiable facts that can be understood by even the casual reader. The phrase "common schools" is an archaic, 19th century reference to what we now call public schools. Therefore, we need to either provide a short explanation to what the phrase "common schools" means, or we need to paraphrase. In this case, it is unnecessary to belabor the minor point with a unwieldy explanation, so paraphrasing would be the choice. Let's return that information to the article by writing "Johnson was born on October 3, 1864 in Plainwell, Michigan, and was educated in public schools. In 1886, he moved to Mecosta Township, Michigan.[CITATION]

Thank you for your persistence in making this a good article for Wikipedia. God bless and happy editing! MarydaleEd (talk) 17:38, 1 September 2020 (UTC)

Thank you and Blizzardwind for your work on Michigan House and Senate districts

I just wanted to write by thanking you for doing this. I wish more people like you guys would create every state house/senate districts for all 50 states. I noticed you stopped making new articles around the sametime as Blizzardwind did. Are you currently taking a break? Dillon251992 (talk) 20:41, 11 October 2020 (UTC)

@Dillon251992: I can't speak for RoundSquare (we don't know each other in real life), but I'm back at college after 6 months at home with little to do, so I've got way more work and way less time to do Wikipedia. Once I find the time again, though, I'll definitely be back at it. Also that Ballotpedia link is great, I'll be sure to use it! Blizzardwind (talk) 20:57, 11 October 2020 (UTC)

@Blizzardwind: I know you two don't know eachother in real life, I just saw you two talking to eachother on your talk page which is why I tagged you to thank you aswell on RoundSquare's talk page. I'm glad you responded. I didn't expect a quick response. Looking foward to seeing more of your articles. Dillon251992 (talk) 23:01, 11 October 2020 (UTC)

I also wanted to add, if you ever need infomation on the dates each candidate took office, use this link. It tells you the days that they are sworn in for each state as they have references in each of the 50 state's consitution. https://ballotpedia.org/When_state_legislators_assume_office_after_a_general_election

fixed your article on Allison Nutting-Wong on the day she took office from the 34th district. Dillon251992 (talk) 20:50, 11 October 2020 (UTC)

Hello @Dillon251992:! Thank you for the appreciation! Similarly to Blizzardwind, the reason I'm not editing Wikipedia as much is because I've just hit a busier time in my life. I'll return when I can though, I assure you! I plan to improve some of the Michigan House District pages made by other people while I've been gone. They aren't bad, but they do lack some of the info I like to put on them, such as a full list of people who have held the office since 1965. Also, thank you for the Ballotpedia link. That kind of information isn't super easy to come by, and the listed inaugural date for state legislators is often reported as different things by different outlets. This will make that info a lot easier to find out. Something else that's in serious need of representing on Wikipedia is state legislature election pages. I want to contribute in that regard, but the info can be hard to track, and it's kind of a pain considering just 1 election can have you putting in at least 220 results.RoundSquare (talk) 00:35, 12 October 2020 (UTC)

@RoundSquare:! Thank you for the quick response. As I said to Blizzardwind, I didn't expect you both to get back to me within a short time. Regarding the Michigan House Districts and politicans, if you want to know the deaths of some politicans from the past since I seen created one that didn't have a death date. I would go to https://www.ancestry.com/ or https://michiganology.org/. I tried to help out with Charles C. Johnson but couldn't find anything, I might had found 1 result but I'm not going to pay a membership for it on https://www.ancestry.com/. Finding birthdates can be hard at times and rarely any archives from state's website has them doucmented in a orgainzed way. I know Texas has it semi-orgranized because I fixed a few articles. Like I said before, hope to see you back soon! Dillon251992 (talk) 17:42, 13 October 2020 (UTC)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Daisy Elliott

A tag has been placed on Category:Daisy Elliott requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because the category has been empty for seven days or more and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 13:56, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

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Sources for e.g. guberntorial elections

Hi, It is perfectly possible to search for text and words within the Library of Congress' collection of newspapers, see the following link: https://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/ - you see you can limit the search to a particular year, to a state, and then to any collection of words. I usually limit the year to the one of the election, then input the name of the victorious candidate (either at the election, or in the case of who won nomination, at the convention/primary) as my search. I have not needed much more sophistication than that to achieve the results I have. FieldOfWheat (talk) FieldOfWheat (talk) 12:45, 1 April 2021 (UTC)

Hello @FieldOfWheat:! Thank you for responding to me. I did not know of this search feature. This should be very useful to me. Thank you.RoundSquare (talk) 15:38, 1 April 2021 (UTC)

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Michigan's 38th House of Representatives district

added a link pointing to Lyon Township, Michigan

Michigan's 47th House of Representatives district

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No edit comment

Why did you remove this line? The commit had no comment to tell me. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Lorenzo_T._Durand&curid=64299095&diff=1026503466&oldid=1017947087&diffmode=source —¿philoserf? (talk) 17:42, 2 June 2021 (UTC)

Hello, @Philoserf:. I removed the line because it had information cited from Find a Grave. In my older articles, I used to use Find a Grave as a reference, but I somewhat recently realized I shouldn't, because of the reasons on this supplement: Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources. I have not yet gone through my all of my old pages and totally removed references to Find a Grave, but when its an easy, small part of the article to remove, I generally do it now. I'm sorry, I've never been in the habit of making comments on edits, unless its removing someone else's edits. I need to get better at that. I hope this helped. RoundSquare (talk) 18:22, 2 June 2021 (UTC)

thank you —¿philoserf? (talk) 21:06, 2 June 2021 (UTC)

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Here a picture depictin your username for you

	Round Square
	All the best. Keep up the good work! V. E. (talk) 18:46, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

Deleting details and replacing them with generalizations

Why would you delete a more detailed explanation and narrow it to a very generalized term? Wiki is about giving details, like the subject or not. You show subjectivity and wiki is about objectivity.

Hello @City Lights Press:. I assume you're talking about my recent edits to short descriptions. I am editing detailed language in short descriptions into generalizations because short descriptions are what the name implies they should be: short. It is important for an article to go into specific, detailed information about its subject, but a short description is supposed to be a very general and short description of the subject. A short description is supposed to be less than 40 characters, as can be seen here: Wikipedia:Short description#Formatting. It is important for a short description to be short, because they are used to improve the Wikipedia experience on mobile, something that does not work well if they are long. The short description for the Ignacio Pena Del Rio article was 101 characters, more than twice the recommended length. My edits in this regard are not notably "subjective", and reflect well established Wikipedia consensus. Detailed information is for the body of an article, not the short description. RoundSquare (talk) 15:31, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

Ok, you are right about the charracter length, 101 is well over the 40 limit. — Preceding unsigned comment added by City Lights Press (talk • contribs) 18:10, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

The Esoterrorists

Why did you remove the type (tabletop) and genre (horror) from the The Esoterrorists short description? Was there a policy rationale? Newimpartial (talk) 18:47, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

Hello @Newimpartial: Yes, there was. As can be seen here, Wikipedia:Short description#Formatting, Wikipedia short descriptions should generally be less than 40 characters. The previous short description was 47 characters, which is notably over the limit. However, now that you mention it, I think I was a little over zealous in the shortening of the description. "Tabletop role-playing game by Robin Laws" is exactly 40 characters, and contains the important information of game type. I will change it to this now. RoundSquare (talk) 19:04, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

That sounds good. Newimpartial (talk) 19:50, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

Contemporary articles

I noticed your query on User talk:FieldOfWheat from a few months ago. You may already know this, or have answered your query otherwise, but Newspapers.com is available for some editors through the the Wikipedia library. You have to apply for it, but it is much more manageable than the Library of Congress in that they apply OCR to all of the texts they import. It's been an amazing resource.

Just thought to drop a line. Hope you're well, Urve (talk) 16:42, 17 July 2021 (UTC)

Hello @Urve: Thank you for the suggestion. I had heard of this before, but I didn't take a good look at it. I just looked at it closer, and now realize I meet criteria. RoundSquare (talk) 21:33, 17 July 2021 (UTC)

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Michigan Senate districts

Have you thought about listing the Past State Senators for each State Senate district Blizzardwind made for Michigan? I know I brought up his name last time in a different topic. I basically did that for all of California's 40 Senate districts dating back to 1883 and all of California's 80 State Assembly districts. I saw that you wrote in Wikiproject US State Legislatures about wanting a category for the Confederate State Legislators and I gave my feed back on that. I don't know if you started working on that yet, but I thought I ask before you start it. Would you be interested in working on listing the Michigan Senators for each of the 38th districts? Dillon251992 (talk) 19:11, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Hello @Dillon251992: I have considered it, but I haven't done it yet because of the difficulty. I did it with the Michigan House districts because it was fairly easy. The Michigan House districts, as we know them today, were created in 1965, so it was was not too challenging to make a full list. Michigan Senate districts are harder because they've existed since statehood, and the general resources to find out who was senator when going further back before about 1960 is clunkier, and difficult to navigate. I likely will eventually do it, making a list of all of them since at least 1965, but I am a bit busy with other things in my life at the moment. If you'd like to take a stab at it, I can provide you with some resources to get you started. Also, congratulations on listing the California State Senators, great job! RoundSquare (talk) 20:33, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

This is true since it takes a lot of work, I just thought maybe since you were done with Michigan that maybe you could list the senators to for each of the districts. You are correct about some states having their house districts created since the 1960s that are listed as numbers. Before that it went by counties. For my state, it was easy because there was a database called joincalifornia.com which lists them all. I don't know if Michigan has it that you're not aware of, but if you have some resources to help me get started. That would be great. I wouldn't mind doing that. And thank you! It took me 3 months to do the member listing for both Senate and Assembly districts. Dillon251992 (talk) 18:03, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Hello @Dillon251992: Sorry I did not respond earlier, but here is the help I can provide: The thing is, Michigan DOES have a database of all Michigan state legislators, but it may prove limited in its utility. Firstly, I should note that it does have a good amount of errors, so always be aware of that. Secondly, it has a way to search by the district and chamber of the legislator, but there is no way to SPEFICIALLY search for legislators who served in in a certain chamber's district. For example, if you search for legislators who served in the first district and served in the state senate, it may show you someone who served once in House District 1 and then later in Senate District 29. It also may show you people who served in Senate District 10 or 11, because those districts contain the number 1. There is a way to look at the full rosters of legislative sessions, but they do not separate between senators and representatives in these lists. I'm not sure if I'm explaining it very well, but in short, it is difficult to use for this specific purpose. That being said, here is a list of resources that will be definiely helpful if you decide to try it. I do recommend trying to just do the senators since 1960, it will be far easier:

• Michigan Legislative Biography: this is the resource I've been talking about.
• The Michigan Manuals: These are periodical publications about the Michigan Legislature and its members. It expanded in scope over time, initially only really containing the Michigan Constitution and giving information about the committees legislators served on, to eventually giving biographies of every official in the Michigan state government. It is an incomplete list, but most of them are there. Note: These seem have been released not long after elections, so if there was a senator who resigned or died in office, it may not note that change.
• Official Michigan Website: This provides some access to more recent Michigan manuals that are not yet public domain. It also has a list of legislators by session WITH a distinction between representatives and senators, so that is good. It does not provide access to anything before 1960, however, so keep that in mind.
• Full List of Michigan Legislators: A full list of all Michigan legislators to 2019 in one PDF. Could be handy.

That's it I think. One more important note however: Modern Michigan State Senators serve a term of 4 years, and have a term limit of 2 terms. Until I think 1963, state senators served 2 year terms, and they did not have term limits until I think 1993. I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any additional questions. Good luck! RoundSquare (talk) 02:02, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

Hey no @RoundSquare: worries, my apologizes for the late reply. I'm not surprised there's a lot of errors. Although there is some cases as you said that some districts move around which I get. The number stays the name, the location doesn't. And yes California has had that too where you had Senators served for 2 years and a Assembly member had served for 1 years before 1862. So thank you for this info. Maybe I'll start working on it or help you out if you happen to start it. For now I just been adding infoboxs for Kansas State Legislators. Dillon251992 (talk) 21:54, 31 December 2021 (UTC)

Draft:Didwho Welleh Twe

Hey RoundSquare! Found your information through WikiProject Liberia. We have an article in Draftspace that is definitely notable, but needs a massive rewrite and wikification. Is that something that you might be interesting in taking on? Bkissin (talk) 17:00, 3 January 2022 (UTC)

@Bkissin: Hello. Thank you for bringing this to my attention. The specific subject, candidate Twe, is in kind of a difficult spot in history for me to research, as a large chunk of his life existed outside of the time of public domain documents, but using resources from Wikipedia Library, I may be able to participate in a re-write and at least get a quality Start class article out about the subject, if that is acceptable. I'm about to become a bit more busy very soon, so it may not be very timely, but I'll do what I can. Also, sorry, but I've never been consulted on a thing like this, if I wanted to propose a change to the draftspace, can I just start editing, can I propose a whole new draft instead of editting the existing one? RoundSquare (talk) 19:06, 3 January 2022 (UTC)

@RoundSquare:, it should be pretty well-sourced at this point. I think it's just a question of taking care of some of the wording (A review of his life shows that he was an advocate of Liberian native rights and the first Liberian of full tribal background to officially and openly seek the Liberian presidency) is a little iffy for me, so if you can think of other ways to phrase some of the aspects of the article as it currently stands, that would be super helpful. Adding wikilinks would be helpful too. To answer your question, you can go ahead and edit right in draftspace in the existing article. There is no need to create a new draft. I also totally understand if this is too much to take on right now. I'll do my part fixing some of the parenthetical citations and replacing them with inline citations. Happy editing! Bkissin (talk) 19:45, 3 January 2022 (UTC)

@Bkissin: Its true the article does have a good amount of sources. One problem with this is, however, is some of the books referenced don't seem to have page numbers listed, making it kind of hard to check the information. I also have some concerns with some of the sources. Particularly, the link attached to the citation "History of Liberia, the Fernando Po Crisis" is blocked by my browser for security reasons, and I feel that should either be changed, archived, or something else to make it more safe for the user.

Other than this, I'm understanding that the main mission of this article is to generally fix the format and neutrality of it? I agree that the quotation you have provided needs work. As another example of a sentence from the draftspace that needs change, I think this would qualify: (Twe was without fault or contradiction.) This proceeds the passage about his relation to Matilda Newport Day. This sentence seems very against the idea of neutrality. Am I on the right track with the kind of things that need to be changed, do you think? RoundSquare (talk) 20:06, 3 January 2022 (UTC)

@RoundSquare: Exactly! My main ask from you is to generally fix format and neutrality. I did my best to turn the references into inline citations. I agree with your security concerns. There are also several that were primary source documents. That is definitely a larger group effort, but right now my focus is getting it good and neutral enough to get through the AfC process. As a reviewer, I wouldn't accept it in its current form because of the neutrality issues. Normally we would ask the original editor to make those changes, but it also looks like this is probably their first article, so I wanted to bring in an experienced user. Bkissin (talk) 21:02, 3 January 2022 (UTC)

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