User talk:Icarosaurvus/Archive 1

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Welcome!

Welcome to Wikipedia, Icarosaurvus! Thank you for your contributions. I am Cwobeel and I have been editing Wikipedia for some time, so if you have any questions feel free to leave me a message on my talk page. You can also check out Wikipedia:Questions or type {{help me}} at the bottom of this page. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

Also, when you post on talk pages you should sign your name using four tildes (~~~~); that will automatically produce your username and the date. I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! - Cwobeel (talk) 02:25, 21 August 2014 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:List of The Simpsons episodes

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Hello, Icarosaurvus. You have new messages at Keithbob's talk page.
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Please comment on Talk:Gaza flotilla raid

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Dispute on the Bob Avakian page

Hi Icarosaurvus, this is EnRealidad, the user who has been involved in the dispute over the Bob Avakian page. I'm really new to the "Notice Board" process and am trying to figure out how to proceed, both practically (e.g. who do I write to, where do I post, etc.) and also how to move forward with the content of the dispute itself. I have had a chance to digest the comments from Keithbob about the page, and also saw the note from Icarosaurvus that he/she has volunteered to moderate the dispute.

I have some thoughts about Keithbob's comments, especially the question of references to primary sources, and while I think there is merit to the Wiki standards on this question, I don't think it can be simply or mechanically applied in this case where there's a question of presenting the actual views of the living person featured in this biography. My objections to many of the edits made in the past were that they distorted the positions of Avakian in a way that substituted the views of the other editors for Avakian's views, making it seem like he was advocating positions or presenting opinions that were actually quite different (and in some cases directly in opposition) to what he has actually had to say. That's part of the reason for citations to his own writings.

In any case, I don't have time now for a long response but definitely would like to be actively involved in additional discussion on the page and any edits or proposed edits occur. Can you let me know the best way to do this? I posted these same thoughts to Keithbob's Talk page but am not sure the best way to go forward. Thanks in advance. EnRealidad (talk) 14:48, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

Keithbob and Icarosaurvus,

I wrote to both of you a few days ago about moderating the dispute on the Bob Avakian page that was requested by Xcure1fendx. I haven't heard back from you, but wanted to see if you'll get involved more actively. (If I posted it incorrectly, my apologies. I'm somewhat new at this.)

My particular concern is that after Keithbob posted his thoughts on what was needed in terms of edits to the page, an editor named Cwobeel removed two major sections without any comments about why. I reverted the page to what it had been, then Xcure1fendx removed the same sections, removed all links to writings of Avakian that are listed, and also did some small edits to the "Claims of 'Cult of Personality' page. Xcuref1endx's only explanation for the changes (and for reverting my reversions of Cwobeel's edits) were that Keithbob had recommended changes.

It seems to me this is violating the whole notion of "dispute resolution". I take Keithbob's comments seriously. But I also understood this to be a process, not a fait accompli.

For example, I disagree with Keithbob's comments about removing some of the citations to Avakian's own writings and talks. I think that in a case like this were we are dealing with a living person with very controversial views, there is a need to reference his own writings and talks in order to accurately capture what he has to say.

That was the source of my disagreements with a whole series of edits by Xcuref1endx in late 2011 and early 2012 where he had rewritten extensive sections of the page in ways that might have captured his/her own views, but were decidedly different than Avakian's. I thoroughly explained each change and why I felt the Xcuref1endx edits distorted Avakian's views.

(I find it a bit ironic that Xcuref1endx keeps complaining that there is little controversy about Avakian's ideas outside those affiliated with the Revolutionary Communist Party that Avakian leads, yet he/she seems determined to keep editing the page in a way that favors his/her views over Avakian's.)

Anyway, I would like to engage in some actual, constructive discussion on Keithbob's suggestions, as well as those of others. I am not that familiar with Wiki protocol and don't know how this is done, so I'd appreciate any advice and instructions on how to go about this. But in the meantime, I don't think it is appropriate for Xcuref1endx to simply act on suggestions in a way that implies they are orders from on high and the case is closed on any differences.

EnRealidad (talk) 17:47, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

Hello, EnRealidad. I am sorry for volunteering to help resolve this, and then vanishing. I have become quite unexpectedly and drastically ill, as of late, and have not felt up to any manner of intellectual discourse. It may be some time until I am back to health, and I apologize for the delays in any resolution being found. Icarosaurvus (talk) 00:21, 15 September 2014 (UTC)

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This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.