User talk:Eduard Tratt

Eduard Tratt

So how can I help you? I have a question regarding the removal of citations. Why did you remove them? Surely you understand the principles of Wikipedia. All information posted on Wikipedia is subject to WP:Verifiability—The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth—whether readers can check that material in Wikipedia has already been published by a reliable source, not whether editors think it is true.—which means if its not written somewhere and not verifiable by the reader it is subject to deletion, whereas cited information prevails. Now, this doesn't mean that the sources are correct, and as a relative you may have more insight into the matter than others. But accusing me or others on Wikipedia of "DO NOT mess up with the family = the relatives of Major Eduard Tratt!!!" is impolite and wrong! The information posted on the article was based on the sources referenced. I suggest that you provide verifiable evidence for the changes you made. Thank you and good day. MisterBee1966 (talk) 06:22, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

Hm, I am not sure if I can fully follow your reasoning. I do not consider myself a researcher; if I were Wikipedia would not be the right forum. Wikipedia can only present information that is already published somewhere else. I do acknowledge that the information you have access to, is more reliable than the information published. I cannot and I do not want to challenge this. Whether or not you are a relative of Eduard Tratt makes no difference to the fact that you have to provide ample evidence, please read WP:Verifiability. Contradicting information is a frequent problem that Wikipedia has to deal with. Normally what editors do here is to place footnotes in the article indicating the discrepancy. Example: According to your information Mr Tratt was a warded the German Cross in Gold while holding the rank of Hauptmann. I have to take your word on this. On the other hand author Veit Scherzer has published a book, which claims (right or wrong I cannot judge), that he held the rank of Oberleutnant. The correct thing to do here would be to place a footnote in the article which could read something like "According to a member of the family as Hauptmann and not Oberleutnant as stated by Scherzer". Would you feel comfortable with such an approach? I assume that you are interested in improving the article. MisterBee1966 (talk) 15:02, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

I truly don't understand your offensive attitude towards me. I don't intend to discredit you or the honour of Eduard Tratt. I repeat: Whether or not the sources have been synchronized with the family record is above and beyond my knowledge. Whether the sources speak the truth or not is also above and beyond my knowledge. Whether you are who you claim you are is also above and beyond my knowledge and I don't intend to find out either. I am not a historian nor do I consider myself as such. All I try to do is come to terms with the rules of Wikipedia which are based on verifiability. Is this always the best choice? Probably not but those are the rules here and it means to find a workable compromise between what you claim is right and what the average layman can read in the sources. Since you appear to be very knowledgeable, I would like to know from you which of sources you consider truthful? Is Obermaier a valid source for information? What about Fellgiebel or Scherzer? Please stick to English; this is the English Wikipedia not the German. MisterBee1966 (talk) 16:44, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

Some of the recent posts on this page, made by you, User:Eduard Tratt, are highly unhelpful. You claim to be a family member. I have no reason to believe this is not correct. But please be clear, it does not matter whether you are Eduard Tratt himself, you need secondary sources to dispute any cited information. Arbitrary removals of cited information are not acceptable under any circumstances. Removals can only be made if the source is known for unreliability or consensus is reached after discourse.

There is no excuse for not complying with the conduct Misterbee1966 alludes to above. If your edits continue to remove information without proof they are unreliable, they will be reverted as unconstructive. Let us not allow this to get out of hand. Dapi89 (talk) 19:11, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

Your recent edits

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