User talk:DrTrigon/Archive 1

BAGBot: Your bot request DrTrigonBot

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FideID task

The FideID task is running extremely well per specifications. I note, however, that in instances like this, the remaining text in the ranking parameter is not a numerical ranking but rather a month/year when the ranking was obtained; thus, there are two such annotations, one from FIDE and one from the ranking parameter. Would you like me, once this task is done, to do another quick run and remove the rating parameter in such cases? Thanks, — madman 15:48, 10 February 2012 (UTC)

Yes I think this is the logic consequence; I think another quick run would be advisable in order to keep things consistent. Thanks for your carefulness!! (since I myself forgot to think about cases like this ;)

Btw.: Another question - just out of curiosity; what tool do you use for those 'Assited edits'? The deeper reason for this question is that I am operating a/some bot(s) myself: User:DrTrigonBot (as you may have recognized already ;) Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 16:34, 10 February 2012 (UTC)

I run a custom script for each requested task, built on top of a bot framework I'm writing. So each request I fulfill helps me flesh out the framework a little more. :) I'll do that second run when I can; the Toolserver is currently undergoing maintenance. Cheers! — madman 17:12, 10 February 2012 (UTC)

I'm taking a break from the task at the moment because I have a couple other things that urgently need my attention. Plus the diffs are starting to blur together. :P

I have a few notes:

• The task may have inadvertently removed a few comments from the infobox template early on; nothing serious, just reminders that images can't be non-free, etc. It was a minor enough issue that I finished the batch I was working on then fixed the comment handling in the template parser.
• Speaking of which, you'll see in the diffs that parameters unrelated to the task may be touched by it; that's an artifact of the template parser, which actually parses the template to XML, changes it, then writes it back out as wikitext. It seems counter-intuitive, but that's actually how MediaWiki parses it, and it ensures that the template and its parameters are read correctly no matter how they're formatted. Another benefit is that it highlights templates with odd formatting (without breaking them).
• After you replied here, I changed the task so it removes the rating parameter if it's redundant (e.g. month year) and not if it's additional information (e.g. No. # in the rankings). In a few cases, I had the task remove the rating parameter even though (inactive) would have otherwise been kept. I just thought it looked odd seeing the FIDE rating then (January 2012) then (inactive). If this is a problem, I can flag those diffs and fix them.
• When the entire task is finished I'll re-run it on the first batch to remove rating parameters that should be removed per the new logic.
• I had no idea SO MANY ARTICLES would be affected by this task! :P But I don't begrudge it; I'd have to tackle a semi-automated task of this scope eventually to iron out the edge cases in my template parser, and now I'm confident it can be used in automated tasks. :) I can't even imagine trying to do all this manually.

Cheers! — madman 20:13, 10 February 2012 (UTC)

• So I assume you are using one of those; C, C++, C#, Perl, PHP...? I my self build on pywikipedia framework (since I am not professional enough to write YABF "yet another bot framework" ;))... But if you e.g. use C, C++ the code could also be of interesst to python guys like me... ;)
• I recognized the re-formating of paramters e.g. inserting some whitespaces and so on - I myself prefer that since it makes everything more consistent (e.g. for machine parsing ;) and as I understand you should not do minor changes only - so this is the perfect opportunity to do both; cosmetics and really useful things... :)
• Regarding the additional rating parameters; I think you did very well exept may be the '(inactive)' should have been keeped - but you are right it looks strange to have e.g. '.. (January 2012) (inactive)' may be just use other brackets e.g. '[inactive]'? May be we should ask Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Chess#Automatic updated FIDE rating in infobox (by bot) for other opinions...?
• What do you mean by "SO MANY ARTICLES"? I should be something about 1000 articles using the Infobox, but I think not all of them meet our conditions... But that is just a rough estimate... Was it that wrong? (How many did you change/update so far?)
• To be honest; first I though about doing it manually since it is a one-time task - but since I run a bot myself I casted this idea away very fast... ;) And that is also the reason why I am asking you questions about your framework... ;) Since I would be able to do something in pywikipedia (no question) but it would take definitely too long to write the code (just to use it once... ;) That is finally the reason why I came up with this request... ;))) ... so I tried to "imagine [...] to do all this manually" but it was not enjoyable... :))
• Thanks again for all your hard and good work here - without you I think we would have to wait for years to get this done finally. There are people out there, that used to use the new system already - but even they would have to spend halve of their lives to go through all articles (brave people! ;) ... Thanks and Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 10:59, 11 February 2012 (UTC)

It looks like 438 or so have been done already (a few might have to be hit again to remove month/year). {{Fide}} is still present on some 750 articles, so it looks like your estimate was pretty spot-on. I've been reviewing every single diff, though, so it's been a little slow going. I did hope to get some done today, but my significant other was over and Wikipedia takes second place. ;) But it can be stopped/resumed at any time, and I should be able to get a good amount done in the next couple days. And most of my bot tasks are written in PHP. If you're interested I can post the code for the task somewhere for you to look at. I'm not posting the framework yet as it's shamefully incomplete, but I'll be putting it in my SVN repository on the Toolserver when it's a little more polished. Cheers! — madman 04:50, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

 Done with 570 articles. I can give you a log of all articles with {{Infobox chess biography}} that were skipped, either because there was no {{Fide}} template on the page or because the rating didn't meet the threshold. I'll do a quick run tomorrow to clear any redundant (Month Year) information in ratings; I already restored (inactive) to any articles from which it was removed. Looks like we're done. Cheers! — madman 02:03, 14 February 2012 (UTC)

Sorry for not answering that long - now my exams are over but the new semester starts already too... ;)

In principal I am intressted and will have a look at the svn repo (if setup) - but I am using python and not php (thats the problem)... But may be I should consider looking into php finally - may be after lua... :)) But would be cool it you would push it online somewhen!

Thank you again and A LOT for finishing this task! The list of skipped articles could be of some interesst to the guys at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Chess. Yeah that's very cool - now all the work my bot does is of some use! ;)) Greetings and thanks, thanks, thanks! --DrTrigon (talk) 00:22, 19 February 2012 (UTC)

 Done

Adding RSS Feeds to Wikipedia

Is it possible to add RSS feeds of external pages to Wikipedia? If so, how is that done? Can DrTrigonBot do that? Is there some code to use? Thank you for your help. Allen (talk) 23:38, 17 February 2012 (UTC)
(moved from User talk:DrTrigonBot)

Yes that should be no problem. There are already 2 examples (I am aware of) doing this, you can look at them to get an idea (and may be already implement) on how doing this:

• w:de:Wikipedia:Wikimedia Deutschland e. V./Blog
• w:ar:ويكيبيديا:برنامج_ويكيميديا_للتعليم/آخر_التطورات (tests on: w:de:Benutzer:Tbayer (WMF)/Identi.ca/wikimedia)

basically there is more than one way of doing this (but all examples mentioned use the same way) so we should be able to find a solution - but you have to give me an example and more info about your concept. Thanks and Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 00:44, 19 February 2012 (UTC)

Thank you for the good word!

What I would like is to have an updated feed of my user page on Listal or an individual user list page from that site. Basically, if the page gets changed, I want the RSS feed to update.

Any help you could provide would be great.

As for those examples you provided, I couldn't use them. I only read English.

Allen (talk) 02:53, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

No problem! It makes me happy if my bot/work is of any use (finally)... ;)

The updated feed should be easy to implement (depends on your exact wishes at the end ;). Thus you have to provide a link to your feed or 'user list page'. The bot runs once a day (daily) and updates your page here in the wiki if something on your feed has changed.

Further help can be found on User:DrTrigonBot/Subster and in the examples given - as you may imagine I am not able to read arabian (even the right to left flip is hard for me) but in order to understand the bot and whats going on you don't have to understand the content of some aribrary strings, you have to understand the 'programming language', which is in fact english... E.g. for both examples on the German wiki ('de'), most content is bot related only and language independent or english (ok, except 'Zeigen' but this you can ignore). But as said before; if you post a link I can set it up for you. Then you got an purely english example too! ;))

Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 14:39, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

Great! I am glad I am this close to getting this to work.

First, I made some new pages to populate with the feeds. So far, I have made User:Morriswa/Listal, which will be used for my Listal user page; User:Morriswa/Listal/Lists, which will be used for my Listal list page; and User:Morriswa/Listal/Favorite CDs, which will be used for my Listal list: "My Favorite CDs". After I see the results, more pages can be started to use for my other Listal lists.

What else do you need to know?

I'm excited to get this started.

Allen (talk) 19:44, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

So I set-up 2 of those pages (bot runs tonight) since for the first one I was not able to spot out which of those lists and informations you wanted to extract. May be you can try it yourself either on substersim or on the w:de:Wikipedia:Sandbox of the German wiki (there the bot is set-up to react on all user changes and return the result). Or just ask me again... ;) Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 21:13, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

Thank you for setting up the 2 pages. What was wrong with the other one?

I think the Toolserver page is too hard to use myself. I looked at it, and I was confused.

If you need more information to correctly set up these pages, please ask me.

Allen (talk) 21:30, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

The first page is a big page with lot of data - what data/info do you want to extract from this page? In other words; there are several colored boxes called "About me, About my collections, Interests, Pictures, ..." which ones of them do you want to import here to wiki? (please do not say all of them... ;)))

Your confusion is somehow bad news form me - what do you think about writing a small and simple howto for 'substersim'? I would be very happy if we could do some docu here in order to support future users...

Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 21:40, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

If the box at the top of the page (title?), "Collection stats", "Recently added", & "Recent reviews" could be added, then that would be cool. I would like all of them, but that must be too hard for you. As for the "substersim", I don't know what it is or how to use it. Allen (talk) 22:15, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

A first example was created in this section with (title?) and "Collection stats" missing. In fact this one can be done, but I would have to think about it for some time - hope you do have some time? What is the dead line? ;)

Btw.: For what project do you need all the stuff? Was there consensus for this task?

Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 23:40, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

There isn't a deadline.

This is my Listal account and list pages.

I never got any consensus of any kind from anyone about this. I just wanted to have some RSS feeds in Wikipedia of my Listal pages.

I'm still technically a novice at some of the "technical" aspects of Wikipedia. That's why I don't know how to use the tools you have tried to get me to use.

When will the bot run?

If you need more help, please let me know. And, thank you for trying to help me.

Allen (talk) 01:54, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Allen, could you explain how these lists are relevant for your work on Wikipedia? You should be aware that Wikipedia is not a social networking site and what's more, some community members might feel quite strongly that inserting multiple links to a third-party site with Amazon Affiliate advertising links is not an appropriate use for a bot. Regards, Tbayer (WMF) (talk) 01:56, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

I think it would be good if I had an update of my Listal pages here on Wikipedia, just in case I'm not on Listal. Allen (talk) 02:27, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

I would like the entries put on my pages to either have images or a piped link. For example, instead of "[1] with 5354894", that entry should say "dc Talk - Greatest Hits", or have an image of the CD's cover (either one linked to the same link, mind you). Allen (talk) 02:27, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Sorry Allen but I have to appologize - I think we have to rollback everything done here. As Tbayer (WMF) pointed out Wikipedia is not a social networking site you must not add any "feed" for your personal usage only (despite the fact that there could be copyright violations and else). Usualy we mirror feeds (and I mean RSS or atom feeds and not a HTML page containing lists - as yours) related to wikipedia here on wikipedia. But it seems to me that this is for your personal use and entertainment only.

In my opinion you have to go back to Wikipedia:Bot requests/Archive 45#Adding RSS Feeds to Wikipedia and first get a consensus there. After that we can set-up everything again for you. You should also sit down and think carefully about what you want to achieve with this?! Since you like to have to images here also you should be aware, they could be copyright protected, they do have to uploaded (just for diplaying them once and to you only...?!) and and and... I do not know how familar you are with wikipedia - but I see "a few" issues and problem here...

Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 10:44, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Oh, now this just sucks!

I hate how exacting this site has to be.

Allen (talk) 11:11, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Yeah I now and I am sorry - you have to understand; we (all working on wikipedia) have to be really careful not to to endanger and compromise the whole project by copyright violations. Else we could loose the whole wikipedia one day - a scenario nobody wants to undergo... So Don't panic and stay tuned. Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 12:03, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

 Not done Since there were no more other or additional comments or contributions added, I consider this talk as closed. --DrTrigon (talk) 15:58, 23 February 2012 (UTC)

What do you mean, "there were no more . . . comments or contributions added"? What else do you need? Allen (talk) 21:02, 23 February 2012 (UTC)

I do need nothing... (at the moment) But you need an "OK" from Wikipedia:Bot requests/Archive 45#Adding RSS Feeds to Wikipedia... Thus you have to provide arguments or another task (or something else) there... Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 21:49, 23 February 2012 (UTC)

So what's going on now...?? Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 21:24, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

I haven't heard anything, so I am at a loss as to what to do. Is there anything positive that you suggest? Allen (talk) 22:14, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

As mentioned on the bot request page from my point of view you have 3 options now (but I assume none of them will make you happy)... --DrTrigon (talk) 23:48, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

 Not done If you cannot provide new arguments or a modified task - neither here nor on the bot request page - I consider this request as closed. Feel free to continue thinking about it (if and how you could modify this task) as mentioned here and on the bot request page and if you can come up with a new task that does not violate the rules I'll be very happy to set it up for you. Please feel free to open a new request for such a new task. So long... Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 10:18, 26 February 2012 (UTC)

FideID

Hello DrTrigon,

In your code for FideID= in template {{Infobox chess player}}, a timestamp is generated after the rating, to look like this:

2780 (August 2012)

Is it possible to change it, to look instead like this?:

2780 (August 2012)

Previously, it's been common practice to express both FIDE rating timestamp and Peak rating timestamp in the <small> font, so, many Peak rating data in Infoboxes still have this. If FideID= can be changed, then the two timestamp presentations can match again (i.e. have consistent appearance).

Thanks for your consider! Ihardlythinkso (talk) 11:51, 29 August 2012 (UTC)

I'm not in favor of this. I consider this use of small text in infoboxes to be a blight. It's already hard enough to read, and the parentheses make a clear enough break between the dates and ratings. The date is important, and fewer gratuitous style variations in Wikipedia would make it cleaner and easier to read. Quale (talk) 04:38, 30 August 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for your suggestions - may be we should talk about this on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Chess in order to get to any consensus. Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 07:44, 30 August 2012 (UTC)

Thread moved to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Chess#FideID. --DrTrigon (talk) 07:44, 30 August 2012 (UTC)

Support re new conventions for ProjChess

ProjChess consensus by silence is thin ice and not for me. Not after notation convention standards lengthy discussion on Talk:MOS went nowhere, couldn't even overcome User:Tony1's insistence on "B×e5" over "Bxe5" ["What about the sources??"]. And Admin User:Thumperward dragging me thru hell solo re algebraic notation box template code changes, even after plenty enough input and consensus from members. And then there's "Hide/Show" where I got to meet the congenial Elen of the Roads, overcoming her objections in an RfC she opened [not me], and even an ANI [ditto; and on a content issue!], and where I even got MoS to clarify support of it, without any participation from ProjChess whatever.) Busted, burned, bruised, and battered. (There needs to be more "community", in the community.) Cheers, Ihardlythinkso (talk) 22:36, 8 September 2012 (UTC)

So first I think I have to thank you for the warning. But knowing this it is somehow strange/sub-optimal that you are forcing me to change a often used template... ;)) Another point you should consider is the lifetime of threads at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Chess which is huge! So it is very likely that during that time your request still could get some attention and then a real consensus (not by silence) can be found. And third to support this even more may be we should change the thread title to something involving "ranking" since that is the real topic discussed... :) Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 23:49, 8 September 2012 (UTC)

 Done

Q on FideID sourcing

Hi Trig, could you answer Bash's Q here? Thanks! Ihardlythinkso (talk) 13:28, 8 October 2012 (UTC)

Cross-post

Not sure which pages you watch the most closely, and since your Wikidata talk page softredirects here.... ping. — PinkAmpers&^{(Je vous invite à me parler)} 16:03, 17 April 2013 (UTC)