Talk:William Carpenter (Rhode Island colonist)/Archive 1

This page is a discussion archive from Talk: William Carpenter (Rhode Island). Jrcrin001 (talk) 01:13, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

untitled section

Jeepers! Give me a chance. I was asking for help, slowly getting it from different wiki editors and the article is deleted while I am working on it. There was a hold on speedy deletion but that doesn't matter? Less than 12 hours from warning to deletion. Not every one is online 24/7. Give me a day or two to at least try to make corrections. Or AM I black balled?

I apologise for what ever I did wrong to "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Loodog". I do not know what I did to incure your wrath. I will never ever touch your "talk" page and ask for help ever again! I will never add anything to your "Providence, Rhode Island" page without your express permission.

Again, I have re-written "William Vincent Carpenter" (Which stood in massive error for a very long time) to William Carpenter, Providence Rhode Island (Which stood for less than a day). IF that is a problem using "Providence, Rhode Island, let me know. Talk to me, check the sources cited instead of making assumptions. Do not kill the newbies like me.

Teach do not slam.

John R. Carpenter Jrcrin001 (talk) 17:33, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

You misunderstand. I have no spite against you. I became aware of the article's existence via the link in Providence, Rhode Island and was curious as to who this person was. Upon viewing the article, I could see it didn't satisfy wikipedia guidelines so I nominated it for deletion according to wikipedia policy.--Loodog (talk) 22:27, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Along the lines of contributions, feel free to add to any article at any time. No one has ownership of articles and all are encouraged to contribute to any article. The policy of wikipedia is in fact Be Bold about making edits. The problem was that the edits didn't follow wikipedia policy.--Loodog (talk) 22:30, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

SOURCES

Sources redone. Please advise what other areas need to be worked on. William was the first Carpenter to make permanent residence in America and One of the early settlers of Providence. He was assistant to the council and an important member of the colony. This is not notable?

John R. Carpenter Jrcrin001 (talk) 02:23, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

1. His notability: "A person is presumed to be notable if he or she has been the subject of published[3] secondary source material which is reliable, intellectually independent,[4] and independent of the subject.[5]". Unless I'm mistaken, you have solely primary sources. No secondary.

2. That of his family: If he is notable, how are his children notable? His family? The litany of jobs he'd had in his life delineated by exact dates?--Loodog (talk) 15:51, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

Secondary Sources used

The following used are "secondary sources" which cite primary sources on William Carpenter. AND yes, in my haste to save the article I did cite some primary material. There are articles in magazines, historical books

GENEALOGICAL & FAMILY HISTORY OF WESTERN NEW YORK", LEWIS 1912, PAGE 274.

THE GREAT MIGRATION: IMMIGRANTS TO NEW ENGLAND 1634-1635, Vol. 1 (A-B) [Boston, 2000], p. 84, citing Hingham Book of Possessions, p. 30

Genealogical History of the Carpenter Family" aka "The Carpenter Memorial", by A.B. Carpenter 1898, page 34 (No. 9-4).

The New England Historical and Genealogical Register, vol. 1 (1847) through present.

Elisha Stephen Arnold, The Arnold Memorial: William Arnold of Providence and Pawtuxet, 1587–1675 . . . (Rutland, Vt., 1935)

The New England Historical and Genealogical Register, vol. 1 (1847) through present.

John Osborne Austin, The Genealogical Dictionary of Rhode Island, rev. ed. (Baltimore, 1969)

Amos B. Carpenter, "A Genealogical History of the Rehoboth Branch of the Carpenter Family in America" [informal title: Carpenter Memorial] (Amherst, Mass., 1898) This is a 900+ page book.

Carpenters' Encyclopedia of Carpenters 2009 (DVD format) by John R. Carpenter. This includes articles on William Carpenter and several members of his family which cite primary and secondary sources.

Okay, this seems adequate to establish his notability, but not his 8 children or family.--Loodog (talk) 19:00, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

Family

His family is a sub-section to the article on William Carpenter of Providence Rhode Island.

William's son Joseph married Hannah Carpenter of William Carpenter of Rehoboth, MA. This second William Carpenter came to America after the subject of the article. They became early settlers of Warwick. At Musketa Cove, "Carpenter and his friends . . . constructed the first saw mill and a gristmill across what is now known as Glen Cove Creek. The five purchasers of Musketa Cove were Joseph Carpenter, Nicholas Simpkins and the brothers Daniel, Robert and Nathaniel Coles, sons of Robert Coles of Pawtuxet, RI Several married Carpenters). A Map drawn in 1677 showed that the only Carpenters on Musketa Cove were the brothers Joseph and Ephraim Carpenter (of William Carpenter). Joseph owned the site of the first house built in Musketa Cove about 1668.

Not enough for an article by itself, but okay with in a sub-section "Family" of a larger article. The same goes for the other children in his family.

Comment

Yes, I am gathering information to make this article better and to make corrections. However, it may be a few days before I can get to it.

John R. Carpenter Jrcrin001 (talk) 18:48, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

More

I am learning slow but sure. This article should have been more like Rehoboth Carpenter family. In the mean time, I will go back to basics and trim the article. The way it was reading was like a dry genealogical tome. John R. Carpenter Jrcrin001 (talk) 00:57, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Later, I will work on reducing primary references and using secondary. Jrcrin001 (talk) 02:57, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Deletion

Okay, go for deletion. Unless someone can redo this? John R. Carpenter Jrcrin001 (talk) 15:53, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Article Review

Resolved

This article has had a lot of imput and changes. Warning tags need to be reviewed. What other items need to be done? Jrcrin001 (talk) 05:14, 26 May 2009 (UTC)

That's a good start - all the basic requirements are done, you're out of the limbo zone. This article should be able to stand on its own now, you can continue tweaking and improving as you wish. Well done. —Vanderdecken∴ ∫ξφ 16:47, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

Thank you for the constructive comment. What about the warning templates? What needs to be done to get them removed? Jrcrin001 (talk) 06:05, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

• {article issues|essay-like=April 2009|notability=April 2009|original research=April 2009|tone=April 2009}}
• {pov-check|date=April 2009}}

Article issues

It appears that article issues have been resolved. The article seems stable. I removed maintenance tags on {article issues|essay-like=April 2009|original research=April 2009|tone=April 2009}. Jrcrin001 (talk) 16:41, 21 January 2010 (UTC)