Talk:Summertime Sadness

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trip hop?[edit]

How the hell is this track trip hop? Does it sound anything at all like Massive Attack..Tricky...Portishead? No. It's not trip hop. And the line is clearly 'baby you're the best'. This is just a dark pop song, that's it.

Also I really think it should say 'girlfriend' or 'romantic interest' or something under the pic of Jaime. They're so clearly a couple in the video and, as a gay girl, I find it insulting that relationships between women that are obviously romantic get dumbed down to something else, when it isn't something else. they're not 'besties' (fucking gag) or bffs or otherwise. It's clear in the video (nevermind in the lyrics) that they are a romantic couple and it should be treated as such. Imagine if the characters were two guys. There would be absolutely no second guessing and the language used to describe their relationship would, at the very least, be romantically descriptive (in lieu of a definitive label of 'boyfriend' for example)

Record label?[edit]

French record label[edit]

Does anyone know Lana Del Rey's record label in France? From the reference (iTunes France), I would guess Polydor Records (UK), since it doesn't specifically say "under license...in the UK" like it does with the United States label, Interscope.

Thanks, Moonchïld9 (talk) 00:31, 7 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Italian record label[edit]

I am having the same issue with the Italian record label. Does anyone know it? Is it Polydor Records (UK)?

Thanks, Moonchïld9 (talk) 06:44, 7 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Genre[edit]

Let's avoid further warring by discussing the song's genre here. First, the inclusion of the genre trip hop is supported by an article from Rolling Stone magazine. The review states: "It goes for folky trip-hop ballads with a tragic vibe...". The article is used to source the genre on the Born to Die (Lana Del Rey album) article, after much debate between editors on the talk page (coincidentally, the same two editors who disagree with this article's genres). The sentence says that all songs on the album are in the trip hop genre. An opponent of including the genre in the article would say that inferring "Summertime Sadness" is a trip hop ballad because the article says all songs on Born to Die are trip hop ballads is a case of WP:SYNTH, but the fact is: the review does not need to say "Summertime Sadness" is a trip hop ballad, because it is a song on the album and all of them are trip hop ballads. The review does not say the song is "not" a trip hop ballad, a poor argument, I realize, but what the article does say confirms the song's genre quite clearly. The rest is common knowledge (WP:CK). Further evidence to support the genre of trip hop for "Summertime Sadness" are reviews from Pitchfork Media (an indie music review site), Vulture (the web-based version of New York, and the A.V. club (the non-satirical sister of The Onion). All three sources are reliable for music articles, yet they were omitted from the Born to Die article on grounds that the phrasing of each mention of "trip hop" suggests that the album's tracks have "trip hop beats"; the argument was that a song with trip hop beats is not necessarily a trip hop song. On the contrary, I think they quite clearly are. Saying otherwise is like saying the a version of "The One That Got Away" played with acoustic guitar is not an acoustic song.

Second, the addition of the genre "shoegazing". The inclusion is sourced by Pop Crush. While many Wikipedians debate about the credibility of Pop Crush as a high-quality reliable source, it is included in many Good and Featured articles on Wikipedia at the time of their initial review and re-reviews. I, for one, find it to be very credible, but nonetheless the view that it is potentially dubious needed to be addressed. Either way, the credibility of the site aside, the article is written by renowned rock music free-lance journalist, Amy Sciarretto. Primarily, she releases her work for Free Wire, a heavy metal journal that Wikipedia does deem credible. Either way, the article states: "Summertime Sadness': On an album marked by shoe gazing moments, this is Lana Del Rey at her most head down." Can't get much clearer than that. Sciarretto says the album is shoegaze and that "Summertime Sadness" is the strongest example of the shoegaze genre. Point-blank. No argument there. Even if the decision to remove "shoegaze" from the infobox template is made, the sentence in the article text that is a direct quote of the Pop Crush source should not be deleted, which you have removed three times already with no explanation. --Thevampireashlee (talk) 02:55, 24 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Honestly, the quote saying that it "It goes for folky trip-hop ballads" it not specific. That's like saying "it's trying to be this", but it's not confirmed, "does it succeed? is it that? what genre is this?" It's not clear. You saying "The sentence says that all songs on the album are in the trip hop genre." that violates WP:SCHOLARSHIP, which says "Per, "Wikipedians should never interpret the content of primary sources for themselves. See Wikipedia:No original research." So it's not common knowledge. Common knowledge is like saying "Dogs have four feet" it's not up for debate, but genre is SUBJECTIVE, so it is. Andrzejbanas (talk) 10:41, 24 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think "It goes for folky trip-hop ballads" or "an album marked by shoe gazing moments" means that the song or album are actually trip hop or shoegaze, they just sort of go into that direction. Born to Die is pretty clearly chamber pop/baroque pop. This is supported by several references and also makes sense if you read the wikipedia article on baroque pop. Littlecarmen (talk) 15:54, 17 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]
I won't dispute PopCrush as a source here, but that is a very dubious and ignorant assumption. It honestly makes no difference to me whether it's sourced or not -- the Wiki article on shoegazing describes shoegazing as "typified by significant use of guitar effects, and indistinguishable vocal melodies that blend into the creative noise of the guitars." Not only do I not here guitars on here, I DEFINITELY don't here "indistinguishable" vocals. Anyone with ears can tell that this isn't a shoegazing song; even credible sources often err in describing things and I think this is a pretty clear and obvious example.108.28.122.233 (talk) 02:58, 26 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Do all shoegaze bands have that though? I'm pretty sure you can make out the lyrics pretty easily in songs by bands like Ride. Andrzejbanas (talk) 03:16, 26 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]
LDR's not shoegaze, the Wikipedia article on shoegaze is not a reliable source for classifying "shoegaze", shoegaze has nothing to do with indistinguishable vocals or significant use of guitar effects, it's probably best to not rely on the judgment of an unpaid or poorly-paid internet music critic for whether or not to add a WP music style template, and discussion about musical style doesn't really contribute to the informative value of WP articles. AllGloryToTheHypnotoad (talk) 15:52, 1 June 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Rolling Stone magazine is not a credible authority on trip-hop. Their original review of Dummy called Portishead hip-hop, and Protection was called "dance-pop". They've always tended to not catch on to a new style of music until years after the fact. Rolling Stone is credible for some things, but not for contemporary commentary on any style of music invented after 1976. AllGloryToTheHypnotoad (talk) 15:38, 1 June 2014 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Updating[edit]

This song just went number 1 (via a featuring) in GERMANY last week. Please update that! 81.28.137.8 (talk) 00:49, 25 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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