Talk:Nelson's Column

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The British Navel Hero and an unmentionable Nazi in the same paragraph?[edit]

I would consider the below to be quite "out of place" on this page. I think it should be removed and placed on the nazi's page. What do others think?

"The Column also had some symbolic importance to Adolf Hitler. If Hitler's plan to invade Britain, Operation Sealion, had been successful, he had planned to move the Column to Berlin.[4]" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.156.11.15 (talk) 14:58, 11 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not at all. It belongs with nazi simpathiseser here and, in any case, shouldn't have been removed without discussion as scum does deseve talking about. — Aldaron • T/C 15:40, 11 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

So, you personally think this is not in any way offensive?

An article about a monument, dedicated to the Victory in the Battle of Trafalgar by an historic figure, a great Navel Hero from British history, has a mention of a Nazi war criminal on it?

Suppose you were a member of a family who had combatant killed during the war (either side). Suppose you were Jewish and had a family member exterminated in the holocaust. Suppose you were British.

Would you still consider this not to be offensive? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.156.11.15 (talk) 18:37, 11 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This is a nonsense discussion. Mentioning Hitler, Napolean or Philip of Spain by name doesn't imply support for their actions.
The Guardian reporter Rory MacLean saw fit to write the article and he is not a Nazi sympathiser. Much more important, there should be a citation including page number from the book Maclean reviewed. JRPG (talk) 08:50, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Column[edit]

What type of column is it? Corinthian? Composite? Also, isn't the statue supposed to be facing south towards Trafalgar? Wiki-Ed 11:52, 9 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The Daily Telegraph piece which I referenced states that it is Corinthian. This confirms what is already in the article. --Bryces 12:18, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I would agree that it is a corinthian order. The top acanthus leaves that stick out also (on the top layer) have them pointing sideways. If it were composite these would not be there as the top quater is dedicated to the Ionic scrolls

New Measurement[edit]

After the recent refurbishment of Nelson's Column they have discovered that it is actualy 169 feet and 5 inches tall, not the 185 feet previously thought. historic records for the lose. --Marge4 12:39, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

There seems to be some confusion over this. In his book on London statues (published 1928) Lord Edward Gleichen states that the column's total height is 170 ft 6 inches - not quite right, but a lot closer than 185 feet. I don't know where the larger figure came from, or what reference Gleichen used.Jon Rob (talk) 13:14, 11 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Had Landseer seen a lion?[edit]

I would challenge the statement in the Trivia section that Landseer had never seen a lion. According to Margaret Baker in her book on the statues of London, he actually started modelling the figures from a live lion, but before long it died and he had to work rapidly before the body decomposed too much. It may, of course, still be the case that the paws on the statues resemble those of a dog more than a lion's, if he did those parts last... Jon Rob 13:11, 20 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Isn't there another Nelson's Column somewhere ?

The Other Nelson's Column[edit]

I think it was in Dublin but was blown up fairly recently -- John ffitch —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 217.155.197.248 (talk) 09:00, 29 April 2007 (UTC).[reply]

The Original Nelson's Column[edit]

As I live (reasonably) local, I can attest that the first, and therefore original, column dedicated to Nelson was built on Portsdown Hill overlooking Portsmouth docks, from where he sailed for Trafalgar. The original column was built more than 40 years earlier than the famous one in London, with work starting in 1807 financed by the officers and men he sailed with. It's a little shorter at 120 feet, but it is basically the same - a big column with a bust of the admiral at the top. Here's a couple of links; http://www.memorials.inportsmouth.co.uk/portsmouth-north/nelson-column.htm and http://www.nmm.ac.uk/memorials/Memorial.cfm?Cause=13&MemorialPage=4&MemorialID=M1063 - Jason Law

Real lions can't sit like that[edit]

Question from 195.99.138.2, moved from the article:

I've heard that real Lion's can't sit like that! They have to have their rear legs to one side or the other.... is that true?
Heron 14:04, 7 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
If you do an image search of lion (sitting OR lying) you'll find that most show the lion lying on its flank with both legs to one side but there are occasional shots of a lion sitting sphinx-like. Perhaps lying in the flank is more comfortable or maybe the need to sit at attention like that, yet not sitting at full height, is simply not needed as often as a relaxed sprawl.
78.144.77.146 (talk) 14:41, 1 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

View of column[edit]

Is there any reason in particular that the article doesn't have a full view of the column? There are several to choose from at Commons: Category:Nelson's Column. Altairisfartalk 13:53, 24 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Older statue in Bridgetown Barbados[edit]

A statue of Admiral Nelson was erected through funds raised by public subscription in Bridgetown, Barbados several years before the one in Trafalgar Square in London. The residents of the island were grateful for Nelson saving the island from the French. The Government of the island recently renamed the Square from its original name, Trafalgar Square, to Heros' Square and a strong debate continues on the island over the resiting of the statue to another location. It is a very popular tourist attraction. Some residents say that it cannot be moved as it does not belong to the Government since it was erected by private subscription.

Bob Foster Rockley Barbados —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.118.247.235 (talk) 22:28, 2 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Inconsistent Information[edit]

This article states definitively that a con man named Arthur Furguson "sold" the column to a mark. However, the very article on Arthur Furguson linked to in this article says that he may well not have existed at all, and that the column-selling tale is itself a hoax. This uncertainty should be cited, and before linking to another article, one should read it. 76.23.157.102 (talk) 03:09, 26 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Stairs?[edit]

Aren't there stairs inside the column? Or was some other column were the stairs are? Or am I just dreaming? 82.141.118.100 (talk) 06:29, 15 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

There aren't any stairs - the shaft is solid stone. Perhaps you're thinking of the Monument. Ruskinmonkey (talk) 16:58, 30 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Rope[edit]

I think he is standing in front of a large coil of rope - maybe this is worth noting, and maybe there is something about why this was included in the design? --86.146.209.243 (talk) 18:31, 6 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Not quite, its a roped barrel, this is how he was returned home from Trafalgar, they put his body in a barrel of brandy to preserve the him for the trip home to England. I reread the article and dont see it mentioned, it should be noted. Govvy (talk) 01:16, 21 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Source of Brass?[edit]

The Wikipedia article on the HMS Royal George asserts that the brass for the base came from guns salvaged from that ship, rather than captured French guns. --23.119.205.88 (talk) 13:59, 2 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I see that later in the article, the HMS George is identified. So there is still that conflict between the opening of the article and the body.--23.119.205.88 (talk) 14:04, 2 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified (February 2018)[edit]

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Nelson's Column in Montreal[edit]

The initial text indicated that Montreal's Nelson's Column was erected thanks to contributions from British and French citizens. This makes absolutely no sense! In 1809, the French-speaking inhabitants of the Saint Lawrence valley were called "Canadians", and the English-speakers were "British". This was the case certainly until the British North American Act of 1867. It is very difficult to refer to a Wikipedia page in English that explains this situation well. The best I could find is here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Canadians Just bear in mind that the French loved their Napoleon, and there is no way they would have paid to erect a monument to Nelson. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MHSche (talk • contribs) 02:05, 19 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Anti-pollution remedial work in the early-mid eighties[edit]

I remember casting replacement stones and assisting Formason's of Bromley when they remedied considerable pollution damage as part of a YOP when old Cripps owned the firm, actually went up there too and shared catcalls with the South African embassy protestors that were permanently there. I wasn't a stonemason but a stonecaster trainee. The stonemasons were the masters of the job. 92.31.49.54 (talk) 14:34, 14 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

That's interesting. If you are proposing an addition to this article, you need an independent reliable source to support this information. This page is not for mere discussion of the topic, or sharing our personal recollections. 331dot (talk) 14:36, 14 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Nelson’s Column - Bas Relief Panels[edit]

There is no reference in the description of the panels on the Nelson’s Column page for their being cast from ‘captured French guns’. This is probably not accurate.

National Archives WORK 20/3/1 : ‘Nelson's Column: construction and fixing of the bas reliefs in the panels of the pedestal of the column’ contains the public records for the making of the panels. It was originally intended that they be cast at the Woolwich Arsenal but the artists all argued for a foundry closer to the column. Carew made arrangements for his panel cast separately from the other three, much to the annoyance of the Commissioners. He was vindicated, to an extent, because the foundry decided upon for the other panels was discovered to have cast the St Vincent panel too thin and packed it with pig iron bars and copper ingots to make-weight. The bronze for all three of the remaining panels was analysed and found not up to specification. The Commissioners had been tipped off about the fraud and demanded the panels be weighed. The file contains a vivid description of the weighing of the St Vincent panel and the discovery of the deception, including hacking the base metal out of the back of the panel with crow bars and the admission of fraud by the foreman. Moore, Fressange and Moore, the foundry owners were charged with fraud and went to jail for between one and three months. The quality and quantity of the bronze is a key issue for all four panels and is clearly being acquired via the foundries, not supplied in the form of captured canon. In the case of Carew’s foundry, the foundry claimed it would need to use much bronze than the other foundry (up to 6 tons as opposed to the 3 tons proposed by the other foundry) - the suspicion among the Commissioners was that they intended to retain the excess to sell. The Commissioners then asked for the return of any excess bronze. What they were actually given back was regarded as ‘dross’

At no point is the use of French guns mentioned other than a suggestion by Carew in 1861 that French canon be used at the base of the canon instead lions. 2A02:C7C:6635:900:B586:1557:B9B7:962C (talk) 13:38, 11 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Milne's Designs for Lions[edit]

I see a couple of people have pointed out the issues with Landseer's lions. Perhaps worth adding that a more realistic, individualised set of lions (Peace, War, Vigilence and Determination) were designed by Thomas Milnes, comissioned in 1858. The models in sandstone, but these were somehow not grand or consistent enough for the monument, so the commission was transferred to Landseer. Mill owner Sir Titus Salt bought the statues instead for a civic building at the centre of his workers village, installed on pedestals in 1869. https://victorianweb.org/sculpture/misc/landseer2.html

Davoloid (talk) 13:51, 19 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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