Talk:Elijah Craig

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Georgetown College[edit]

I removed the claim that he founded GC. That is an overstatement. From the GC web site: "In 1829 Silas Noel, a Frankfort lawyer, jurist, and minister, led twenty-four Baptist leaders in persuading the Kentucky legislature to charter the Kentucky Baptist Education Society, which considered locating the college in several counties and on the Transylvania University campus in Lexington. Instead, the citizens of Georgetown convinced the Society’s trustees to establish the college in their community by offering to raise $20,000 and by donating the assets of the defunct Rittenhouse Academy, which included a fifty-two-acre campus and land in western Kentucky. Rev. Elijah Craig, a Baptist minister, founded the Academy, in 1798, a land grant school for the community, after his 1787 classical school had failed. The college traces its roots to that early school." Georgetown College web site --FloNight 22:04, 1 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Inconsistent Dates?[edit]

The article states "He then moved to what was then Bourbon County, Kentucky and settled in the area of Frankfort, Kentucky in 1785. In 1777, he became pastor of Blue Run Church." It might make more sense if that first date were 1775 (not 1785). Can anyone confirm? Cdeel (talk) 22:02, 16 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Clarified, as Blue Run Church was in VA, before the migration.Parkwells (talk) 19:08, 11 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Delete marketing material[edit]

Delete extensive quotations from packaging of Elijah Craig whiskey. Not really the point of this article - Undue Emphasis, according to the WIKI MOS.Parkwells (talk) 19:06, 11 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Slavery[edit]

I did a rather quick edit from cited sources, having noticed that Craig wasn't mentioned in Gary Nash's The Unknown American Revolution (Viking/Penguin 2005). However, I was unable to research a key area--his views on slavery. Expansion is needed, if only to determine whether Elijah Craig transferred or manumitted any slaves in his will. Also, the old source I cited seems cagey concerning the controversy over Craig's economic activities, with a cryptic reference to love of mammon. Frankly, it seems strange that the death section says Craig prospered and owned lots of land, yet the eulogy says he died poor.Jweaver28 (talk) 01:27, 19 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Bourbon controversy[edit]

As noted at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkeley_Plantation, Virginia claims to be the site of the first "bourbon" whiskey when, in 1621, newly-arriving colonists began using corn (maize) mash as an expedient. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 156.98.118.115 (talk) 14:50, 18 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I removed the claim from that article, since it was sourced to a State of Virginia tourism web site. Kendall-K1 (talk) 16:06, 18 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]
If it was sourced WP:RS, maybe you should have left it. WP:Truth offers some guidance. There is probably some historical overlap; even as most sources opine to the contrary. Just saying there is room to interpret and disagree about the ultimate conclusion. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 23:14, 18 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Bourbon photos[edit]

I don't think we need two separate photos of the 12-year bourbon bottle, do we? I would keep the one that was just added, as the color is better. Kendall-K1 (talk) 10:53, 29 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that we don't need two, and I removed the one at the top. That's not really because of an opinion that the color is better for the other one, but because I thought the other one was in a more appropriate place in the article and had a more detailed caption. —BarrelProof (talk) 15:34, 29 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I concur. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 15:41, 29 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Actually my plan was to use the new photo but with the caption and placing of the old one. I'll go ahead and do that, but feel free to revert me if you don't think it's an improvement. Kendall-K1 (talk) 20:03, 29 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I might have misunderstood which picture you said looked better. I just think the picture should be in the "legacy" section rather than at the top of the article, because the article is primarily about the Elijah Craig the person, and the person didn't have any direct connection to the brand of whiskey that was named after him many years after he was dead. —BarrelProof (talk) 21:05, 29 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I think we're all in agreement on this. Kendall-K1 (talk) 00:22, 30 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

External links[edit]

The external links to bardstownwhiskeysociety.com seem inappropriate to me per WP:ELNO:

  • "Individual web pages that primarily exist to sell products or services"
  • "Sites that require payment or registration to view the relevant content"
  • "Sites that are inaccessible to a substantial number of users"

I was unable to investigate because of the registration requirement, but do these links have any actual information about Elijah Craig the person? Kendall-K1 (talk) 19:08, 21 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Good point. Not about the person. Removed them. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 19:21, 21 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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Commas inside quotation marks[edit]

@Olorin3k and BarrelProof: Per Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Titles#Punctuation, "Place adjacent punctuation outside any italics or quotation marks unless the punctuation is part of the title itself." This applies to titles of works, not just quotations. Kendall-K1 (talk) 08:51, 6 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks much! That looks like a great source (even though it still addresses body text and not specific forms to be used within notes and bibliography, as do real style manuals). I wish Wiki made it easier to find style guidance, especially when, as in this case, they rather idiosyncratically go against the professional style manuals that all (in my experience) place the commas inside the quotation marks. Do they ANYWHERE do like style manuals elsewhere and give examples to use within notes and bibliography? If so, please, please link me to it, won't you? If they do not have one, I will write it for them (for it is a very sad state of affairs to be completely without it, as we see in all this exercise). BTW, do you (and perhaps BarrelProof) happen to know where to find guidance re delineation of their subjective labeling of an article on "The Travelling Church" that I submitted as not being of neutral tone? I'd like to pass their subjective guidelines and resubmit it someday. Olorin3k (talk) 23:22, 7 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
This is the only place I can find that mentions our topic, and it warns that it is not a part of the Wiki MOS: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Bibliographies#Using_citation_templates. Does Wiki have any place that lists examples modeling different entries for notes/biblio? Olorin3k (talk) 00:06, 8 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
This may be the ultimate source available, which hides some listed examples rather well, and the list is very incomplete: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Cite_journal#Examples. Olorin3k (talk) 00:13, 8 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Discovered that Wiki has ruled in favour of variation of style as long as it is consistent within the article. "Wikipedia does not have a single house style, though citations within any given article should follow a consistent style" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citing_sources#Citation_style). "Editors should not attempt to change an article's established citation style merely on the grounds of personal preference, to make it match other articles, or without first seeking consensus for the change. The arbitration committee ruled in 2006: 'Wikipedia does not mandate styles in many different areas; these include (but are not limited to) American vs. British spelling, date formats, and citation style. Where Wikipedia does not mandate a specific style, editors should not attempt to convert Wikipedia to their own preferred style, nor should they edit articles for the sole purpose of converting them to their preferred style, or removing examples of, or references to, styles which they dislike'" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citing_sources#WP:CITEVAR). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Olorin3k (talk • contribs) 00:46, 8 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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