Talk:Donald B. Smith

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Unilateral citation-whining[edit]

There is no possibility of there being any "source" for the prior assertion that Robert Thoubboron (spelled THAT way and not "Thoubborn") had the Democratic nomination in the 2001 general election. Why is one suddenly demanded when I correct it to the actual case of his being down to one independent ballot line, dubbed "SAFE" at the Board of Elections official results pages I cite in my comments? As a member of the Putnam County Democratic Committee since 1987 I can assure you that in 2001 we nominated Smith and he wasn't primaried. Thoubboron had the Democratic nomination in 1985 when he beat the Republican interim sheriff George Grenier. In 1989 he won with Republican cross-endorsement and in 1993 (having switched his registration) he won as a Republican with Democratic cross-endorsement. By 1997 Thoubboron had raised enough hackles that we nominated Peter Convery, a Putnam resident holding a high position in the Westchester Sheriff's department, to run against him, but he won and named Convery undersheriff (replacing the former undersheriff he had alienated) on condition of switching to Republican as well. (Convery remained undersheriff until his sudden death about a year ago). In his fourth term Thoubboron continued to make more enemies. In 2001 there was no way we were going to nominate Thoubboron, and we even went to the point of nominating Republican Deputy County Executive Donald B. Smith to run against him (as all major parties with guaranteed ballot lines wound up doing). Ever since then we have not nominated Smith and this year we finally won with Langley after the Levy/Hossu lawsuit debacle caused a collapse in Smith's support in the Republican organization.

Fourthords seem to feel, on no evidence, that the erroneous listing of Thoubboron as Democratic candidate in 2001 must be protected because that unsourced and unsourceable claim has been corrected without a citation, and rather than go to the putnamboe.com website where it can be found under election results, as noted in my prior comments, so as to improve the article by adding the citation (or going to the putnamsheriff.com site where the bio page goes through a great deal of Smith's military career that other busybodies have previously deleted from this article to add citations there) UNimproves the article by restoring the errors.

As for the "source" for Smith's touting his retired brigadier general status on department stationery, the "source" for that is every document issued on department letterhead for the last fifteen years. Thoubboron's son was a school classmate, I have known Smith for years, I have campaigned for every Democratic nominee for decades and know the election commissioners. If other editors have credentials on this issue let's hear them.LE (talk) 19:24, 19 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

In your edits here (and subsequently here and here), you introduced five new claims without citing any reliable sources. Per the English Wikipedia's policy of verifiability: "All content must be verifiable. The burden to demonstrate verifiability lies with the editor who adds or restores material, and is satisfied by providing a citation to a reliable source that directly supports the contribution." That same policy says, "Any material lacking a reliable source directly supporting it may be removed and should not be restored without an inline citation to a reliable source." Our policy on biographies of living persons says, "Material about living persons added to any Wikipedia page must be written with the greatest care and attention to verifiability, neutrality, and avoidance of original research." Therefore, I will remove any claims in the body of the article lacking citations to reliable sources, and any summary information in the lead derived therefrom. I'm happy to discuss this here, but as far as I can ascertain, Mr. Smith is still alive and out policies are quite clear regarding such. — fourthords | =Λ= | 22:58, 19 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
As noted you demand source citations from me but not from whoever it was that said Thoubboron was the Democratic candidate in 2001. And I have repeatedly directed you to the election results section at putnamboe.com for verification that he was not. You have simply reverted both the correction of the erroneous party identification and the correction of the spelling. There was never any sourcing for the errors. O fail to see how you are paying the greatest care and attention to neutrality.LE (talk) 23:46, 19 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
As noted you demand source citations from me […] The policies demand reliably-sourced citations from everybody.

[…] but not from whoever it was that said Thoubboron was the Democratic candidate in 2001. And I have repeatedly directed you to the election results section at putnamboe.com for verification that he was not. The article says nothing to that effect ([1]).

[I] fail to see how you are paying the greatest care and attention to neutrality. I don't know what you mean by this. WP:NEUTRALITY redirects to the Neutrality WikiProject, which has been superseded by the neutral POV noticeboard (a sub-page of the neutral POV policy). That policy says, "Articles must not take sides, but should explain the sides, fairly and without editorial bias. This applies to both what you say and how you say it." Are you accusing me of introducing bias into the article? — fourthords | =Λ= | 17:10, 20 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

In the latest phase of our edit war you removed the 2001 General Election table that listed Thoubboron as the Democratic candidate. In previous edits you restored that incorrect table after I corrected it to show that Thoubboron had only the "SAFE" independent ballot line (and also reinstated the misspelling of his name). Your doing so indicated bias in favor of whoever had introduced those errors since asking me for sources while taking their erroneous conduct on faith is not equal treatment.LE (talk) 03:02, 24 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
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