Talk:Cape Verde/Archive 1

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Surf[edit]

Does anybody know if there is surf in Cape Verde, and if so, are they beach or reef breaks?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.207.198.66 (talk • contribs) 11:14, 29 April 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Actually yes. there are a lot of people that go surfing there. I have been to Cape Verde about 6 years ago and while I was staying on the Island of Fogo, there was a beach called Selena and there were surfers there. Weather they are beach or reef breaks? well it all depends on which beach you are at and what areas. I believe Selena may not be the best place but there are plenty other places to check out! It's a gorgeous tropical assortment of Islands and I recommend that you check it out. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Drew (talk • contribs) 16:04, 28 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

There have been wind surfing championships held on the island of Sal. Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=5Dm57M1iono Cape Verde as a tourist destination has changed dramatically within the last 5 years. Some of the changes include 5 star hotel accommodations on 2 of the 10 islands, with presumably more to come. The hotels are RIU brand and maybe Spanish owned if I'm not mistaken. Each Island has dramatic change in break, beach, tide and reef. The islands in collection offer almost every type of water life imaginable and one beach is even a nesting ground for sea turtles! The reefs have video online of beautiful scuba dives, and due to extreme wind the surf on some islands is one of the worlds most dangerous. Choppy fast surf should be a warning label for the less advanced Nautilus. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dburgo (talk • contribs) 06:37, 1 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Timeshare Sales[edit]

Do the Islands currently have any Timeshare Sales either on Resorts, or off site? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.135.196.104 (talk • contribs) 11:48, 20 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Motto[edit]

Is anyone able to provide a reference for the motto Unidade, Trabalho, Progresso? A Google search yields only Wikipedia sites. Pruneautalk 10:12, 2 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I recall that being the motto....and have seen it in numerous government offices, but can't find a reference. Perhaps it just the PAICV motto? Aether8m 03:26, 11 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]
One of the PAIGC's mottos was "Estudo, Trablho, Luta", or "Study, Work, Fight", so this might be an alteration of it. They did fight from the 50s to the 70s, and then retained power in Cape Verde and Guine Bissau separately, so it's conceivable that their political jargon took various iterations over time. Or, it could be the PAIGV's version when took power. 9 May 2009 —Preceding unsigned comment added by User02914 (talk • contribs)

Sad trend on this article[edit]

I note that of the last sixty or so edits on the article, about two haven't been either spam or reverts. Thanks to everyone who has been monitoring the page for spam but it's starting to get ridiculous. Any suggestions on what we can do to protect the article from further spam? --Roisterer 15:36, 13 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

We could get an admin to protect it so that new and anon users can't edit. Carl.bunderson 17:03, 15 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Nah...its not that bad yet is it? aether8m 03:26, 11 March 2007
we might as well to be on the safe side.arttic00 (talk) 12:25, 26 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Spam[edit]

I have had a dialogue with User:Hankmarvin and agreed to sitck to one link to what is a plausible site. I hope this will end the problem: he is after all a Newby who did not really understand the rules. I will keep monitoring the article--BozMo talk 20:08, 30 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Contradiction: Climate[edit]

The section on climate has the following two sentences: "The climate is arid" and "its mild, humid climate". Can someone please rectify this or make it more clear? Thanks. --Eleassar my talk 12:05, 28 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I’ve tried to do it... Ten Islands 13:32, 28 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

First Sentence[edit]

Could someone please tell me what "The previously uninhabited islands were discovered and colonized by the Portuguese in the fifteenth century, though the position of the Islands of the Blest, the longitude zero meridian of the ancient Geography of Marinos of Tyre and Ptolemy, agrees tolerably with Cape Verde" means??? The sentence starts off fine, but then "THOUGH the position of the islands of the blest (??), the longitude...ancient geography... PTOLEMY agrees tolerably with Cape Verde??" Is this just ridiculous, nonsensical run-on or what?? -Laikalynx 14:57, 11 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It had nothing to do with Ptolemy agreeing with anything, the agreement was between {the locations described by Marinos and Ptolemy} and {the real location of the Cape Verde islands}, meaning these locations were close to each other. Mentioning the longitude thing was just a sidenote -- these locations were apparently important in early geography. An unnecessary confusing sentence to start off the article :) I moved this information to the History of Cape Verde article. Tanketz 20:58, 17 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The Indigenous Religion[edit]

According to the Demographics section,

in many areas Catholicism and the indigenous religion are syncretised

What is the indigenous religion? Cape Verde has no indigenous people, as far as I've heard. If this refers to African indigenous religions, then the word "the" is confusing, it should be noted that this religion was imported, not indigenous to Cape Verde, and, well, a source would always be nice. --Tanketz 15:27, 3 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

In a twist of sorts "the indigenous religion" is roman catholic and "the indigenous people" are of white portuguese ancestry since the 1st to arrive were from there ... the remaining are second wave imports (or something like that). 89.214.178.128 (talk) 23:33, 5 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

should we create a page[edit]

i'm courious if we should create a page for the global cape verdian population? cajins got their own, why not us? if we do we should link it to this article. arttic00 (talk) 12:28, 26 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Ethnic groups: Mulatto?[edit]

I thought the word "mulatto" had long ago gone down the drain of racial pseudo-science. Or does the government of Cape Verde still use that word in English and/or Portuguese? But even if that is the case, we shouldn't use it here. --Bernardoni (talk) 23:08, 26 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No. Let’s separate two things here.
First, all credible sources say that nearly all Cape Verdeans are “mestiços”. “Mestiços”, in Portuguese, is a word that simply means “of mixed race” (no matter which ones), and has no derogatory connotation. As you can see, it is not exactly what in English is called “mestizo”. “Mulato”, in Portuguese, means of mixed black and white races, and here, yes, it is a word to be avoided. I think that also here, it is not exactly what in English is called “mulatto”. Since English is not my first language, I don’t know which word expresses the best way the simple idea of “mixed races”. Please, help me, any suggestions?
Second, the usage of the expression “ethnic group” is not consensual. In U. S., the words “ethnic group” are used frequently to designate a group that identify themselves with a presumed ancestry, and sometimes to designate racial groups. In other countries (at least in Cape Verde) the word “ethnic” reports to cultural affinities, not racial ones. Cape Verdean see themselves as a homogenous ethnic group, with the same culture, and it is not the difference between white, black and... (what’s the word, again?) Cape Verdeans that will set them apart in different groups. You will not find any credible source from Cape Verde (or from Cape Verdeans) that call white, black or mestiço as “ethnic groups”.
Ten Islands (talk) 10:18, 27 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the answer. If you're correct that almost all Cape Verdeans are "mesticos", then the details about ethnicity that are currently in the article, are simply wrong and should be deleted. Instead, the information you've given above could be integrated in the general text of the article. I don't see a reason why every country should have details about ethnic groups, especially if those details are dubious. Concerning the terminology, I don't want to give any suggestion because my first language is also not English. --Bernardoni (talk) 12:37, 27 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

"Por outro lado, o cruzamento entre negros e brancos verificado desde o início da povoação do arquipélago, originou um novo tipo humano com forte identidade cultural. O processo de formação social cabo-verdiano operou-se mais por uma africanização do europeu do que por uma europeização do africano. Hoje, cerca de 70% da população é mestiça, 28% negra e 2% branca." Taken from http://www.guiadecaboverde.cv/index.aspx?menuid=9&lang=P And also: "As ilhas de Cabo Verde foram descobertas por navegadores portugueses em Maio de 1460, sem indícios de presença humana anterior. Santiago foi a ilha mais favorável para a ocupação e assim o povoamento começa ali em 1462. Dada a sua posição estratégica, nas rotas que ligavam entre si a Europa, a África e o Brasil, as ilhas serviram de entreposto comercial e de aprovisionamento, com particular destaque no tráfego de escravos. Cedo, o arquipélago tornou-se num centro de concentração e dispersão de homens, plantas e animais. Com a abolição do comércio de escravos e a constante deterioração das condições climáticas, Cabo Verde entrou em decadência e passou a viver com base numa economia pobre, de subsistência. Europeus livres e escravos da costa africana fundiram-se num só povo, o caboverdiano, com uma forma de estar e viver muito própria e o crioulo emergiu como idioma da comunidade maioritariamente mestiça." taken from here:http://www.governo.cv/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=52&Itemid=62 Wich as you can see is the official page of the government of cabo verde.

Ont thing that should be noticed about the "political correct" terms such as negro , black , white , mestizo is that in the portuguese language they generally don't have the same derrogatory meanings that are usual to english language (mostly in america) , northern brasilians and cape verdians are generally reffered as mestizos just simply because they are composed mostly of mixed blood people and the notion that people mingles independetly of their colour surpasses greatly any racial dicscriminatory/derrogatory intention that anyone could have when saying such things ~in the first place ... it's much more common to hear "hey white" than "hey black" in portuguese language countries ... and usually people are not called as "mulato"(except on the case of young women and that is just pure old fashioned machism of course) but instead claim to be themselves mulatos (I'm mulato). Sotavento (talk) 23:54, 5 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Turkish language[edit]

Hi. Please add an interwiki link to the Turkish language:

Thank you. 91.87.213.141 (talk) 23:22, 29 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It is already there. Waldir talk 09:34, 30 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

English pronunciation[edit]

It's all well and good to have the pronunciation of the Portuguese name, but can we put the English pronunciation in too?

I have always thought this was pronounced /keɪp vɜːdi/ (UK) or /keɪp vɝdi/ (US) but I heard this weekend that the final "e" is not pronounced. Collins Dictionary agrees. Which pronunciation is correct? — Paul G (talk) 10:03, 17 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

As far as I can tell, the final e isn't pronounced, indeed. I'd suggest you to contact User:TenIslands, since he is knowledgeable in phonetics. He might give you a definitive answer, but I'm pretty sure it's something like /keɪp vɜːd/. In fact, there's even a pronunciation file for "cape": en-us-cape.oggⓘ. However, as can be seen in the section that was removed in this edit (don't ask me why), there are alternative ways of pronouncing "verde":
The country's name can be pronounced many ways in English. Cape is pronounced like the article of clothing. Verde is generally pronounced to rhyme with "bird" or "Herd," though rhyming with "bear D" or "bear day" are also heard. "Cabo" is not used in English.
This indeed is an issue that should be settled down in the article. --Waldir talk 10:39, 17 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I believe that both pronunciations are used. Give me some few days, and I’ll find sources for both. Ten Islands (talk) 07:36, 20 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I removed it because that's how it was pronounced at m-w.com and the VOA pronunciation guide, neither of which give an alternate pronunciation. Calliopejen1 (talk) 20:15, 21 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I was at the Verdean embassy two or so years ago and they pronounced it something like /keɪp veɹdʒ/ or /keɪp veɹdʒə/, but i can't find any reliable sources to support it. I assume embassy officials would be trained NOT to call the country that way if it wasn't acceptable. Does anybody have an idea where to look for other translations?

Misnumbered references[edit]

Starting with reference #22 which I just added, the references seem to be misnumbered in the reference list. Each reference in the list is given a number one less than the number given in line beside the statement referred to. There is no reference #21 in line. The problem was the same in the version of the article previous to the version as edited by me, so my edit was not the cause. --Fartherred (talk) 19:40, 3 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed. —fetch·comms 03:16, 8 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Inadvertent alteration of a link[edit]

A good faith edit by User:98.74.64.148 on the 4th of September changed the link to a section [[#international recognition]] to a link to a different article [[international recognition]]. I will change it back with piping to keep the number sign from appearing in the text. --Fartherred (talk) 02:37, 8 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

148% enrollment?[edit]

The gross primary enrollment rate is stated as 148% ... this comes from a US department of labor statistics page, and is correctly transcribed. However, based on the definition of this enrollment rate, it's not possible - it's basically students enrolled / students. Stifynsemons (talk) 22:29, 29 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The thing is, the gross rate is enrolled students/student aged children; so if there are a lot of students in primary school whom we (in the developed world) would consider older than primary school age, the rate can be over 100%. I've changed it to a newer figure, and a net figure, which is school age students/student age children. I think this is more intuitive than the gross figure. carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 23:22, 29 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Cape de Verde was inhabited before the discovery[edit]

As per the book 'The Life of Columbus' written by Sir Arthur Helps, when Ca da Mosto discovered Cape de Verde Islands, it was already inhabited by natives.

Below lines are from that book.

Two years later, in 1456, Ca da Mosto made another voyage, in the course of which he discovered the Cape de Verde Islands. Leaving them, he went again to the Gambia River, which he ascended much further than he had done during his previous expedition, and he also succeeded on this occasion in conciliating the natives. Then he went down the coast, passed Cape Roxo, and afterwards sailed up the Rio Grande, but, from want of any knowledge of the language of the people, was unable to prosecute his explorations among them. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.227.88.113 (talk) 12:20, 25 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

So where, in this quote, does it say or imply that the islands were inhabited ? He discovered the islands, then he went to the mainland of Africa.... the Gambia River is in Africa, the Rio Grande river is in Africa. Eregli bob (talk) 16:14, 21 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Sahara causes driness[edit]

How can the proximity to Sahara be the CAUSE of the dry climate? Isn't it rather the case that the same causes that cause the dry climate in Sahara cause the dry climate in Cap Verde? --Ettrig (talk) 13:54, 16 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Olympics Info[edit]

I found this information pasted in front of the article: "It has won 5 gold medals 3 silver and 7 bronze in the Olympics." I haven't read the article, but if this information is not present therein, perhaps it can be added. I yanked it from the beginning of the article, because it was breaking the style, however, it may find a place somewhere inside the article, and I didn't want the data to be lost. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gabriel schulhof (talk • contribs) 13:28, 27 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

According to Cape Verde at the Olympics, that is wrong. Any information can be added to that article, however! CMD (talk) 11:44, 29 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Discontent festered for a century?[edit]

The decline in the slave trade in the 19th century resulted in an economic crisis for the islands....without strong sustainable investment from the Portuguese, the citizens grew increasingly discontent with the colonial masters....This discontent festered and culminated in 1975....

Can you really draw a direct causal link from the "decline in the slave trade" across a hundred years to the 1975 liberation? Patronanejo (talk) 04:43, 6 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed it's a rather strong claim. I've reworded it to "A budding independence movement culminated 1975", so cause and effect can be sussed out elsewhere. CMD (talk) 17:40, 15 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

National Day[edit]

There are a number of Wikipedia references, which have been reproduced elsewhere, to the National Day in September 12. ¿Is there any reference to it? It's different to independence day. --Gacelo (talk) 15:21, 20 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Error[edit]

Cape Verde is a semi-presidential republic, NOT parliamentary. Portuguese-speaking countries of Africa have constitutions which are based in the recent Portuguese Constitution, and have a president with powers of veto, to dissolve the parliament and dismiss the government. The president is also elected by universal suffrage, not by the parliament. 82.154.137.87 (talk) 21:35, 12 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Cape Verde Name Change[edit]

Cape Verde officially changed its name to Cabo Verde or the Republic of Cabo Verde on October 24, 2013 according to UN website.

"The Republic of Cabo Verde changed its official name from The Republic of Cape Verde on 24 October 2013 in a request submitted to the Secretary-General by the country's Permanent Representative to the United Nations"

http://www.un.org/en/members/index.shtml#text

Admiralzing (talk) 20:18, 13 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting. This was noted in the lead based on a NatGeo secondary confirmation of this. CMD (talk) 13:05, 15 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Better act on that then. Name change on article and many "what links here pages" about to start. Kevin McE (talk) 08:46, 22 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I think things should be left as they are, until Cabo Verde becomes the most common name in English-language reliable sources, per WP:Commonname. For example Ivory Coast is not the official name but it's used in the article. Siuenti (talk) 10:43, 22 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
East Timor and Ivory Coast seem to set the precedent for Cape Verde. CMD (talk) 11:15, 22 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Odd on, both East Timor and Ivory Coast are the English translations of thier name and the ones commonly found in English, Cape Verde is both English (Cape) and Portogeuse (Verde). Cabo Verde is just Portogeuse (probably why the changed it). Green Cape is its English translation- not a commonname- and probably will take a few years to be commonly found in English sources. Murry1975 (talk) 10:27, 27 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with Siuenti. Furthermore, not even the official page of the diplomatic mission has noted this change: http://www.un.int/wcm/content/site/capeverde (note not only the contents of the page, but also the url and the email address). I don't think we should take this change seriously until at least its own proponents do! --Waldir talk 17:54, 11 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]
note sure a under construction page is a great source. WTO states Cabo http://www.wto.org/english/thewto_e/countries_e/cape_verde_e.htm — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.245.26.255 (talk) 18:13, 2 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]
That page is very relevant, since it's the very diplomatic mission that initiated the request for this change. If they can't even commit to implement it themselves for their own public-facing documents, how can we take the request seriously? WTO is just one of several entities who are just following the recommendation since the request was accepted by the UN, just as we're discussing on Wikipedia how far we should acknowledge the change. --Waldir talk 13:14, 21 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]
The name should be changed and a redirect created. The official Government website has it as such, the CIA Fact Book uses that name--Gangster Octopus (talk) 00:20, 22 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]
I reckon the name will be changed about as soon as Kiev becomes Kyiv. -Kudzu1 (talk) 07:54, 24 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Seems to make sense to use the same Method that the State Dept uses. http://www.state.gov/p/af/ci/cv/ Cabo Verde (formerly Cape Verde*) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.245.26.255 (talk) 18:17, 2 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

CMD & Kudzu1 are correct; until authoritative English-language sources say otherwise, it should remain "Cape Verde" per WP:COMMONNAME. The mere fact that "Cape" is English while "Verde" is Portuguese is irrelevant; frankly it isn't even a cape (cabo), being named after nearby Cap-Vert (its French name used in English as disambig from the country) on the African mainland. IMO there are more authoritative sources for changing "East Timor", "Kiev", or maybe even "Ivory Coast" than this. --RBBrittain (talk) 08:48, 5 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

To clarify, that's "authoritative" as in major English-language news sources (AP, BBC, etc.), NOT the government itself. If governments alone were authoritative, "Ivory Coast" would have been "Côte d'Ivoire" long before Wikipedia. (Burma is another example along those lines.) --RBBrittain (talk) 08:57, 5 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]
I should also point out WP:NCGN, the relevant Wikipedia rule (which seems consistent with what I've said above). --RBBrittain (talk) 09:26, 5 April 2014 (UTC)][reply]

I think that at least the official name change could be moved up to first line and made clearer. The 'Republic of Cabo Verde' bit is a bit ambiguous. For example official name of United Kingdom is 'United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland', United Kingdom is common name. It looks like they would like common name to change to Cabo Verde. Most countries with 'Republic of' as part of official name don't have it used as part of common name. Whilst WPCOMMONNAME policy exists, it is polite to acknowledge the name by which people wish to be called. So, yeah, can we figure out a why to better express this, right at the top. 60.240.207.146 (talk) 02:48, 26 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

How about:
The Republic of Cabo Verde, commonly known as Cape Verde /ˌkeɪp ˈvɜːrd/ ⓘ or Cabo Verde, pronounced [ˈkabu ˈveɾdɨ], is an island country spanning..."
That would address the issue, and also have the Cabo Verde redirect prominently shown on the first line, which is nice. Grayfell (talk) 03:07, 26 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

shortened the lead section[edit]

I just shortened the lead section. Text from it was moved to the appropriate sections (history, geography, demography) if not already stated in sentences in those sections. Now the lead covers the name, location, number of islands, first settlement after discovery by Portuguese sailors, excellent location for centuries of Atlantic shipping, and for the slave trade, the year of independence from Portugal, the large diaspora in the 21st century from emigration in the era of the struggle for independence and the current basis of the economy. The paragraph on the change of the name for use in English was moved to the end of the lead, as that is an issue in flux, and the formal name of the country is given in the first sentence. Does that suffice, or will whoever posted the flag for Lead too long want to change it further? --Prairieplant (talk) 07:00, 7 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Name change[edit]

According to WP:COMMONNAME, I think the article should be changed from Cape Verde to Cabo Verde. The country officially renamed itself last year, and more sources are accepting this.

Google News:

Of course, there are more search results for Cape Verde on Google itself, but that's because the country has only just recently renamed itself. Google News shows that recently, more sources have been using the new name. The United States (1) (2) and the United Nations (3) have both used the new name. [Soffredo] Yeoman 20:41, 11 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]

We can move this page when the Portuguese wiki moves these: https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reino_Unido and https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estados_Unidos --Khajidha (talk) 16:36, 14 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Except the United States hasn't requested to be called "the United States of America" in all translations like Cabo Verde has? [Soffredo] Yeoman 01:35, 17 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe because the United States realizes that it is rather rude to do so. --Khajidha (talk) 10:21, 17 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Map removed, but it is used in the Portuguese Wikipedia, why not here?[edit]

One editor has removed the map showing the islands of Cape Verde from the article. It is a useful map, and has full permissions as I understand them. It is File:Cape Verde - Location Map (2013) - CPV - UNOCHA.svg, a map made by a UN organization. I would like it back here. The same map is used in the Portuguese language Wikipedia article. Is there some fine point that prevents its use here, despite the permissions attached to it? --Prairieplant (talk) 11:21, 10 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

recorded pronunciation of Cape Verde[edit]

The recording has two syllables, cape and verd. All the phonetic spellings in English or Portuguese show Verde as a two syllable word. ver dee for English or ver dai for Portuguese, I think. Any chance of getting the recording to match either the English or Portuguese pronunciations? --Prairieplant (talk) 07:56, 7 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Mypo666 resolved the issue by changing the phonetic spelling and thus proper pronunciation of Verde in Cape Verde, as a word of one syllable, thus matching the recorded pronunciation, for English. Is that correct? I have yet to find another source showing the pronunciation in either language, still looking. --Prairieplant (talk) 18:28, 16 July 2014 (UTC) --Prairieplant (talk) 18:39, 16 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Someone changed the phonetic spelling in English so that Verde is a two-syllable word once again, and the recording again does not match the phonetic spelling. The recording has one syllable for each word. So this is not resolved. --Prairieplant (talk) 11:32, 28 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]
I've removed the recording. Red Slash 20:57, 28 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]
The one-syllable pronunciation of "Verde" is the correct one. This is how Cape Verdeans in the US who speak English pronounce it, as well as Forvo users: http://forvo.com/word/cape_verde/#en
What is the pronunciation used most often by native English speakers, especially those who do not also speak Portuguese? --Khajidha (talk) 15:24, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
For this my only source is Forvo, linked above. Neither of them have a Cape Verdean/Portuguese accent. And the vowel should be more like /ɨ/ or /ə/ or a syllabic rhotic, rhymes with "bird." A48205864 (talk) 02:27, 29 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Pronunciation[edit]

From the lead: "Cape Verde /ˌkeɪp ˈvɜːrd/ or Cabo Verde /kɑːboʊ ˈvɜːrdeɪ/, /kæ-/ (Portuguese: Cabo Verde, pronounced: [ˈkabu ˈveɾdɨ])"
From the Etymology section: "The English name for the islands is frequently mispronounced by Westerners with an accent on the latter "e";[8] locals, however, leave off the accent and pronounce "Verde" as a single-syllable word."
Well, which is it? The two quotations are contradictory. --Khajidha (talk) 12:49, 27 January 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The cited article in the Etymology section did not actually state what was being claimed. I have removed it. --Khajidha (talk) 18:29, 2 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Requested move 31 August 2016[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved. (non-admin closure) Regards, Krishna Chaitanya Velaga (talk • mail) 11:59, 6 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Cape Verde → Cabo Verde – WP:NAMECHANGES states that If the sources written after the change is announced routinely use the new name, Wikipedia should follow suit and change relevant titles to match. Sources have been using the new name, including the governments of the United States, United Kingdom, Australia, and Canada. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:50, 31 August 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Before anyone reverts, and before I change every reference in the article, I'd like to discuss why I moved the article. According to the U.S. state department:

In a diplomatic note sent on November 27, 2013 the Embassy of Cape Verde requested that the United States Government change the name of the country from ‘Cape Verde’ to ‘Cabo Verde’. The U.S. Board on Geographic Names approved the change on December 9, 2013.

As a result, the National Hurricane Center now also uses the term "Cabo Verde". The British government used both in a press release, although the UK's ambassador said It is an honour and a privilege to be appointed Her Majesty’s Ambassador to Senegal and the Republic of Cabo Verde. In addition, BBC and Reuters have both used the updated name. Australia also uses the new name. Per WP:NAMECHANGES, If the sources written after the change is announced routinely use the new name, Wikipedia should follow suit and change relevant titles to match. So, some sources are still using the old name, but it looks like they haven't switched over yet. The fact that the US, UK, and Australia (the most populous English-speaking countries in the world) use the new name means that we should as well, IMO.

I've never done a country article, so I'm not sure how much should be updated, and assistance would be nice. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 17:03, 31 August 2016 (UTC)[reply]

This was discussed at the time and decided against. You should not have moved it without starting new discussion. --Khajidha (talk) 17:25, 31 August 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Two years have passed, and many of the links I posted were from within the past year or two. I also saw that older discussion, which devolved into a discussion about the United States for no reason at all. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 17:30, 31 August 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I'm surprised to see there was never a formal move discussion – this seems to have been the closest thing. I think a lot of the editors who opposed a move at that time would also oppose a move now. I didn't participate in the earlier discussion, but I would oppose a move. @Hurricanehink, I appreciate a bit of WP:BOLD editing as much as anyone, but I think it would be best if you moved the article back to Cape Verde and went through the normal WP:RM process. Moves of country articles are rarely uncontroversial. IgnorantArmies (talk) 17:46, 31 August 2016 (UTC)[reply]
OK, I moved it. I didn't think this was like other country move discussions, as it is just moving two letters, reflecting the U.S. Board on Geographic Names. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:50, 31 August 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per WP:COMMONNAMES/WP:OFFICIALNAME with a dash of WP:UE thrown in. I'm not sure WP:NAMECHANGES even applies since the country's name has been the same since its independence but even if it does and if the the admonition to "give extra weight to sources written after the name change is announced" is heeded, the English name is still more common in sources like those linked from Google News than the Portuguese name. —  AjaxSmack  02:43, 1 Ruhnama 224 (UTC)
  • Oppose per everything AjaxSmack said. --Khajidha (talk) 11:06, 1 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support I'll keep this simple. 1. There is not a "widely accepted English name" (per WP:PLACE, the best convention for deciding this question). See Evergreen's breakdown above. The fact that neither the BBC country profile nor the Encyclopedia Britannica use "Cape Verde" for the country is clear evidence there is no "widely accepted English name." 2. When there is not such a widely accepted English name, then, according to PLACE again, "the modern official name...should be used." So, the most appropriate naming convention=Cabo Verde. (Disclosure: came via posting on Wikiproject Africa talk page. Unaffiliated editor) AbstractIllusions (talk) 14:51, 1 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose. No-one disagrees that the official name has changed, but we do not simply follow those changes. Organisations that do follow official names will of course adapt their usage to follow, and thus the examples from UN bodies and government agencies provided are unpersuasive with regards to a wp:common name change. Meanwhile, Cape Verde, long the only name that was really used in English, remains widespread throughout the world's English speaking media. A selection from August: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7][8][9]. Cabo Verde is used, but it seems far far more rarely, with the anecdotal observation that on the first page of my google news search for the term Portuguese-language pages are pulled up. Even if it was more common, there is no evidence that it has at all replaced Cape Verde as the common name. CMD (talk) 15:33, 1 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose. "Cape Verde" is by far the most commonly used name in English-language sources. See ngrams for "in Cape Verde" vs. "in Cabo Verde" and "Cape Verde was" vs. "Cabo Verde was". "Cape Verde" outdoes "Cabo Verde" by about 30 to 1. That's a hands-down WP:COMMONNAME. Dohn joe (talk) 15:43, 1 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose. As one of the rare wikipedians from Cape Verde, I think I should give my opinion about this subject. That was a tough one because I had a divided opinion. But then I decided to go against. Not because I have anything against the usage of “Cabo Verde” in English but because it may be too soon. Let’s not be hasty and wait to see how the things go, let’s wait to see if all the major organizations have indeed adopted the designation “Cabo Verde”. It may look strange if myself, a Cape Verdean, go against the official positioning of my own Government. But one thing I can assure you: not everybody here in Cape Verde has agreed with this governmental positioning, there are a lot of people that still use “Cape Verde” when dealing with English documents or speakers and, for sure, no one of us say “Cabo Verdean”!!!
    Another major issue is that, according to what is written in the article, the designation should be in Portuguese. Therefore, the pronunciation is not correct, yet. If the Cape Verdean government has determined that the Portuguese designation should be used, it implies the Portuguese pronunciation also, not just the spelling. It really bothers me the pronunciation [ˈkɑːboʊ ˈvɜːɹdeɪ] when it should be [ˈkabu ˈveɾdɨ] (for those who don’t understand the IPA, try to say “kah-boo vayrd”, it’s much closer to Portuguese than “kah-bo vur-day”).
    Remember Ivory Coast? Their Government also had requested that the country should be called “Côte d’Ivoire”. That didn’t stick up… So, let’s be patient and see if every major organization adopts “Cabo Verde”.
    Ten Islands (talk) 22:33, 1 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
While I understand that COMMONNAME argument, it's demonstrable false that "nobody" calls it Cabo Verde. See above links. EvergreenFir (talk) 18:14, 2 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

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Numbers[edit]

Apparently "As of early 2017, about 119% of the Cape Verdean population own an active cellular phone". This is unlikely to be true :) A more useful number would be the percentage of the Cape Verdean population with access to an active cellular phone (this number is likely to be less than 100%). 84.93.101.60 (talk) 10:05, 1 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion[edit]

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Article Title (Cape Verde > Cabo Verde)[edit]

I have a question regarding the title for this article. As the article highlights: "In 2013, the Cape Verdean government determined that the Portuguese designation Cabo Verde would henceforth be used for official purposes, such as at the United Nations, even in English contexts."[1]

Should the title of this article be renamed from Cape Verde to Cabo Verde to reflect the official name of the country? Exoterror (talk) 15:03, 12 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Considering that English usage is not subject to Cape Verdean law, the answer is no. --Khajidha (talk) 15:45, 12 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]
What Khajidha is trying to say is that the names of Wikipedia's country articles follow the WP:COMMONNAME and WP:NAMECHANGES guidelines. In short, the article title is supposed to follow the name most commonly used in English, even if it's not the official name used by the country's government. If you think that "Cabo Verde" has surpassed "Cape Verde" as the most common English usage (for example, on news websites), present your evidence here and the other editors may agree that it's time to change it. The reason it wasn't changed in 2013 was that the new name didn't seem to be the main one in use among English speakers yet at that time. GeoEvan (talk) 11:28, 3 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you GeoEvan, and I agree that the most common English usage appears to remain "Cape Verde" and therefore no change should be made. Exoterror (talk) 10:12, 8 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
No, what I was trying to say is that the question as asked was invalid. The criterion given was Cape Verdean law, and I pointed out that said law has no power over the English language. --Khajidha (talk) 10:55, 8 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
The question posed was based on a misunderstanding of Wikipedia policies. It wasn't a bad question, and the Wikipedian who posed it was happy to learn about those policies. If you need reasons to be friendly and provide helpful explanations to users who don't know as much as you do about the policies in question, I can start citing WP policy articles for you. GeoEvan (talk) 05:31, 18 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
The reason it was invalid is not because of Wikipedia policy, but because of the simple fact that English usage is not subject to the laws of Cape Verde. Or any other country. Far from my being rude, the question itself is massively arrogant in the first place. I cannot understand why this simple fact seems to escape the comprehension of the government of Cape Verde. --Khajidha (talk) 00:30, 21 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
It is not necessary to call them arrogant at all in this regard. Cabo Verde is stated in place of Cape Verde almost all times during the article and it is a legitimate question I myself thought of asking whilst reading this. Thank you, good sir/madame. Justin J. Liu (Dylan Smithson) (talk) 23:17, 14 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]
WHY did you think to ask this? Why would anyone think to ask this? I would NEVER ask why my country has such and such a name in such and such a language, I would simply learn what its name was in that language and use it if I were speaking/writing in that language. And I most especially would never think that my country's official name in its own language should have any bearing on what other languages call my country. The very idea is as mindbogglingly arrogant sounding as the idea that my country could tell other languages what words they must use to mean "rock", "dog", "happy", "green", "circle", etc. --Khajidha (talk) 14:57, 13 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Interestingly, Swaziland has been moved to Eswatini. Michael! (talk) 13:54, 8 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
And? WP:Other stuff exists. Conversely, Ivory Coast and East Timor are still at those names. Also, Eswatini has English as one of its official languages, which could give a bit of an extra "push". Just like with the various Indian city renamings. --Khajidha (talk) 15:10, 8 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ "Change of name – Cape Verde" (PDF). United Nations. 29 October 2013. Archived from the original (PDF) on 2 January 2014. Retrieved 2 January 2014. {{cite web}}: Unknown parameter |deadurl= ignored (|url-status= suggested) (help) Reference retrieved from Member states of the United Nations.
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