Talk:Billy Ray Cyrus discography

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Former FLCBilly Ray Cyrus discography is a former featured list candidate. Please view the link under Article milestones below to see why the nomination failed. Once the objections have been addressed you may resubmit the article for featured list status.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
January 10, 2009Featured list candidateNot promoted

Album Chart Re-Construction Suggestion[edit]

I would like to suggest that we re-construct Billy Ray's album chart, so that the RIAA Certification isn't shown, so it can't or won't cause conflict. Also, I would like to make its own Discography page which was created earlier in the year, and was deleted. ElboMisery1993 01:15, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Why do you wish the RIAA certification stuff to go away? It is authoritative and is based on the most accurate data available. It does measure stuff differently than the Nielsen_SoundScan retail sales figures, but it included more sales outlets than soundscan. I think is is good data and should be incorporated with any conflicts explained, if necessary.--NrDg 03:22, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Discography page is made Billy Ray Cyrus discography. --Caldorwards4 02:00, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you. I think the discography page can be justified as notable and I would like to see the main Billy Ray Cyrus page concentrate on his bio. --NrDg 03:22, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

RIAA certification[edit]

RIAA has 4 official certifications, Gold, Platinum, Multi-Platinum, Diamond. See http://www.riaa.com/goldandplatinum.php?content_selector=criteria for how RIAA defines them. I think we should list certifications exactly as RIAA issues them and not reinterpret them. Specifically Some Gave All is listed in the database as "9.00x MULTI PLATINUM" and that is how I think we should report the certification (with formatted to conform to Wiki MOS) --NrDg 04:37, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Removing Certification[edit]

I don't think it's necessary to have the RIAA Certification displayed, because if the sales are displayed, you could tell what it has been certified. For instance, Some Gave All, 9,000,000 is obviously 9X Platinum. The sales I don't mind because I did my fare-share of research, and got the sales figures, thats why I always tried to add them. So I would appreciate if everyone would hear me out on this, and leave the Certification OFF the discography. Thank you.ElboMisery1993 21:13, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

RIAA measures stuff differently than soundscan. The certifications are an important attribute of the album independent of the sales numbers. All other discographies have the RIAA certification as part of the description when they are certified. Certification is one of the attributes that make an album notable. It is also from an acknowledged WP:RS primary source. I will leave it be for a bit to see what others want but I strongly want that data there. --NrDg 21:29, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I also just don't like the fact that only the first 3 albums have been certified (which I know RIAA is wrong). For instance, I know that Wanna Be Your Joe and Home At Last have been certified Gold. ElboMisery1993 21:53, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The proper way to go about it would be to find sources to verify the RIAA info, but for most people, they have no idea how many sales numbers equals what level of RIAA certification, so having that column is important for context. Ariel♥Gold 22:41, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Despite my requesting the above editor (User:ElboMisery1993 / 76.211.84.64) not remove the RIAA ratings, they have gone ahead and done it anyway. I believe the item provides valuable context for those unfamiliar with the sales figures, but I do not engage in edit wars, so I request other opinions regarding this, and consensus should be followed. Thanks, Ariel♥Gold 23:10, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I've protected the page for a couple of days (in response to a request at WP:RFPP) - please see if this can be sorted out on the talk page in the meantime. MastCell Talk 00:08, 10 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

If the RIAA certification database is wrong we need more than the word of someone who purports to know better. Wikipedia is not about being right, it is about being verifiable using sources we can refer to and trusting those sources as being reliable. The RIAA database is a primary source and is generally considered absolutely authoritative as it is their whole purpose to get this right. This is the trade group for the recording industry. If anything they overcount sales including sales that SoundScan misses and want to give out certifications. Artists and labels do, however, have to request a certifications. It is hard to see how Cyrus and Mercury would neglect to do this as it means so much.
I would say that the burden of proof is on people who says RIAA is wrong to prove it, not just assert it. Some industry exposé about RIAA perhaps, some news report we can all read that covers this. Are we looking up the data wrong in the database? The database is available at http://www.riaa.com/goldandplatinumdata.php?table=SEARCH. I used Billy Ray Cyrus as the artist and album as format and came up with only the 3 latest certifications listed. Am I missing something? --NrDg 02:04, 10 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with NrDg, and the information is valid, can be sourced and cited, and provides helpful measures to those who do not know what sales numbers would equal a gold/platinum record. The information should remain in, as it provides valuable context for the average reader. Ariel♥Gold 02:25, 10 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I've added the certifications OFF the table, but it's still the same, just not on the table. So thanks you so much for leaving alone, and off of the table. ElboMisery1993 02:29, 13 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

US Sales & Sources[edit]

Ok, so my source for the sales is an un-named women, who gets all the chart stats as well as sales for artists' fans who want them. Myself, is a fan of Billy Ray, and I wanted the sales figures for all of his albums. So I contacted her through the internet, and she came up those sales. So now that I have stated my source, WHICH IS CORRECT, I would like for them to stay on the table. Thanks. ElboMisery1993 21:37, 14 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Provide a variable source and we will believe them. --Caldorwards4 21:39, 14 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
What kind of source do you want to me to state? I just told you what it was. And, I didn't even ask her wher she got them... I just asked for them. (ElboMisery1993) 22:27, 16 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The key thing is that other people can independently verify the information. That is actually more important than whether or not the information is correct. It is better to not have the information at all if we can't verify it. What this means is that we need sufficient information about the source that any one of us can firstly evaluate whether or not that source is a reliable one, and secondly go to that same source independently of you and check it out for ourselves. Web locations are easiest but not strictly necessary. If we can't do that, we can't use the information per wikipedia policy. If you add the information without doing all that you will just annoy people, the information will be removed, this article will be protected again and you will be blocked on this IP like you were on the other IPs you used. I appreciate that you are trying to improve the article and I approve your motivation - please, please do so while following the wikipedia rules. --NrDg 22:39, 16 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

All of the Chart Positions[edit]

Suggestion.......I think someone should add the rest of the chart positions that each album/song has charted on. For instance, the album, The Other Side charted on the Christain chart at #5, so that should be mentioned on the table/chart thing.

Also, for songs, most of Billy Ray's songs have charted on the Pop 100, so add that chart. But on the other hand, "Ready, Set, Don't Go" for example, I think is his only chart entry on both the Digital and Canadian Hot 100.....so I don't think it'd be necessary to add those. 76.246.126.88 (talk) 21:34, 2 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Please....[edit]

Please leave discography page as is....It took me forever to re-do it. BRClover2008 (talk) 21:43, 17 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Please stop changing it back. My edit looks much much better and is easier to comprehend. If it's changed more, I'll delete the page itself. BRClover2008 (talk) 22:03, 17 January 2008 (UT<bigC)

STOP CHANGING THE DISCOGRAPHY!!!!!!!! BRClover2008 (talk) 22:05, 19 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

HOW DARE YOU THREATEN OTHER EDITORS? Everyone can change anyone's edits if he doesn't like them. Everyone is trying to improve the discography.--Langdon (talk) 18:44, 1 February 2008 (UTC)i7114080[reply]

Albums[edit]

I suggest that the album chart can be edited like the album chart in Carrie Underwood discography.

Year Album Chart Positions US Sales RIAA CRIA Worldwide Sales
[citation needed]
US Country US 200 CAN Albums CAN Country AUS Country World
2005 Some Hearts 1 2 11 1 12 2 6,238,000+ 6× Multi-platinum 3× Multi-platinum 8,659,234+
2007 Carnival Ride 1 1 1 1 9 1 1,793,000 2× Multi-platinum 1,989,825

The table combines all the information that a album has. It is much more simple. I don't know why that there is a conflict in showing RIAA and US Sales. = = --Langdon (talk) 18:58, 1 February 2008 (UTC)i7114080[reply]

Done! --Caldorwards4 (talk) 22:29, 1 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Year Album Chart Positions RIAA[1] US Sales Record Label
US Country US 200
1992 Some Gave All 1 1 9× Multi Platinum 9,000,000+ PolyGram/Mercury
1993 It Won't Be the Last 1 3 Platinum 1,000,000+
1994 Storm in the Heartland 11 73 Gold 500,000+
1996 Trail of Tears 20 125 Mercury
1998 Shot Full of Love 32
2000 Southern Rain 13 102 Monument
2003 Time Flies 56 Madacy
The Other SideA 18 131 Word/Curb/Warner Bros.
2006 Wanna Be Your Joe 24 113 New Door
2007 Home at Last 3 20 Walt Disney
2008 TBD[2]

Compilation albums[edit]

Year Album US Country Record Label
1997 The Best of Billy Ray Cyrus: Cover to Cover 23 Mercury
2003 20th Century Masters: The Millennium Collection 59
2004 The Definitive Collection
2008 Love Songs

Fixing / Updating the Discography[edit]

Here's how I would like the discography page to look like. It needs to be more updated, such as other country artists pages are. Here's what I think it should look like (with the sources still in place). . .

Studio albums[edit]

Year Album Label Chart Positions Certifications
US Country US CAN Country RIAA CRIA
1992 Some Gave All PolyGram/Mercury 1 1 1 9× Multi-Platinum Diamond
1993 It Won't Be the Last 1 3 2 Platinum 2× Platinum
1994 Storm in the Heartland 11 77 6 Gold Gold
1996 Trail of Tears Mercury Nashville 20 125 12
1998 Shot Full of Love 32 9
2000 Southern Rain Monument 13 102 24
2003 Time Flies Madacy 56
The Other Side Word/Warner Bros./Curb 18 131
2006 Wanna Be Your Joe New Door/UMe 24 113
2007 Home at Last Walt Disney 3 20
2008 Back to Tennessee To be released

(the Compilation albums section is fine the way it is)

Now the singles table, we have a problem:

  1. The widths are too big.
  2. Too many footnotes; it's unattractive
  3. 2 songs charted from unsolicited airplay; "Some Gave All" and "Fastest Horse", which would mean it gets it's own section
  4. Guest singles need to be updated with an "Artist" column

Also, for "Ready, Set, Don't Go", Billy Ray's solo version was on the charts with Home at Last. But here comes little Miley, and comes along while the song is in the Top 40. The duet version is only available on later presses of the album, so it should resemble something like Blake Shelton discography with "Home" being on later releases.

After all that is said and done, it will look so much better. Thanks for your patience, I hope it gets done. 75.58.185.182 (talk) 14:43, 18 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • I corrected the information on "Ready, Set, Don't Go". That's an unusual case (it got to #47 when it was Cyrus alone, then seamlessly continued its climb once Miley was added), so I've denoted that as well. The footnotes are pretty much needed in the headers, since they're being used as references (see Carrie Underwood discography, which is a featured list, for an example). I don't think the columns are too wide, but I'll leave that up to other editors. Ten Pound Hammer and his otters • (Chirps•Clams•Chowder) 17:44, 18 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • I still think the columns are too wide. But like you said, leave it to the others. On the charts, Billy Ray was credited until it reached #33 on the charts. From there on out, it was credited to both Billy Ray and Miley. Shall I post a reference? 75.58.185.182 (talk) 21:32, 18 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • We've already gone through this with the formatting. Just like it is above, is how I think it should look. And the Pop 100 and Digital charts should be incorporated into the table because the solo version did chart on both the Pop 100 and Digital charts the first week it was out. My references proved that. 75.58.185.182 (talk) 17:32, 24 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Certifications[edit]

I've put the certifications into it's own table just to cut back on repeated sources and so there all together in one spot in case someone was looking for a certain one. 76.232.226.54 (talk) 19:59, 3 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

References[edit]

  1. ^ http://www.riaa.com/goldandplatinumdata.php?table=SEARCH_RESULTS&artist=Billy%20Ray%20Cyrus&format=ALBUM&go=Search&perPage=25
  2. ^ http://www.celebrityspider.com/news/january08/article011008-17.html
  3. ^ http://acctop40.com/goout.asp?u=http://images.radcity.net/5410/2216161.pdf
  4. ^ http://acctop40.com/goout.asp?u=http://images.radcity.net/5410/2232062.pdf

merging/fixing[edit]

Can I, or someone else, add the video albums to the compilation table... and put all the certifications into one table. That way, if someone was searching for a specific one, they'd all be right there for them. It's all spread out everywhere.

Also, could someone add the Canadian Singles Chart column, like some artists have saying, "RPM (1992-2000), Canadian Hot 100 (2007-present). Like on the Faith Hill discography. EnDaLeCoMpLeX (talk) 15:15, 1 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Wher'm I Gonna Live?[edit]

According to its Billboard chart listing, the liner notes to the album, and the text on the tape itself, "Wher'm" is indeed the correct spelling. Please do not change it back. Ten Pound Hammer and his otters • (Broken clamshells • Otter chirps • HELP) 20:37, 13 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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