Talk:Abd Allah ibn Ja'far

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Untitled[edit]

Dates would be nice. Tamarkot 15:16, 8 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Going to remove the cleanup link and add the {{expert}} and the ((t1|unreferenced}} tags in it's place. Eagle talk 06:43, 18 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Dubious Statement[edit]

This sentence was tagged as dubious.

"When Husayn nevertheless left on the expedition that ended with Karbala, Abdullah sent his young sons Awn and Muhammad with his wife, Husayn's sister Zainab."

It is in contradiction to Henri Lammens's assessment of the situation.

On s'expliquerait mal comment s'y trouva mêlée cette épouse d'Ibn Ga'far, si nous ne la savions divorcée d’avec son mari, très hostile a cette pitoyable aventure. Nos auteurs ont tenu à l’y faire figurer pour atténuer le lamentable effondrement de son frère Hosain. (Lammens, H. (1912). Fatima et les filles de Mahomet, pp. 125-126. Rome: Scripta Pontificii Instituti Biblici.)

"One could not explain how this wife of Ibn Jaafar found herself involved with this [Karbala], if we did not know her to be divorced from her husband, who was very hostile to this pitiable excursion. Our authors have attempted to make her play a role there in order to mitigate the lamentable demise of her brother Husayn."Petra MacDonald (talk) 13:43, 6 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  • Early sources does not explicit about Zaynab’s life prior to event of Karbala, there is no clarity about other details of her birth and early life. However Shia and Sunni sources agree about the significance role of Zaynab during and after Day of Ashura. She figures far more prominently in Shia historiography than in the Sunni sources. [Page 460 "The Oxford Encyclopedia of Women in World History, Volume 1", by Bonnie G. Smith Oxford University Press, 2008].
  • Divorce of Zainab Binte Ali and her husband's marriage to her younger sister is dubious. Actually it is a matter of cross examination. If history is written by paid writer then neutrality cannot be established. As per my study, only Al-Masudi appears to be an un-paid writer in Historiography. Nannadeem (talk) 20:56, 30 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Divorce by Abdullah ibn Jaffar[edit]

Mr. Mehmood Ahmed Abbasi, who was then residing in “B” Area Liaquatabad, Karachi had written a book in Urdu language with it’s title “Khilafat-e-Muawiyah O Yazid” which was first published in 1959 AD. At page 148 with Arabic reference book titled “ either Hamratul Asnaab or Jamratul Asnaab” by Ibn Hazm quoting its page-33 writes in Urdu language that after her (i.e. Zaynab) Abdullah bin Jaffar bin Abi Talib the sister of Zaynab (?) became his wife after divorce to her. We find no clear name there. However, above this reference he referring Ibn Hazm writes that (in brief) Umme Kulthum Binte Ali was first married to Umar and had two children, Zaid and Ruqaya. After death of 2nd Caliph she married to Awn (brother of Abdullah bin Jaffar). She married to Muhammad bin Jaffar (brother of Abdullah bin Jaffar) subsequently death of her second husband. She married to Abdullah Bin Jaffar after death of Muhammad bin Jaffar. It means Umme Kulthoom had 4 (four marriages). The writer describes Abdullah divorced Zainab binte Ali due to his differences over Hussain’s refusal to oath of allegiance and Journey to Kufa.

After above mentioned reference(s) neutrality is begged:

  • (1) As the event of Karbala encompasses 60 and 61 AH, therefore Umme Kulthum’s Participation in Karbala as claimed by Shia Muslims appears to be circumstantially evident.
  • (2) Divorcing a lady due to a dispute (Yazid ruling period is 26 April 680 – 11 November 683), which might have arised in 680 AD, it is very questionable issue that same person married the real sister of his ex-wife in the same period. Therefore, Divorce to Zaynab by her first and last husband is denied on logic.
  • (3) It is added that Abu Hurayrah died in 59 AH (681 AD). It is further added that Umm Kulthum and her son Zayd died at the same time, in Abdullah's lifetime. Eighty people attended their funeral [ref page 299 of Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir Volume 8. Translated by Bewley] (+) where, Sa'id ibn al-'As conducted the prayers, and the congregation included Abdullah ibn Umar and Abu Hurairah Nasa'i 3:21:1980.Now compare death period of Abu Hurayrah and marriage of Ummekulthum with Abdullah Ibn Jafar-e-Tayyar. An impartial examination will reveal fabrication.
  • (4) Study of WP page Fatima and the Daughters of Muhammad is self explanatory for evaluation of reference inferred with regard to Divorce of Zainab Binte Ali by Henri Lammens in his book under reference. His book(s) depends on primary sources and Ibn Hazm is one of them and is famous for Shia hostility. Nannadeem (talk) 19:34, 1 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
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