Talk:2018 Atlantic hurricane season/Archive 2

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Archive 1

Archive 2

Images

So folks keep changing Oscar’s image between 1420Z and 1725Z. In 1420Z, Oscar was a C1, but in 1725Z, Oscar was Extratropical. Which one is better? If you have a better image, please leave a message here. Acyclonxe (talk) 05:25, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

There's no question about it. This article is about tropical cyclones. We should use the tropical image.--Jasper Deng (talk) 05:29, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

@Jasper Deng:So we will change Ophelia (2017)’s image too? Acyclonxe (talk) 10:09, 21 November 2018 (UTC)

Late response I know, but the 1725Z image isn't extratropical, and is only shortly after peak. I believe Oscar is 100 mph in that image, which is closer to peak than the current image. - Master0Garfield (talk) 16:52, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

I'm favoring the 1725Z image because Oscar is more organized than the other photo and it's close to peak intensity. While 1420Z does show an eye, it was rather cloudy and short-lived. Plus, it was a Cat 1 at the time. 1725Z shows it as a Cat 2. INeedSupport^{(Care free to give me support?)} 19:26, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

@Master0Garfield: @INeedSupport: Eh... I can’t find 1725Z anymore. Acyclonxe (talk) 09:38, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

NHC discussions 10 to 13 (09z Oct 29 to 03z Oct 30) indicate that the eye was becoming increasingly defined and peaked in organization at around 00 to 03 UTC on October 30. So I'd favor the 1420Z (October 29) image over the 1725Z (October 30) image which shows an increasingly disorganized, weakening Oscar. ~ KN2731 {t · c} 09:53, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

Also, for reference the two images are commons:File:Oscar 2018-10-29 1420Z.jpg and commons:File:Oscar 2018-10-30 1725Z.jpg (@Acyclonxe:). ~ KN2731 {t · c} 09:57, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

@KN2731: I agree with you. In 1725Z, it is sort of Extratropical. I think in Chris (2018)’s image is not at peak either. Acyclonxe (talk) 10:09, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

Just because Oscar is slightly less organized at 1725Z doesn't mean it's inferior. It's closer to peak in terms of winds, and is much larger and therefore more representative of peak. It may have been just starting ET transition, but it was still a tropical cyclone. We've had storms of this nature before, like Rafael in 2012. And btw Acyclonxe, Chris peaked overnight. - Master0Garfield (talk) 20:56, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

What does btw mean? @Master0Garfield: We might want to ask some experts at tropical cyclones which one is better. By the way, please ping me if you leave a message here. Acyclonxe (talk) 10:53, 28 November 2018 (UTC)

So are we going to change Ophelia 2017’s image too? Acyclonxe (talk) 10:55, 28 November 2018 (UTC)

What's wrong with Ophelia's image? It shows Ophelia less than three hours from peak intensity and still tropical. ~ KN2731 {t · c} 12:53, 28 November 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for saying that. They haven’t change Oscar’s image. So I guess they haven’t figured it out. Acyclonxe (talk) 09:11, 29 November 2018 (UTC)

@Master0Garfield:What’s wrong with Rafael? Acyclonxe (talk) 09:19, 29 November 2018 (UTC)

I know I have been leaving lots of messages here, but I cannot see an eye in 1725Z. Acyclonxe (talk) 09:22, 29 November 2018 (UTC)

@Acyclonxe: Nothing's wrong with Rafael. I'm just saying there have been similar cyclones with covered eyes at peak. I'm just saying the image closer to peak, which is 1725Z, would be better to use, but that's just me. - Master0Garfield (talk) 18:40, 29 November 2018 (UTC)

Someone changed it to 1420Z. So I guess 1420Z is better? @Master0Garfield: @KN2731: @INeedSupport: @Jasper Deng: Acyclonxe (talk) 02:03, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

It was Mario again. Personally, i'm in favor of the 1725Z image, but i'll go with whatever the consensus is. - Master0Garfield (talk) 02:10, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

@Acyclonxe: There is no overall consensus for now. It seems like an edit war is about to occur that's regarding the change of any cyclone images. INeedSupport^{(Care free to give me support?)} 02:11, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

@INeedSupport:Let’s stay away from this edit war. Acyclonxe (talk) 02:15, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

Hopefully nobody changes the image soon. If the edit war continues, I'll have to file a dispute resolution via arbitration, since the image change issue has been going on for years. INeedSupport^{(Care free to give me support?)} 02:20, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

I hate image change wars too, but I know not to get involved in them anymore. It seems like as long as there are multiple peak images for individual storms, these wars will continue. But I do think at this point, a consensus should be reached. - Master0Garfield (talk) 23:10, 2 December 2018 (UTC)

Well, I never changed the image. Does this mean I am not in this edit war? @Master0Garfield: @INeedSupport: Acyclonxe (talk) 08:45, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

@Acyclonxe: Well as long you don't violate WP:3RR. INeedSupport^{(Care free to give me support?)} 19:06, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

Images

Here is what the two images look like. The top is 1420Z and the bottom is 1725Z. I do not know how to organize the pictures. INeedSupport^{(Care free to give me support?)} 19:12, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

1420Z
1725Z

Put in gallery format for easier viewing. ~ KN2731 {t · c} 07:05, 5 December 2018 (UTC)

Which one is better? Acyclonxe (talk) 09:08, 13 December 2018 (UTC)

I personally prefer 1725Z as it's closer to peak overall. - Master0Garfield (talk) 01:37, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

All done. Acyclonxe (talk) 09:53, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

Wait!@Master0Garfield: The image was updated on October 31st. So it is already an ET cyclone. Acyclonxe (talk) 08:57, 18 December 2018 (UTC)

No it's not. The image itself says it was taken on October 30. I know Oscar isn't ET in that picture - Master0Garfield (talk) 12:08, 18 December 2018 (UTC)

Mario changed to 1420Z. A consensus should be reached. So, no more edits until a consensus is reached, OK? Acyclonxe (talk) 08:49, 1 January 2019 (UTC)

Wrong venue. ~ KN2731 {t · c} 05:02, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

Irma Image

@KN2731: Irma’s image has been changed too. Acyclonxe (talk) 03:06, 22 December 2018 (UTC)

0536Z
1706Z

Which one is better? Personally, I don’t like 0536Z because it is dark. Acyclonxe (talk) 03:14, 22 December 2018 (UTC)

@Acyclonxe: Why are you discussing a 2017 storm on the 2018 article? Noah^Talk 14:40, 22 December 2018 (UTC)

@Hurricane Noah: Sorry, but where can you discuss it? Can you do it on the 2017 Article or Hurricane Irma?Acyclonxe (talk) 02:02, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

@Acyclonxe: Best place would be the storm's article since it pertains to the image there. Noah^Talk 02:52, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

Okay. Acyclonxe (talk) 04:27, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

@KN2731: Is it okay to delete this? Acyclonxe (talk) 05:08, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

Per WP:TPO, no. Leaving it collapsed will do. ~ KN2731 {t · c} 05:12, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

Wikipedia:WikiProject Tropical cyclones

I know this is kind of off-topic, but please read before deleting and consider why I'm posting it.

To any of the editors of this page, in case you didn't know, there is a WikiProject, or group of editors dedicated to working on tropical cyclones. It was founded in October of the busy 2005 Atlantic hurricane season, and since then has grown to about 2,000 articles worldwide. There are many good articles in the project, but there are also a lot of articles that need attention. If any of you watching this page has any extra time and would like to contribute, please considering joining the Tropical Cyclone WikiProject, where there are many editors who are around and can give you assistance, myself included.

Right now, I am working on List of named storms beginning with the letter I, which needs a lot of work before it can be done. Myself and other users are working on List of Category 3 Atlantic hurricanes, and recently, List of Category 3 Pacific hurricanes was published. This article is up for featured list candidacy. Some other ongoing projects - just under half of the retired Atlantic hurricane articles are ranked a good article or better, so getting the remaining articles up to par is a long-term goal. Same with retired typhoon names, where 29 out of 48 articles are GA or better.

The downside is that more storms happen every year, and it's tough to keep up with the new storms and the old storms at the same time. This is why I ask anyone who has any extra time editing to consider joining the project, so we can improve the coverage of tropical cyclones on Wikipedia and help out people worldwide affected by these disasters. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 19:57, 8 September 2018 (UTC)

Bumping thread for 120 days. ~ KN2731 {t · c} 03:42, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 January 2019

This edit request to 2018 Atlantic hurricane season has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

The 41st RA IV Committee is from March 18 to March 22, 2019. Those are the dates of the committee. Thank You! 2601:401:C400:357:9434:2410:CF9B:28A0 (talk) 00:53, 2 January 2019 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. DannyS712 (talk) 00:59, 2 January 2019 (UTC)

@Danny: It says so on this page. 98.253.222.235 (talk) 14:19, 7 January 2019 (UTC)

Done by Master0Garfield. -INeedSupport- ^:3 16:30, 8 January 2019 (UTC)

Merger proposal with Hurricane Helene (2018)

MERGED

Consensus found to merge the storm article back into the season article. Nova Chrysalia (Talk) 19:17, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Currently that article is pretty much a copypaste of the season section. TCR, which came out recently, removed Helene's extratropical lifespan over the UK, so that removes more than half the impact info (which happens to already be well summarized in the season section). Not much reason for a separate article being necessary. ~ KN2731 {t · c} 04:30, 3 February 2019 (UTC)

Support Hate to say it, but they are virtually the same content. Noah^Talk 14:48, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
Support Regrettably, it seems that they are almost the same in wording. And it’s impacts were minimal as well. James-the-Charizard (talk) 16:45, 3 February 2019 (UTC)

Oppose But some people died in helene. I think it should stay. 2602:306:8BB9:4E20:E8D9:7DD5:BE4F:FDB8 (talk) 20:18, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
Comment (To 2602:306) Yes but... Other storms have killed people but just because several people died does not make it notable enough to have it's own article. James-the-Charizard (talk) 05:18, 4 February 2019 (UTC)
@Charizard200: I kind of disagree with your statement. Tropical Depression Nineteen-E (2018) killed only 10 people, but has an article. A lot of it has to do with how long the season article is and what can be found regarding impacts. Nineteen-E's article contains quite a bit of information that isn't in the season article as it would bloat it. This is not a question of notability for Helene, simply that it can easily be included in the season article. Noah^Talk 13:10, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

Support - the deaths were associated with the precursor, so I don't expect there to be much more information out there, given limited effects in Cape Verde and Europe. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 17:10, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

Support - Not enough info to make an article. It barely did any damage, and it's meteorological history isn't that special. So, I have to say that this article should be merged. Brandontracker (talk) 21:24, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

Support - The creation of this article was the result of a publishing (unbeknownst to me) of an unfinished (and poor) draft which I wrote. The impact section is extremely limited and not enough information is present for a good article. I support a merge. Cooper 01:55, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Support per all above. --MarioProtIV (^talk/_contribs) 04:53, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

So... Merge it! 2602:306:8BB9:4E20:8995:8B93:29DA:F2ED (talk) 00:29, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

Support – it only caused 3 deaths and nothing’s notable about this hurricane except for being one of the easternmost Atlantic hurricanes on record. Sandy 141 56 :) 01:39, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Is "quick costume change" encyclopedic?

In the last sentence of the "Hurricane Oscar" section, it said that Oscar performed a "quick costume change". I feared that it violates WP:SLANG, as it's informal and it's a jargon. I think it should be removed because of it. In addition, an explanation was already given next to the "quick costume change", making the word pretty unnecessary. What do you all think? INeedSupport ^:3 18:33, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

In the future, be bold and change the wording yourself! You're quite right that sort of wording doesn't belong in an encyclopedia. The NHC often uses flowery wording. It doesn't mean we should. Our wording should be as dry and emotionless as... (someone's gotta be able to finish this joke...) ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 19:10, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

@Hurricanehink: I went ahead and removed it. INeedSupport ^:3 20:24, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

Please revert edits

2 users CrazyC83 and Vladwin made confusing edits. And I'm an IP. Can you fix, thanks 2600:1700:DFD1:1A40:D929:4ECE:C2BC:95D7 (talk) 05:07, 20 March 2019 (UTC)

I recommend you go to WP:AN or WP:ANI for that. INeedSupport ^:3 14:50, 21 March 2019 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:2018 Atlantic hurricane season/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Yellow Evan (talk · contribs) 19:04, 6 March 2020 (UTC)

"which caused a total of over $50.205 billion (2018 USD) in damages" - I feel like this would be more impressive if you just said "which caused over $50 billion in damages". That's stronger, and just as accurate.

Oddly enough, I thought you'd say something about that if you were the reviewer. Yet I didn't fix it until now :P --12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Leslie has four sentences in the lead, and Michael has three. That seems wrong, and not in a good way

Is it acceptable if they both have three?--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

"With the formation of Oscar on October 26, the season is the first season on record in which seven storms were subtropical at some point in their durations. " - this seems trivial after a paragraph about storm impacts

Fair enough--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Mind splitting "Pre-season outlooks" section into two paragraphs?

Done--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

You mention Alberto and Oscar twice in the "Season summary" section. Could you reorganize the paragraphs so you don't have to mention them twice?

Better?--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

You link to 2008 AHS in the image caption, but not in the text - "becoming the first time since 2008 that four named storms were active at the same time"

Why would anyone care about the 2008 AHS? :P --12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

"On October 9, Nadine developed in the eastern tropical Atlantic. After 15 days as a tropical cyclone, on October 13, Leslie transitioned into a powerful extratropical cyclone approximately 120 mi (195 km) west of the Iberian Peninsula, before making landfall soon afterward. A two-week period of inactivity ensued as the season began to wind down. " - the Nadine part feels really out of place.

Removed--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Sorry to be a pain, but does the ACE include subtropical cyclones? I forget

Yes, it does--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Three times in Alberto, you mention wind values "up to", as well as the rain in Cuba being "up to 14.41 in". If it recorded 14.41, it wouldn't be "up to", it would just be 14.41 in. You do the same thing elsewhere in the article

Fixed--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Link for "St. George Island Bridge"?

Done--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

"However, as the system moved into a more favorable environment" - this is for Debby. Maybe mention the southwest track into the more favorable environment?

Done--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

"until dissipating over the British Isles on August 19.[43] Heavy rains fell in portions of the United Kingdom on August 19" - maybe instead of saying the date twice, just say "that day" the 2nd time?

Done--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

"making Florence easily the rainiest tropical cyclone on record in North Carolina" - why the "easily"?

Easily in comparison to the previous recordholder, Floyd. But I think that might be a bit too much detail for this article. So I will just remove "easily"--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

"At 06:00 UTC on September 3, a tropical depression about 90 mi (140 km) southeast of Key Largo, Florida, and strengthened into Tropical Storm Gordon just three hours later." - there's a missing word

Fixed--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Helene impacts in Cabo Verde?

I found some from a news source in Portuguese--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Also w/ Helene - "Another extratropical storm to the southwest absorbed the remnants of Helene on September 22." TCR says 9/18

Fixed--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Could you redo Kirk's section so the first paragraph is MH, and the second is the impacts?

Done--12george1 (talk) 04:27, 21 March 2020 (UTC)

Leslie's 2nd paragraph could use some love. You mention the drift southwestward, then you say "For the next few days, Leslie continued to drift northeastward without much change in intensity". I think you mean northwestward here? Either way, you should mention the change in direction, and allude why the track was so erratic.

Actually, I did mean northeastward (eventually, but I skipped part of it). I clarified the changes in direction, including the meteorological explanations--12george1 (talk) 04:27, 21 March 2020 (UTC)

"Late on October 13, Leslie became extratropical roughly 120 mi (195 km) west-northwest of Lisbon, " - I'd add "Portugal" here

Done--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

You should add when Michael entered the Gulf of Mexico. Also, add where the storm made landfall

Done--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Michael's effects in Cuba?

Done--12george1 (talk) 04:27, 21 March 2020 (UTC)

"killed at least 15 fatalities occurred across the region"

Fixed--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

"Oscar continued to strengthen as it accelerated southward" - are you sure about that direction?

Fixed--12george1 (talk) 05:39, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

"A small eye briefly became evident on satellite imagery late on October 28" - was it that brief? You mention it reached peak intensity two days later, so wouldn't the eye have lasted two more days?

Turns out it wasn't brief--12george1 (talk) 04:27, 21 March 2020 (UTC)

All in all, good work all around. Just some minor issues here and there that shouldn't be hard to fix. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 01:38, 17 March 2020 (UTC)

The actual reason I held off this was I was waiting for some of the issues regarding level of detail at Talk:2005 Atlantic hurricane season to get ironed out (this has more detail than that article and is longer than said season in length. Y E ^Pacific ^Hurricane 05:53, 19 March 2020 (UTC)

Thanking for stepping up and reviewing this, Hurricanehink--12george1 (talk) 04:27, 21 March 2020 (UTC)