Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2024 March 30

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March 30[edit]

Template:Springfield MA Radio/doc[edit]

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more templates or modules. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete. ✗plicit 23:31, 6 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Unused. Parent template uses Navbox documentation. DrChuck68 (talk) 16:41, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete as unnecessary documentation. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 01:45, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template or module's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Template:Non-free Philippines government[edit]

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more templates or modules. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was no consensus. Primefac (talk) 11:33, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The deletion requests were already discussed at both Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2012 June 16#Template:Non-free Philippines government and Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2016 January 21#Template:Non-free Philippines government. But the discussions were focused on the disputed nature of the Philippine government works in the Philippine copyright law. Regardless of which is true (PD or copyrighted), it should not matter on English Wikipedia because the wiki does not need to respect the copyright law of the Philippines in the first place. It only needs to respect the copyright law of the United States per lex loci protectionis, and under the U.S. law all Philippine government photographs are public domain, even if they are copyrighted in the Philippines. All Philippine government images should be tagged with {{PD-USGov}} or something similar that reflects to their PD status in the U.S., not in the Philippines. English Wikipedia has a local consensus to not follow the national copyright laws, and only U.S. copyright law matters. This is reflected in the wiki's acceptance of unfree public buildings of the Philippines and other 100+ no-FoP countries courtesy of U.S. copyright law (Template talk:Freedom of panorama (US only)#RFC: Does US FoP apply to foreign works?). JWilz12345 (Talk|Contrib's.) 01:11, 22 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • commentNot seeing how Philippines government stuff would be PD under US law. Particularly anything after 1990. Anything after that US law would just regard Philippines government stuff as more stuff that is automatically under copyright without needing either a notice or registration. The stuff is certianly not PD-USGov because the Philippines are not part of the US federal government.©Geni (talk) 10:12, 22 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per nomination. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 13:25, 29 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I also agree. Official works of the Philippines are public domain. Kys5g talk! 12:30, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    @Kys5g the topic is about the possible incompatibility of PD-PhilippinesGov with the U.S. law (if ever). English Wikipedia is only bound to follow Title 17 of the U.S. Code, not Republic Act No. 8293 of the Philippines. Geni gives some interesting response that all Philippine government works from 1990 onwards are copyrighted in the U.S., and PD-USGov is not applicable as the Philippines is an independent country. JWilz12345 (Talk|Contrib's.) 23:46, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Izno (talk) 04:42, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with Geni in that I always assumed that the copyright exception in US law applies solely and exclusively to the US federal government. I am pretty sure that foreign governments routinely exercise US copyright. For instance, the URAA exception clause Any work in which the copyright was ever owned or administered by the Alien Property Custodian and in which the restored copyright would be owned by a government or instrumentality thereof, is not a restored work would be redundant if foreign governments could never exercise US copyright as a matter of principle. Felix QW (talk) 13:48, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Felix QW this is compounded further in some Philippine government works. Notwithstanding the issue (c:Commons:Deletion requests/Template:PD-PhilippinesGov), Philippine News Agency claims copyright on all of their content (terms of use): "All content and materials on the Site are the exclusive property of PNA-NIB or its content suppliers, and may be downloaded or printed for your own personal and non-commercial use only of not more than fifty (50) articles/photos per day. In case of commercial use, the reproduction, publication, and use of the news articles shall only be made with the written consent of NIB-PNA. PNA subscription is suggested for the commercial use of more than fifty (50) articles/photos per day." The copyright claim is repeated by the News and Information Bureau, which cites Republic Act 8293 as the basis of copyright claim even if the law states "no copyright shall subsist in any work of the government...". JWilz12345 (Talk|Contrib's.) 19:49, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
One may not prevent suspecting that all PNA employees (like photographers) are not regular employees but are contractuals. See also c:Commons:Deletion requests/File:Jessie Lacuna 2020.jpg. JWilz12345 (Talk|Contrib's.) 19:53, 2 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • keep In the absence of a repose this deletion appears to be erroneously assuming that US treats non US government works as automatically PD. It does not.©Geni (talk) 16:41, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    @Geni enwiki is not supposed to honor copyright laws of other countries. A 2012 consensus allowed unfree buildings of no-FoP countries to be hosted here (using {{FoP-USonly}} tag), on the premise that enwiki only respects U.S. law. JWilz12345 (Talk|Contrib's.) 00:14, 4 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I didn't mention any non US law. US law simply treats the governments of bern convention countries as any other copyright holder. In much the same way US states can hold copyrights.©Geni (talk) 07:22, 4 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Geni yes you didn't mention. But this non-free template is based on Republic Act 8293, which is a non-U.S. law that enwiki is not required to honor. Again, the 2022 consensus for {{FoP-USonly}} solidifies enwiki's practice of only respecting U.S. law. Therefore, templates that are of relevance to U.S. law, not Philippine laws, should be created instead. JWilz12345 (Talk|Contrib's.) 08:20, 4 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
So, the argument would be that Philippines law does not allow government materials to be copyrighted, and therefore they would not be copyrighted in the US either.
There is a separate debate on Commons on whether the non-commercial requirement of the Republic Act 8293 amounts to essentially a copyright restriction for Commons purposes, but that is only valid in the Philippines and since it is not copyright per se it would in any case not give rise to a copyright claim in the US.
Is that a fair summary? Felix QW (talk) 08:51, 4 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Felix QW in my POV yes. My analogy on the possibility that U.S. courts may treat PD-PhilippinesGov works as in PD is based on what transpired on the Commons discussion regarding Italian monuments claimed to be freely-usable courtesy of authorizations from Italian city governments instead of sculptors (due to quirks in their 1941-era law that seem to allow city governments to be the copyright holders of the works they commissioned even if they were not the designers of the Italian monuments). Accordingly, the authorizations, binding under the Italian law, should be valid under U.S. law and should be honored by U.S. courts. Based on this analogy, the public domain notices on several Philippine government sites like the Office of the President ("All content is in the public domain unless otherwise stated.") should be valid under U.S. law and should be honored by U.S. courts. JWilz12345 (Talk|Contrib's.) 03:01, 5 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Red X I withdraw my nomination . It appears Geni's input is convincing, but the template may need to be rewritten or a general template created for cases of government works PD in their countries but not in the U.S.. The US copyright law's treatment on foreign government PD works may warrant further discussion that may affect this template. JWilz12345 (Talk|Contrib's.) 03:15, 12 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Lastly, it appears enwiki is not 100% faithful to only following U.S. copyright law. There are some PD templates for government works of some countries existing here. Applying Geni's opinion, then the government works of these countries are legally unfree in the United States, as PD-USGov is not applicable to government works of Finland, Germany, et cetera. This issue must be settled first. JWilz12345 (Talk|Contrib's.) 03:52, 12 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template or module's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Template:2020 Romanian local elections[edit]

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more templates or modules. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was keep. Original nomination rationale is no longer valid, but there is NPASR if a different reason is provided. Primefac (talk) 11:30, 17 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Contains only two links outside the main article. Everything else is red. WikiCleanerMan (talk) 12:25, 22 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Izno (talk) 03:50, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Mark as deprecated: Full red, the elections in 2020 is now obsolete but keep it for historic purposes. Kys5g talk! 12:32, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We don't keep navboxes for historical purposes. A navbox is meant to be used and fulfill navigation between articles or it doesn't. This doesn't. And the only thing to do is delete not depreciate. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 14:09, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete per nom. * Pppery * it has begun... 20:20, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Original creator here. If the problem is the number of red links, I will just create more articles to fill the template in the next few days. The template was created to avoid having each election article being orphan. Tutwakhamoe (talk) 02:21, 9 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment This can be be kept as more articles have been created. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 22:40, 16 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template or module's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Template:KSI Sidebar[edit]

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more templates or modules. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was Delete; deleted by Pppery (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 00:02, 9 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This sidebar does not need to exist. It's pointless. GhaziTwaissi 16:19, 30 March 2024 (UTC+3)

GhaziTwaissi it is a fine way of showing all existing and upcoming KSI related articles. IMO it can be modified, but there is no reason why it cant be used. Pharaoh496
  • Delete There's already a navbox listing all relevant articles. A sidebar should be a summary of the more direct links and only if it merits one in which it can provide navigation on its own unique outside of the navbox. This doesn't. If the creator wants to work on it, then it should be moved to their userspace. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 01:27, 3 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete There is no need for a sidebar. KSI does not have that many articles and even so, they all appear in his template. --KSIvsJakePaul (talk) 06:00, 3 April 2024 (UTC+3)
  • Keep The template doesn't need to be deleted, maybe modified but definitely not deleted. From what I have seen KSI does have a significant number of articles especially about his music career, so really I don't get the above sentiment tbh. -- User:Serrwinner (talk) 16:41, 4 April 2024
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template or module's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
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