User talk:Fylindfotberserk/Archives/2018/April

Sunrisers Hyderabad in 2018

I see that you made some changes but just want to clarify regarding that information. Alex Hales replaced David Warner as player but Kane Williamson is appointed as captain of Sunrisers Hyderabad. I reverted back your changes. Please check again and you can change it if you think I made any mistake. Thanks.
-- Sagavaj (talk) 15:04, 1 April 2018 (UTC)

@Sagavaj:, I've checked it. You are correct. With so much edits/vandalism going on in the article, I decided to put some sources with a simple google search. Seems like a mistake on my part as well as google's. Thanks for notifying.- Fylindfotberserk (talk) 15:21, 1 April 2018 (UTC)

You are right. Especially with Kits and Sponsors. They are changing continuously in both Sunrisers Hyderabad and Sunrisers Hyderabad in 2018. I don't have any references to know who their sponsors are. I saw that you already asked some IP address to stop but they are still editing. Can you do something about it? I don't know much about how to do the other stuff in Wikipedia other than editing. Would be really helpful. Thanks. -- Sagavaj (talk) 15:30, 1 April 2018 (UTC)

@Sagavaj:, I can get the IP blocked or request protect on the article if we have any reliable sources to back our standpoint. The only sponsors that seems reliable are the ones mentioned here, but these are not sorted into "Shirt Sponsor (Front), Shirt Sponsor (Back), Short Sponsor (Chest)". For now I'm going to Restore to your version and "request protect on the article" which might cause the IP to provide sources next time. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 15:47, 1 April 2018 (UTC)

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Mustafa Ali

Hi, one of the edits done at Mustafa Ali is ok and reliable. I see his matches, his armband even showed up the term WER1 which he used to represent unity, that's what I defined. it has been done since december 2017. I'm reverting this because I don't think so that it is unsourced. CK (talk) 17:14, 9 April 2018 (UTC)

I even visit that article page when I open wikipedia. as I'm currently working on this page as I've made that page homepage of one of my browsers following editwars since it's creation. CK (talk) 17:24, 9 April 2018 (UTC)

YEAH OK OK, BUT THANK GOD YOUR EDITS ARE AS IT IS, i hope you read as I told you that 'I even visit that article page when I open wikipedia. as I'm currently working on this page as I've made that page homepage of one of my browsers.' however, your changes are as it is as per last revision after your second message. Cool? CK (talk) 18:41, 9 April 2018 (UTC)

Claimants of Hellenic ancestry

Both the Kalash and Hunzas claim outside origins, in particular to Hellenic Empire. Their genetics reveal they are mixed among both outsiders and locals. Their languages aren't Indo-Aryan, and they look different. Hindu scriptures clearly mention that the Yavanas dominate in the very northern parts of the Subcontinent. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sprocket Crocket (talk • contribs) 20:08, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

Again Mustafa Ali.

See this. I reported against that user, he added a word "Chutiya" a Hindi abusive word. as Pakistani Chutiya Americans. CK (talk) 22:04, 21 April 2018 (UTC)

@Broken nutshell:, You did a good job there. But since that vandalism was from an IP and likely shared, admins would not block them. If this kind of Vandalism occurs multiple times within a short period of time, you can request page protection. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 12:45, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

@Fylindfotberserk: I requested protection at 17 February 2018 [See this], but nothing happened. If occured, I'll use that option again one more time. CK (talk) 15:44, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

@Broken nutshell:, I believe Full Protection is provided on some very important pages only. For the rest temporary protection is provided. Anyway if vandalism happens once or twice a day then you, me or anyone can revert it and warn the IP. If it gets persistent(say for 1-2 days nonstop even after you revert multiple times), then we can request "extended confirm protection" next time. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 16:05, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

Neil Nitin Mukesh

Hi, I noticed that you made some changes to the article by adding Gujarati as his origins. The article must clarify that he is Gujarati through his paternal grandmother's side. Similar to how Hrithik Roshan's article clarifies his Bengali ancestry through his paternal grandmother's side separately. "Roshan is of part Bengali ancestry from his paternal grandmother's side" - the article states. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hrithik_Roshan Saying he is of Punjabi and Bengali ancestry would be inaccurate in the same way. Kaistha (talk) 15:48, 17 April 2018 (UTC) Kaistha (talk) 15:48, 17 April 2018 (UTC)

@Kaistha:He is paternally of both Kayastha and Gujarati Brahmin origins which has been clearly mentioned by Nitin Mukesh in the source video. Nitin Mukesh didn't give any priority of one caste over other. So to maintain NPOV, we need to highlight it as it is. The sentence I framed clearly says he is of both Mathur Kayastha and Gujarati Brahmin origin. Changing it would be WP:OR Fylindfotberserk (talk) 15:54, 17 April 2018 (UTC)

@Fylindfotberserk:

That can only be so if his father was Gujarati. Paternal line is inherited from the father's side. Only his grandmother is of Gujarati ancestry, not his mother or father so saying he is of Gujarati origins implies one of his parents is Gujarati, which is inaccurate. As I mentioned before, Hrithik Roshan's article specifically states he is of Bengali ancestry only from his grandmother's side, not that he is paternally of Punjabi and Bengali ancestry which would have been misguiding. Similarly, most other bios of living persons specifically state if the grandmother is of a different origin than the rest of the family. Kaistha (talk) 16:03, 17 April 2018 (UTC)

---

• That can only be so if his father was Gujarati. - Nitin Mukesh (the subject's father) clearly said that he is of both "Hindu Kayastha and Gujarati Shrimali Brahmin" origins.
• Paternal line is inherited from the father's side - Check bios of international people. They clearly mention origins of all grandparents if possible. e.g Hilary Swank

Since in the link Nitin Mukesh didn't prioritized one caste, it becomes necessary to represent both equally. According to BLP, it is sometimes essenial for the subject of the article to explicitly specify his/her ethnicity/nationality through a reliable source. So unless we have one where Neil Nitin Mukesh clearly mentions his descent, I believe we can put names of both castes without emphasizing origin. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 18:11, 19 April 2018 (UTC)

As I mentioned twice already, Hrithik Roshan's bio does not state that he is of Punjabi and Bengali origins because his grandmother was Bengali. It is separately stated that his grandmother was Bengali. He nor his parents have prioritized one ethnicity over another.

Paternal line has nothing to do with women at all. "Your direct paternal lineage is the line that follows your father’s paternal ancestry. This line consists entirely of men." https://www.familytreedna.com/learn/dna-basics/ydna/ He has inherited his surname "Mathur" as well as last name "Mukesh" and middle name "Nitin" from his paternal line. Kaistha (talk) 19:03, 21 April 2018 (UTC)

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Listen, Wikipedia believes in Reliable Sources and not on your Point-of-View. In the source provided, Nitin Mukesh clearly mentioned both of his parent's lineages and didn't prioritize one over another. And he did not mention anything about paternal lineage so we should not put it. Check descent of international celebrities. No "Paternal" lineage is given more credit over "maternal" lineage. And Hritik Rosahn's article is not a standard we should follow. Wikipedia is only bound by what is mentioned in the reliable source, nothing more or nothing less which will make the content fall under original search.Fylindfotberserk (talk) 11:26, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

Neutral point of view is maintained. It is simply stating facts. Both his parents are Kayasthas so it needs to be mentioned that he is from a Kayastha family and his paternal grandmother is Gujarati. Putting Kayastha and Gujarati alongside it is misguiding. Furthermore, you are quoting Nitin Mukesh, his father. This article is not about him. It's about his son. Hrithik Roshan's article follows the Wikipedia standards and guidelines and has been checked and approved by admins, Neil's article should be formatted the same way as they both are part of the same scenario.

Also, at which part in the video does he state what you claim? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kaistha (talk • contribs) 13:04, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

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• No, what you are saying is not neutral but your POV and WP:OR since Nitin Mukesh is not saying he is from a Kayastha family in the source. He only said that "his mom is a vegetarian Shrimali Gujarati Brahmin and his 'papa' is a Mathur Kayastha from Delhi a non-vegetarian".
• Furthermore, you are quoting Nitin Mukesh, his father. This article is not about him. It's about his son. - For the record, Hrithik Roshan's article is also citing his father, Rakesh Roshan's quote to support Punjabi descent. If you find any reliable source in which Neil Nitin himself says he's a Kayastha, feel free to ad it albeit within WP:NOR policy.
• Neil's article should be formatted the same way as they both are part of the same scenario. - Scenario might be similar (regarding paternal grandparent) but Wikipedia work on sources. Unlike Rakesh Roshan's link in Hritik Roshan's page, Nitin Mukesh didn't say anything like "I am of Kayatha origins".
• Also, at which part in the video does he state what you claim? - It is in from 14:40

And don't edit war or put original search. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 14:51, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

Hrithik Roshan has not said he's Punjabi in the source either. His father has. Another source also says his grandmother is Bengali. Why doesn't his article state that his paternal grandfather is Punjabi and his paternal grandmother is Bengali? Why does it state that he is from a Punjabi family when clearly it's something he himself has not stated but his father has? KS 16:22, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

• Try to understand the fact that Wikipedia articles relies on 3 primary core policies and not on other articles. The link provided is in accordance to them. If you prioritize any one caste or put your own opinion then it becomes an original search and is liable to get reverted.
• I'm not involved with Roshan's page but I can tell that his Bengali ancestry has been added few months back and probably had not been checked for neutrality after that or the source had not been given enough weight despite being reliable and seems to be Hritik's own sayings.
• Check Kareena Kapoor's page. All her lineages, both paternal and maternal, are given the same amount of importance.
• In Kareena Kapoor's page you can also see that she didn't say anything herself in any of the sources on caste/ethnicity.
• Check Scarlett Johansson. You can clearly see that her paternal ethnicity hasn't been prioritized.

- Fylindfotberserk (talk) 17:17, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

You have given examples of Kareena Kapoor and Scarlett Johansson. Both of their parents are of different ethnicities. Kareena's father is Punjabi and her mother is Sindhi and British while Scarlet's father is from Denmark and her mother is Ashkenazi. These are two completely different scenarios when compared with Hrithik Roshan or Neil Nitin Mukesh, both happen to have parents of the same backgrounds with the only difference being the ancestry of their paternal grandmother. When both the person's parents share the same ethnicity/surname/background then it can be mentioned that they are from a specific ethnic family. Then additionally the background of their grandparents can be added, as in the case of Hrithik Roshan's article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kaistha (talk • contribs) 19:02, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

Your comment doesn't make any sense. For starters check the definition of ethnicity. Gujarati Shrimali Brahmin is just as much a separate ethnic caste as New Delhi Kayastha is. If you think that a woman loses her identity upon marrying and a wiki article needs to be written as such then it is a case of male chauvinism and your own POV.

I told you multiple times that the only thing Wikipedia articles rely on are the sources doing anything against is liable to get reverted and for the final time Hritik Roshan's article is just an example. It is not relevant here. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 20:10, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

You are confusing the ethnicity of his grandparents with the ethnicity of his parents. Both his parents are Mathurs, his grandfather is also Mathur, only his paternal grandmother is Gujarati. You ignore Hrithik Roshan's article and at the same time cite articles of Scarlett Johansson and Kareena Kapoor. So, their articles have more relevance than Hrithik's? Btw, no one said that a woman "loses her identity" upon marriage. Should only the ethnicity of the grandparents be mentioned and not that of the parents? KS 10:40, 24 April 2018 (UTC)

And you are POV pushing your own original research. No reliable sources here support the subject's maternal ancestry. No other article has anything to do with this one either. Wikipedia only relies on reliable sources and reproduce them as such without manipulating anything or finding a new meaning. Anything like "He belongs to a Kayastha family" cannot be added since it has not been mentioned explicitly in the source and WT:IN community prefers that caste labels for living people come from self-identification and trying to derive caste based on surnames(which you are doing) constitutes original research. The article at present only mentions what the subject's father has said in the interview explicitly. - Fylindfotberserk (talk) 18:37, 24 April 2018 (UTC)

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