User talk:לולק

Gilad Margalit[edit]

Preparation[edit]

Hello,

Welcome on wikipedia and thank you for your involment in this project :-)

I have read your article and I have two comments :

1. you should read it back and make it correct by native English speakers. English is not my mother langage either but I see several grammatic mistakes.

2. much more important is related to the use of sources. In wikipedia, we don't really mind if something is true or not but we care that what we write has to be reported in reliable sources. In other words, what matters is not what we know on a topic or what we think about this but rather what people who are notorious and who are considered as reliable wrote about this. This is explained here : WP:RS with RS standing for Reliable Source. In practice, you need to find reliable source that talk about Gilat Margalit and can only report on wikipedia what they report themselves...

Feel free to ask any question is what I write is not clear.

Pluto2012 (talk) 17:15, 19 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Hello,

Thank you very much for all the the support and important details!

I will work again on the grammar, and more critical, about the sources for my information,

Best,

--לולק (talk) 21:42, 19 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

You are welcome.

Another point : in wikipedia, when we answer to somebody, we usually "ident" our answer. It means that the one who answers first adds ":" at each line ; the second one add "::" etc.

I have modified your answer to comply with this "rule" to illustrate it.

Don't be surprised or refreined by all these rules. There is also another one that states to never hesitate and not to care about rules (see the 5th one here : WP:PILLARS). With these 5, you have the full "codex" of wikipedia :-)

Pluto2012 (talk) 06:33, 20 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I read the full codex and think i start to get into the spirit:) thank you, and will be in touch soon,

Shabat Shalom from Tel Aviv,

--לולק (talk) 16:23, 20 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Hello! I worked on the references for the article this weekend, what is your opinion? Thank you! Best,--לולק (talk) 17:58, 21 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Shalom Lolk,

I fear there remains much work but you this moves forward :-)

It would be important to find other notorious people talking about Prof. Margalit. I found this article on google : [1]. That may (I don't know) be intersting to introdure its content to the article.

Are there peer-reviewed articles about his work ? That would be worth to have such sources/references to prove he is talked about and therefore confirm his notoriaty.

Regarding sources, the rule is that "everything" should be sourced. Anyway, the tone of the article is WP:NPOV, which is good ! You can read WP:BLP for more information regarding this.

I don't know at all the topic but I read some contradictions... It is written in the lead of the article that his recent work concerns the influence of Nazi episode on the current German "semantic" but I read on the website of Haifa University that he focuses more on the Turkish community of Germany. (I insist that I don't know the topic at all.)

You may find some information or articles about his work on google scholar.

(edit : Indeed, I found at least two articles where his thesis are talked about : eg this one.)

Pluto2012 (talk) 08:44, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you Pluto, I am happy you love the tone of the article!

I will continue to work on it, use the articles you found and ::::::look for more articles by notorious people on Margalit, if there ::::::will not be enough online, Ill scan some and put them on Google docs.

About the peer-reviewed articles, I have to check it out, and also use the "Scholer". Ill do it soon.

What the rules about a person mention in other Wikipedia articles?

mentions on Margait's work appears in those Wikipedia articles:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans-Christoph_Seebohm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_May

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Nazis_(S%E2%80%93Z)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_crime

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust_in_Latvia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crimes_of_the_Wehrmacht

Again, thank you!

Best from Tel Aviv,

--לולק (talk) 19:57, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Pluto,I found more 3 main articles about Gilad Margalit's work for reference

http://ahr.oxfordjournals.org/content/117/4/1315.2.extract

http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=8695978

http://muse.jhu.edu/login?auth=0&type=summary&url=/journals/journal_of_social_history/v038/38.4widmann.pdf ,

and also edited more the article, I would be happy to know your opinion ,thank you!

--לולק (talk) 18:01, 5 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Introduction of the article in the main space[edit]

Hello,

The article sounds good to me. Anyway, it is always a critical phase when an artical shifts from "stub" to "article status" in the main space. Some contributors may require improvements or even ask the article to be removed... That's not always pleasant. Anyway, I am confident that this should not happen.

I have an important question : could you confirm (or not) that you are not Margalit, nor a member of his family, nor one of his staff or one of his student. Could you alse confirm that you have not been paid to write his "biography" on wp. If one of this point is true, you could be considered to have conflict of interests and we have to discuss this.

When we shift the article from "stub" to "main", we need to follow this at least the first days to be ready to answer very fast (but quietly) to any additional request. That's a good point to prove reactivity.

So my proposal is that we are both ready to follow the article, I move this to the main space and then we can follow it and its talk page. When would it be good for you ?

Pluto2012 (talk) 16:32, 6 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Hello,

I am very happy and proud reading your message,that the articl--לולק (talk) 21:05, 6 October 2013 (UTC)e consider to be good and appropriate for Wikipedia , and you will move it to the main space! Thank you!![reply]

For me, all the week is fine, but because I am working during days, if it will be comfortable for you, it would be great if we could do it close to the weekend, and then I will have during Friday Saturday all the time needed to answer as fast as I can.

About the confirmation, I would be happy to confirm in any way that I am not Margalit, any one from his family, staff or student, and of course not been paid. I am an Israeli filmmaker and film/culture critic (I am writing in an Israeli film magazine and made couple of short films and drama)

And again, thank you!

Good night,

--לולק (talk) 19:41, 6 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Please, apologize me for my question.

It was better that I ask you this now rather than somebody else later.

I will move the article to the "main space" on Friday evening.

If it is not done before 22:00 Jerusalem time, please just remind me to do so !

Good night, Pluto2012 (talk) 20:36, 6 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for your answer, and it's realy fine,I am completely understand the reason for the question!

And, Friday evening will be great, thank you. Ill be here, talk to you soon!

Good night,

--לולק (talk) 21:06, 6 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Hello! I am here, just writing to remind you,

Best,--לולק (talk) 18:51, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Gilad Margalit[edit]

Congratulations,

The article about Gilad Margalit is now in the main space :-)

If the blue star next to "view history" of the top on the page is not blue, please click on it. It adds the article to your Watchlist. When you click on "watchlist" it will tell you what happened with the article (eg last editor).

Kind Regards Pluto2012 (talk) 19:44, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

It is great!!I am very proud of it and exciting for my first article in the English Wikipedia

Thank you very much! I will be now guard with the watching list.

Best--לולק (talk) 19:56, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Most critical period are the 30 first minutes.

It's done. So there is no worry to have any more.

Just keep an eye on the talk page next two days and that will be fine.

You can start thinking about your second article :-) Pluto2012 (talk) 20:22, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I am:)--לולק (talk) 20:25, 11 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Copyright[edit]

Congratulations on your new article, but you must be careful to avoid possible copyright violations. See WP:COPYVIO. For example:

article: "Turkish citizens arrived in West Germany following the agreement between the Federal Republic and Turkey in 1960 on supplying Gastarbeiter ("guest workers") for the German labour market, which was in need of them. Since the 1970s, these workers and their descendants have become the biggest immigrant community in Germany. The cultural and religious otherness of the Turks (with regard to their German surroundings), and the prejudices against them, turns their integration in the German society into a great challenge. His research focused in the Turkish experience of living among Germans, as well as their attitudes to the German past and to the Holocaust,[8] concentrates especially on the second and third generation of German Turks and the process of their building a distinct collective German-Turkish identity."

from http://history.haifa.ac.il/staff/gmargalit.htm#01: "Turkish citizens arrived in West Germany following the agreement between the Federal Republic and Turkey in 1960 on supplying workers for the German work market which was in need of them. Since the 1970s, these workers have become the biggest migrant community in Germany. The cultural and religious otherness of the Turks (with regard to their German surroundings), and the prejudices against them, turns their integration in the German society into a great challenge. I am interested in the Turkish experience of living among Germans, as well as their attitudes to the German past and to the Holocaust. My research concentrates especially on the second and third generation of German Turks and the process of their building a distinct collective German-Turkish identity"

These are far too close, and you need to re-write the text in your own words, so as not to infringe Margalit's copyright. Otherwise the text will have to be removed. The same applies to any other text you may have copy-pasted or closely paraphrased. See WP:CLOSEPARAPHRASE. Good luck - I know this won't be easy if English is not your first language!

--NSH001 (talk) 11:08, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

First, thank you for the greetings and advice.

I will re- phrase the sentences I took from the Haifa University site, I hope to finish doing that during the next days,

But, is there also an alternative option, to get a permission from the Haifa University for using some of their text in my article?

Again, thank you --לולק (talk) 12:25, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I had missed it because I didn't check.

It may be possible to get a permission from the Haifa University but paraphrasing is easier and faster.

You must absolutely avoid copy/pasting from websites.

Here, we could get :

"Turkish immigrants started arriving in West Germany in 1960. 10 years later, they had become the biggest community of foreigners in the Feredal Republic of Germany. (...)"

Pluto2012 (talk) 13:02, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, and I am taking you suggestion, I will paraphrase it in the next days,

Thank you! --לולק (talk) 13:08, 12 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]