Template talk:Perseverance Mission Timer

Exact landing time code needed for template

NOTE: the code => ((13 + (50 / 60))*(1/24)))) <= on the template page refers to the exact landing time of the "Curiosity (rover)" and was borrowed from the "{{Curiosity Mission Timer}}" page - and may NOT apply to the "{{Perseverance Mission Timer}}" page - and may need updating and adjustment to the exact time the "Perseverance (rover)" landed instead - hope this helps - iac - Stay Safe and Healthy !! - Drbogdan (talk) 22:25, 18 February 2021 (UTC)

Hi, I changed a few things so now it should work. To elaborate ((20/24) + (56/(24*60))) converts hours and minutes to fractions of a day by dividing the hours (20) by the amount of hours in a day (24) and the same with the minutes(56/(24*60)). That way 20:56 turns into ~0,872 and can be added to the days returned by {{Gregorian serial date}}. josecurioso ❯❯❯ Tell me! 23:14, 18 February 2021 (UTC)

@Josecurioso: Seems the newly added corrections may Not be ok after all since ((20/24) + (56/(24*60))) displays "1 sol" (based on an earlier display on the following page => "Timeline of Mars 2020" ) at a time when the official NASA timer is displaying "2 sol" (see official timer at => https://mars.nasa.gov/mars2020/ ) - reverting back to the original coding ((13 + (50 / 60))*(1/24)))) from the {{Curiosity Mission Timer}} displays the "correct" "2 sol" on the "Timeline of Mars 2020" page - but may still need some work to make this display even more accurate I would think - just wondering => could your coding be correct - and the official NASA timer off in some way? - iac - Thanks for the recent effort - and - Stay Safe and Healthy !! - Drbogdan (talk) 18:16, 20 February 2021 (UTC)

@Drbogdan: I think I found the issue, when calling {{Gregorian serial date}} in the second part of the expression, the date given was 2021-02-18 but should have been 2021-02-17 because the idea is to get the amount of days up until the hour of landing. So {{Gregorian serial date}} (with 2021-02-17) returns the amount of days including the 17th and then we add the fraction of the 18th calculated from the hours (20:56). I hope this was the issue since I rechecked everything else and all seems right.

Restoring to the original code only gives the right amount sometimes because it was based on Curiosity's landing time (05:17) so you would only see the problem at around 05:17 UTC when it would start showing 3 sols instead of 2.

BTW, I'm confident in my code but not as much as to blame NASA's official clock for my mistakes hahahahah. Stay safe! josecurioso ❯❯❯ Tell me! 22:18, 20 February 2021 (UTC)

@Josecurioso: Seems your original coding - with "18" (both timers are now "2 sols" at the moment) - may be working better than the newly added "17" (template timer — "Timeline of Mars 2020" — was "3 sols" when the official NASA timer — https://mars.nasa.gov/mars2020/ — was "2 sols")? - maybe "18" is better? - Comments Welcome - iac - Stay Safe and Healthy !! - Drbogdan (talk) 23:46, 20 February 2021 (UTC)

@Drbogdan: I've been reading a few things to try and get this right. Turns out the Mission Timer doesn't start when the rover lands but the previous solar midnight at the predicted landing point. So that's the value needed to make this template work fine, we need to know the UTC datetime . Knowing that, I fine-tuned the calculation to within ±2 minutes and I will try to calculate a more precise time tomorrow. I hope third time's a charm and this works as intended. josecurioso ❯❯❯ Tell me! 01:09, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

@Josecurioso: Thank you *very much* for your interests - and efforts - and "fresh-eyes" re this concern - I'm *very* aware that this concern can be quite a challenge - even with NASA scientists - had an earlier 2012 discussion re the "Curiosity (rover)" Timer (i.e., "{{Curiosity Mission Timer}}") - see my created discussion here => "Talk:Curiosity (rover)/Archive 3#Sols on Mars - Wikipedia notes *1-SOL LESS* than NASA?" - this earlier discussion may be a *really* big help with today's concern re the "Perseverance (rover)" Timer (i.e., "{{Perseverance Mission Timer}}") I would think - in any case - Thanks again for your efforts and all - and - Stay Safe and Healthy !! - Drbogdan (talk) 02:01, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

You're wellcome @Drbogdan:, I like to tackle these issues because they "force" me to learn all sorts of things, who would have thought I would end the week knowing so much about Mars timekeeping?😃. After reading the thread you linked I think the easiest way to get the template to be more precise is to ask NASA the UTC datetime when the Mission Clock was started as you did back in 2012 and let them take care of all the magic for us 😂. Do you happen to remember who you contacted about that?. Cheers, josecurioso ❯❯❯ Tell me! 16:39, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

@Josecurioso: Thanks for your comment - and question - no, re the NASA contact, it's been awhile ago - but you seem to have the right idea about this - if I recall later re the NASA contact, I'll let you know (of course they may no longer be there since this was back in 2012) - iac -Thanks again for your comments - and efforts - Stay Safe and Healthy !! - Drbogdan (talk) 16:59, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

@Josecurioso: - Brief Followup - seems the NASA scientist contacted in 2012 may have been Dr. Robert B. Schmunk ( E-mail: robert.b.schmunk@nasa.gov - and - Phone: 212-678-5535 ) - also noted at => https://www.giss.nasa.gov/staff/rschmunk.html - and related => https://www.giss.nasa.gov/tools/mars24/ - all noted/linked in my 2012 discussion at => "Talk:Curiosity (rover)/Archive 3#Sols on Mars - Wikipedia notes *1-SOL LESS* than NASA?" - hope this helps in some way - iac - Stay Safe and Healthy ! - Drbogdan (talk) 17:21, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

Other template

Not knowing about this template I created own templates to convert from Sol, Mars Time to Earthtime (and backwards). See User:Schrauber5/testMarstime2 and the used templates there. At the moment my calculation says it's in the middle (0.6) of Sol 138 but this template claims its already Sol 139.Schrauber5 (talk) 16:06, 11 July 2021 (UTC)

Since the last picture is from Sol 139 there is a bug in my template. Schrauber5 (talk) 16:17, 11 July 2021 (UTC)

Found and repaired Schrauber5 (talk) 16:55, 11 July 2021 (UTC)

Time of Sol 0 0:00

Flight 9 is given with July 5 at 2:03 am PT (https://mars.nasa.gov/technology/helicopter/status/314/flight-9-was-a-nail-biter-but-ingenuity-came-through-with-flying-colors/) and Sol 133 12:35 (https://mars.nasa.gov/mars2020/multimedia/raw-images/HNM_0133_0678747773_222ECM_N0090001HELI05450_0000A0J). Subtraction of (133 Sol+12:35) from July 5 at 2:03 am PT gives 2021 Feb 18 4:43 (not 4:53 as currently used in the template) Schrauber5 (talk) 15:17, 23 July 2021 (UTC)

Best check should be possible with https://www.giss.nasa.gov/tools/mars24/ the update 8.2.1 should include local solar time (besides mission time) of perseverance Schrauber5 (talk) 15:50, 23 July 2021 (UTC)

My assumption that the time of a Sol is ranging from 0:00 to 24:39 seems to be wrong but the length of a second is adopted see Nasa technical note. In the meantime I corrected this in my templates and it's now in line with [1]. But if this is correct, in template there should be 4:24 as Sol 0, 0:00. Can somebody please crosscheck? Schrauber5 (talk) 10:29, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Changed to 4:24 and change to sol 155 was (within a minute) synchonous with https://mars.nasa.gov/mars2020/ Schrauber5 (talk) 10:46, 27 July 2021 (UTC)

So now the day changes at midnight of the local mean solar time. The mission time might be different from the LMST. The question: if the start of the mission time is in the middle if the day should the number change at local midnight or if 1 sol has elapsed? Schrauber5 (talk) 13:09, 27 July 2021 (UTC)