Talk:Yemenite Hebrew

Suggestion for transliteration?

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Actually there's more then one dialect of Yemenite Hebrew, thus there's more then 1 way to transliterate it. Here's a highly respected transliterated system. In Yemenite Hebrew the re's also strong 'he. א ’A′leph ’ (In Hebrew ’a′leph is not a vowel but a consonant and has no true equivalent in English. It is transliterated in writing by a raised comma (’). As pronounced in Hebrew it is the softest of guttural sounds (that is, sounds pronounced in the throat) and is like the slight guttural sound given to the silent “h” at the beginning of the English word “hour,” or like with the second “o” in “cooperate.”) ? Behth b ב v (It has a labial sound similar to the English “b” when a dot is placed in the middle of this Hebrew character to harden the letter’s pronunciation. Without the dot it has a softer sound close to “v,” as in the word “vine.”) ? Gi′mel g (corresponds generally to the English “g” when it has within it the point (daghesh lene); but without this point it is pronounced softer, more down in the throat. (Yemenite Hebrew of Shar'abi is J, Ji'mel) ג gh ? Da′leth d ד dh ה He’ h’ (Medium guttural- guttural sound somewhere between the softer ’a′leph and the harsher chehth. It thus corresponds generally to the English “h” and is similar to the sound of “h” in the word “behind.”) ו Waw w (In pronunciation this letter corresponds generally to the English “w,” as in “wine”; at times, however, in modern Hebrew it is given the sound of English “v.” In this work it is transliterated as “w” (ו), “u” (?), and “oh” (ו). It is rarely used as an initial letter, usually being substituted for by the letter yohdh (י). ) ז Za′yin z (It corresponds generally to the English letter “z”) ח Chehth ch’’ (This letter is the harshest of the guttural sounds and is similar to the sound of “ch,” as in the Scottish word loch or the German ach. In the Hebrew, in the eighth section of Psalm 119 (vss 57-64) every verse begins with this letter. In this work it is transliterated as ch to denote strong aspiration.) ט Tehth t (The sound represented by the letter corresponds to an emphatic English “t,” produced by pressing the tongue strongly against the palate. Its sound differs from that of the letter taw [ת] primarily because of its lack of aspiration after the “t” sound. In the original Hebrew, it appears at the beginning of each verse of Psalm 119:65-72.) י Yohdh y (The name of the smallest letter of the Greek alphabet, i·o′ta, evidently is akin to the Hebrew yohdh.) ? Kaph k (The 11th letter of the Hebrew alphabet. In sound kaph corresponds to kh when not having the point (daghesh lene) in it; but with this point in it (?), it becomes hard like the English “k.” In ) כ Final: ך kh (Soft) ל La′medh l (La′medh corresponds generally to the English “l.” ) מ Final: ם Mem m נ Final: ן Nun n ס Sa′mekh s ע ‛A′yin ‛ (It represents a peculiar guttural sound pronounced at the back of the throat and has no equivalent in English. It is transliterated as ‛.) ? Pe’ p פ Final: ף ph/f צ Final: ץ Tsa·dheh′ ts (It has a strong hissing sound similar to the sound of “ts” in English.) ק Qohph q (The sound is stronger than that of the letter kaph [כ] and is pronounced farther back in the throat, as a strong English “q” formed at the back of the palate. In Shar'abi it is a deep g.) ר Rehsh r ש Sin s (More hissing like is comparsion to sa'mekh) ? Shin sh (More hissing like is comparsion to sa'mekh) ? Taw t ת th Full Vowels ָ (long) Qa′mets a as in awl ַ Pa′thach a as in father ֵ (long) Tse′reh e as in they ֶ Se′ghohl e as in men ִ Chi′req i as in machine ֹ (long) Choh′lem o as in no ָ Qa′mets Cha·tuph′ o as in nor ֻ Qib·buts′ u as in full ִ Shu′req u as in cruel Half Vowels ְ Shewa’′ e obscure, as in "average"; or silent, as in "made" ֲ Cha·teph′ Pa′thach a as in hat ֱ Cha·teph′ Se′ghohl e as in met ֳ Cha·teph′ Qa′mets o as in not Special Combinations י ָ = ai י ִ = i י ַ = ai ו = oh י ֵ = eh  ? = u י ֶ = ey וי ָ = av (Information for those who know Spanish sounds) א ’Á·lef ’ ? Behth b ב v ? Guí·mel g (gu, antes de e o i) ג gh ? Dá·leth d ד dh ה He’ h’ ו Waw w ז Zá·yin z ח Jehth j ט Tehth t י Yohdh y ? Kaf k כ Final: ך kj’’ ל Lá·medh l מ Final: ם Mem m נ Final: ן Nun n ס Sá·mekj s ע ‛Á·yin ‛ ? Pe’ p פ Final: ף f צ Final: ץ Tsa·dhéh ts ק Qohf q (Shar'abi es g) ר Rehsch r ש Sin s ? Schin sch ? Taw t ת th Vocales plenas ? ָ (larga) Qá·mets a ? ַ Pá·thaj a ? ֵ (larga) Tsé·reh e ? ֶ Sé·ghohl e ? ִ Jí·req i ? ֹ (larga) Jóh·lem o ? ָ Qá·mets Ja·túf o ? ֻ Qib·búts u ? ִ Schú·req u Vocales muy breves ? ְ Schewá’ e indistinta o muda ? ֲ Ja·téf Pá·thaj a ? ֱ Ja·téf Sé·ghohl e ? ֳ Ja·téf Qá·mets o Combinaciones especiales י? ָ = ai י? ִ = i י? ַ = ai ו = oh י? ֵ = eh  ? = u י? ֶ = ei וי? ָ = av --72.38.211.144 (talk) 23:15, 13 December 2007 (UTC) I don't find this table very helpful: it mixes up Yemenite with Sephardic pronunciations. --Sir Myles na Gopaleen (the da) (talk) 08:32, 7 April 2008 (UTC) Please explain--Standforder (talk) 22:50, 7 December 2008 (UTC) The sounds it gives for the beghadhkephath letters are Yemenite. The sounds it gives for the vowels (especially segol and holam) are Sephardi and not Yemenite (in Yemenite, segol is æ and holam is either ö or ē). The sound it gives for sheva na is Ashkenazi and Israeli. As a whole, with the exception of qamatz it corresponds with the reconstructed Hebrew pronunciation in classical Hebrew grammars such as Davidson, which is not used in any community. --Sir Myles na Gopaleen (the da) (talk) 14:25, 8 December 2008 (UTC) Try this: א ’Alaf ’ as h in honor בּ Be b in boy ב Ve v in vine גּ Jimal j in judge ג Ghimal gh as g in Spanish amigo דּ Dol d in door ד Dhol dh as th in this ה He h in hay ו Wow w in will ז Zan z in zero ח Ḥet ḥ as Arabic ح ט Ṭet ṭ as Arabic ط י Yöd y in yes כּ Kaf Kăfufo k in king כ Chaf Kăfufo ch in loch ךּ Kaf Făshuṭo k in king ך Chaf Făshuṭo ch in loch ל Lamad l in look מ Miftuḥo m in mouse ם Mistumo m in mouse נ Nun Kăfufo n in now ן Nun Făshuṭo n in now ס Sămoch s in sun ע ‘An ‘ as Arabic ع פּ Pe Kăfufo p in pen פ Fe Kăfufo f in farm ףּ Pe Făshuṭo p in pen ף Fe Făshuṭo f in farm צ Ṣad Kăfufo ṣ as Arabic ص ץ Ṣad Făshuṭo ṣ as Arabic ص ק Göf g in girl ר Resh r in rain (technically as Arabic ر) שׁ Shin sh in shy שׂ Sin s in sun תּ Tow t in time ת Thow th in thin סּ Doghesh Ḥozog doubles the consonant. אָ Gomeṣ o in for אַ Pattaḥ a in father or bat אֵ,אֵי Ṣeri e in they אֶ,אֶי Pattaḥ Săghul a in father or bat אֹ,אוֹ Ḥölam ö in Parisian French port אִ,אִי Ḥirag i in field אֻ Shurag Gibbuṣ u in rule or bull אוּ Shurag u in rule or bull סְ Shăwo No‘ sounds like an ultrashort Pattaḥ or other short vowel depending on context (write ă, ĕ, ĭ, ŏ, or ŭ). אֳ Shăwo Gomeṣ sounds like an ultrashort Gomeṣ (write ŏ). אֲ Shăwo Pattaḥ and אֱ Shăwo Săghul sound like an ultrashort Pattaḥ (write ă). This is only one variety of Yemenite pronunciation; there are others that are slightly different. Squee3 (talk) 03:47, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

Edits in the talk page

There is a discussion in this talk page Talk:Yemenite Hebrew#Suggestion for transliteration? that dates back to 2007 and keeps getting edited since then by different ip and anonymous users. This is annoying because its spamming my watchlist with no reason. --شرعب السلام (talk) 22:43, 14 January 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for the notification; see above. I hope this helps. ~ ToBeFree (talk) 02:11, 15 January 2019 (UTC)

Babylonian comparison

It would be nice if someone copied the Babylonian symbols into the table to make it easy to compare and contrast the 2 systems 2600:1700:4ED0:43D0:A1F2:321:580B:FC8C (talk) 16:37, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

Suggestion

There is a lot of comparing yemenite and modern/israeli going on, however other pronunciations like ashkenazi is completely skipped out - it would be great to include it -especially it’s similarities and shared natures, thank you. MeKramer07 (talk) 16:27, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

Yemenite “Shva” contradicts mention in “Shva” page

In the Wikipedia page on “Shva”, it is stated that the Shva Ga’ya makes a Shva into an ultrashort version of the following vowel (It is unclear if this only applies when the Shva precedes a gutteral; the example could be read as arbitrary, as this section is obscure). The last sentence of this section states that ”[t]his ‘strict application’ is found in Yemenite Hebrew”. It is unclear to what this “strict application” refers to; if it refers to the Shva Ga’ya, it does not apply to Yemenite Hebrew: In Yemenite Hebrew, a Shva is always colored a following gutteral’s vowel, totally regardless of whether it has a ga’ya next to it.

One of these two pages must be edited to make sure the information in each is correct. One of them is wrong. QwertyCTRL. (talk) 19:15, 11 March 2024 (UTC)