Talk:The Sandman (TV series)

Editing Needed

This page could use some good editing. Phrases like "Constantine exorcises to cure the girlfriend of her addiction" don't make any sense.

Egerton’s Removal

This is an edit of minor stature, which will remove Taron Egerton from the cast. The cited source for Egerton’s involvement proclaims that it got the news from this Deadline report, which Gaiman refuted on social media. Lightcaller (talk) 22:27, 29 January 2021 (UTC)

Shooting date

According to an interview with Collider, the actor Boyd Holbrook confirmed the production actually had started shooting in late December and scheduled until June. Can this source be trusted? The Gargoyle King (talk) 05:48, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

That just might be when Holbrook started filming, because Gaiman confirmed that filming had begun on October 15. JOEBRO64 14:53, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

Episode count?

Several sources claim there's ten episodes "plus one" (whatever that means) in the first season. The article states eleven episodes in the "Transition to television" section and ten episodes in the "Release" section. Anyone know which is correct? Barry Wom (talk) 11:57, 25 July 2022 (UTC)

The Futon Critic, through Netflix's press release last month, reliably state ten. The eleven count is an outdated source. -- Alex_21 _TALK 13:10, 25 July 2022 (UTC)

There are eleven episodes, not ten. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.196.162.105 (talk) 13:40, 22 August 2022 (UTC)

Info

GimmeChoco44 That information is all true, not false. Lucifer was also referred to by Dream as Samael the Lightbringer, and invoked Anti-Life during their duel. And they did not secretly plot to kill Dream after Dream left, they told Dream to their face that they would destroy them one day before letting them leave. John Dee did not just prevent that diner from lying and causing a loop of sex, murder, and suicide, he did that worldwide, we just focused on the diner. It was said on the TV, then the end of the episode showed Dream stare at the destruction on the street, before Despair was then introduced watching him; this was at the end of Episode 5, not 6. 2001:BB6:5255:E200:E0B1:6606:4492:5633 (talk) 16:28, 7 August 2022 (UTC)

Thank you for bringing this to the Talk page.

Calling information "true" isn't enough -- each piece needs to be verifiable and fit within Wikipedia's standards.

Re: character naming, indicating an alias would be acceptable in the character list, but for the collective work of fiction, it cannot be given equal weight as the main designation.

Re: the duel, there were several tactics employed by the opponents, but they are not essential to the summary. (ref: Wikipedia:PLOTSUMNOT) Also, subjectively declaring Morpheus's defeat in your summary would be incorrect.

Re: the diner, the essential facts are all that is required. A plot summary is not a recap -- ref: Wikipedia:PLOTSUMNOT

Also, there are a few factual edits by other users that have been removed in your previous edits (such as Rose being 21), so those details should be considered before moving forward.

Might be best for you to address your edits section by section to contribute to the page. GimmeChoco44 (talk) 16:46, 7 August 2022 (UTC)

"Superhero"

"Sandman" is not a superhero story, and calling it one is misinformation. Someone please revert. Nicknack009 (talk) 20:40, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Also, based on the edit summary putting it back in, John Constantine is both not a superhero and not in the show, Doctor Destiny is not in the show, Hector and Lyta Hall are not superheroes in the show. Your edit summary suggests you have not watched it, and are editing based on reading the comic. --Nicknack009 (talk) 20:42, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Seriously, dude, your presumption is unfounded and wrong--I've watched all ten episodes.

But aside from that, you need to cite reliable sources supporting any and all of your assertions. Reliable sources, as of now, call it a superhero show. If you can show reliable sources consistently and commonly stating that it's not a superhero show, then it'll be changed.

Also, from Dr. Destiny: Doctor Destiny is a supervillain...David Thewlis portrays the character in the television series The Sandman on Netflix. From John Constantine: John Constantine is a fictional superhero...Jenna Coleman portrays a female version of the character (and her ancestor) in the Netflix series The Sandman. As to Hector and Lyta Hall, it's irrelevant that they don't appear as superheroes in this season as other superhero shows have done similar things with superhero/supervillain characters. But my point was that the background of the series is from superhero comics.

The bottom line is you need to cite reliable sources rather than dismissing sources because they contradict your world view. DonQuixote (talk) 20:56, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Nonsense. Other Wikipedia articles cannot be used as sources (whatever the article on John Constantine says, he's not in the show; Doctor Destiny is a supervillain, but he's also not in the show), and the TV series has made significant changes to the comic. Your sources only include it in a list of comic-based series, and use the term "superhero" as a general term. They don't specifically say The Sandman is a superhero show. Claiming on that basis that it is therefore a superhero show and demanding sources that it isn't is just rules-lawyering. You know it's not, and you know those sources and the way they're being used are misleading. --Nicknack009 (talk) 21:06, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Ok...wasn't really using other wikipedia articles as sources--pointing out that it's a consistency among the articles.

Bottom line is that it doesn't matter whether or not I think it's a superhero show (personally, I don't care). In fact, for the sake of illustration, I'm going to be contrarian at this point and say that it is a superhero show. So which of our POVs should be written into the article? The easiest and most constructive way to resolve this is to cite reliable sources. Seriously, dude, that's my only gripe at this point--that you're overriding what reliable sources say with your personal opinion. If you start citing reliable sources, then, personally, I really don't care what the results are. DonQuixote (talk) 21:14, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Thank you for confirming you are not editing in good faith. I will not engage with you any more. --Nicknack009 (talk) 21:17, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Seriously, citing reliable sources is a cornerstone of wikipedia. The fact that you're dismissing sources because they disagree with you is against policy and consensus. DonQuixote (talk) 21:22, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

"Reliable sources" does not mean uncritically parroting everything said in the media. We are obliged to discern whether or not a source is in fact reliable, and supports the claim being made. This one certainly isn't reliable, just read the thing. Neither this one nor this one specifically call The Sandman a superhero series, just include it in a list of comic-based properties and use the word "superhero" in the headline. They are not reliable sources for the claim made. --Nicknack009 (talk) 21:33, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

You can start a WP:RFC on the reliability of those sources and their claims. DonQuixote (talk) 21:37, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Don't be ridiculous. Just read the fucking things! By the way, I would draw your attention to WP:3RR and WP:NOTHERE. --Nicknack009 (talk) 21:39, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

I suggest you read those as well. I mean, you're the one trying to force your analysis (Don't be ridiculous. Just read the fucking things!). Seriously, start an WP:RFC and get the opinions of other editors. DonQuixote (talk) 21:46, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

That's what talk page discussions are supposed to be for. RFCs are for much bigger issues. But you are clearly only here to play the system, not to build an encyclopedia, so I'm going to follow my own advice and stop engaging, and allow other editors to weigh in. --Nicknack009 (talk) 21:54, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

The first step in building an encyclopaedia is to cite reliable sources. And RFCs are helpful in getting the attention of more editors, even editors outside the limited article space. I didn't say that you must start a RFC, I offered it as a suggestion.

And seriously, your presumptions are unfounded and entirely wrong. Accusing someone of "playing the system" when (as I've mentioned above) they have no vested interest in one version of the text or another is, frankly, akin to throwing a temper tantrum. DonQuixote (talk) 22:12, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

FWIW, I'd suggest trying a noticeboard before going the RFC route -- specifically WP:RSN. Happy editing --Middle 8 (s)talk • privacy 13:37, 9 August 2022 (UTC)

Kyo Ra / Vanesu Samunyai name wrong

I tried to edit, but is back to "Kyo Ra". The actress name is Vanesu Samunyai, as listed in imdb and even the link number eleven names her right. 152.156.220.192 (talk) 16:10, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Edit: I found out that the actress is listed "as Kyo Ra" in all sources and in the series ending credits. I check it out when I read dhe replies. So, as an idea: listing in the page could read "Vanesu Samunyai (as Kyo Ra)"? as I've seen in a lot of movies/films pages on Wikipedia when an artist use one name and presents him/him/themself in other. I'm really sorry for being such an annoying person. It's just I found really odd that she presents herself as Vanesu Samunyai and is not mentioned in her extract. Sorry again. I won't bother with this anymore. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2800:A4:1F88:C100:BCBA:276C:D263:DC73 (talk) 23:57, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

She uses both names. [1] And I've just checked the credits on Netflix, and she's credited as Kyo Ra. --Nicknack009 (talk) 18:35, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Even IMDB says she was credited as Kyo Ra. Spanneraol (talk) 18:43, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

As per WP:USERG, user-generated content such as IMDB is not acceptable. --GimmeChoco44 (talk) 19:59, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

I was responding to the original poster who claimed that IMDB had it listed differently, it does not... but by the way IMDB is not entirely user generated as they do curate and review the submissions and it is actually pretty darn accurate for past projects and credits... just not for things that have not been released yet. Spanneraol (talk) 20:06, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

I was also responding to the OP. Regardless of IMDB's hit/miss percentage, it's still listed by Wikipedia as an insufficient source, especially when there are other reliable sources for citations. --GimmeChoco44 (talk) 20:24, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Oddly similar sounding sentences

Hello, mates! While reading this article, I stumbled across two parts of sentences that sounded terribly similar:

1.: ''Amelia Emberwing of IGN gave a score of 9 out 10, praising the cast performances, particularly Sturridge's. She also praised the production values of the series, and felt that the series adapted its source material well, though was unsure if viewers who were unfamiliar with the source material would enjoy the series.''

2.: ''She also praised the performances, the delivery of dialogue, and its faithfulness to the source material and singled out the episode "24/7" as one of the best episodes of the year, though she expressed concerns as to how fans unfamiliar with the source material would enjoy the series.''

I'm pretty new to Wikipedia, so I don't quite know if that's bad or not, but this caught my eye, and I thought I might point it out. Also, in case y'all were wondering, this was under the Critical response part of the article.

Till we meet again,

-Village Dealer VillageDealer (talk) 18:15, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

Good catch, VillageDealer; fixed [2]   --Middle 8 (s)talk • privacy 07:56, 24 May 2023 (UTC)