Talk:Taurus Project

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"Oerrund hard"[edit]

The link that is used as a ref for the section on Oerrund hard is dead, hence it has no ref. And the project has not been announced anywhere else than on Facebook, apparently the page doesn't exist anymore. I would not be surprised if the project doesn't exist anymore, and as far as I know, the announcement never was put into practice. Therefore, unless someone comes up with a reliable source for the existence of the project, I'd suggest to remove the section. DFoidl (talk) 12:48, 24 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"factual accuracy is questionable"[edit]

Dear Justlettersandnumbers,

you wrote in the history that the "factual accuracy is questionable". Could you be so kind to tell me what exactly is questionable in the article? (Maybe you don't know enough about the topic) Many thanks. DFoidl (talk) 11:31, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

If you can't come up with any facts that are questionable, I remove that in the article. DFoidl (talk) 08:24, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

DFoidl, I'm sure that I don't know enough about the topic – it appears to have received minimal coverage in independent reliable sources, so there's little I could know.

The page was full of unsubstantiated and dubious claims, some of which I have removed (such as the cattle reared by this Stiftung being a breed – if it is, why isn't it reported as one to DAD-IS?). Others remain, such as the claim that they are called "Taurus cattle"; in what independent reliable source is that stated? Other claims are more worrying, such as that the breeds used are "aurochs-like"; what those Southern European breeds actually are is (somewhat) zebu-like.^[1] It seems that the modern view (not represented in that article from 2013) is that the zebu was domesticated from a different aurochs, Bos namadicus, so I suppose one could wonder how adding zebuine genetic heritage to Heck cattle might ever lead to anything similar to Bos primigenius?

You've removed the {{Disputed}} tag I added to the page; please consider all content therein to have been challenged and either remove – or provide sources for – any and all unreferenced statements. What is the source for Londo being "50% Sayaguesa, 25% Heck, 25% Chianina" and a "son of Lamarck", for example?

Do you have some connection to this project, or to people involved in it? If so you are expected to disclose it. Thank you, Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 21:14, 27 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

^ Emily Jane McTavish, Jared E. Decker, Robert D. Schnabel, Jeremy F. Taylor, David M. Hillis (25 March 2013). New World cattle show ancestry from multiple independent domestication events. Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. 110 (15): E1398–E1406. doi:10.1073/pnas.1303367110.

Ok, I see the problem: you don't know much about the topic, as you admit yourself. I give you an advice then, don't edit articles where you don't know much about the subject. That's just distressing for other users and rather pointless. I don't know much about quantum mechanics, for example, so I don't edit the article on quantum mechanics. Your cluelessness on this topic shows in the claim that Sayaguesa or Spanish fighting cattle are "zebu-like", which is laughable. It is true that indicine introgression has been detected in a number of Southern European breeds, Chianina among them, but that does not make them "zebu like". Indicine influence is found in many taurine breeds and vice versa. Apart from that, the paper by Orlando et al. found that zebus share a number of alleles with the European (!) aurochs that taurine cattle have lost, so indicine introgression could actually be beneficial for wildtype allele accumulation in domestic cattle. Furthermore, the breeding of Taurus cattle is not an attempt to reconstruct the aurochs' genetic diversity with selective breeding, as this is impossible, it concentrates on the phenotypic traits that are achievable with domestic cattle. That's why it is called "Abbildzüchtung" in German and not "Rückzüchtung" anymore. I didn't add the breed combinations of the respective individuals, feel free to remove it if you feel better then. What doesn't mean it is incorrect or "questionable". No, I have no connection to this project or any other project, I am merely a blogger who has been interested in the aurochs and aurochs-like cattle for about 11 years now. If you need help because you don't know enough about this topic, feel free to ask. BTW, what are the independent reliable sources for taurine cattle being usually called "taurus cattle"? All peer-reviewed sources that I know refer to them as "taurine cattle" and not "taurus cattle". Since you moved the article because of that, there must be a lot of reliable independent sources for taurine cattle being referred to as "taurus cattle", at least I hope so. Remember that it is "Wikipedia - the free encyclopedia" and not "Wikipedia - the interpretation of Justlettersandnumbers". Thanks. DFoidl (talk) 10:11, 28 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

[mctavish-1] Emily Jane McTavish, Jared E. Decker, Robert D. Schnabel, Jeremy F. Taylor, David M. Hillis (25 March 2013). New World cattle show ancestry from multiple independent domestication events. Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. 110 (15): E1398–E1406. doi:10.1073/pnas.1303367110.

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