Talk:Shemsdin (East Syriac ecclesiastical province)

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Mutrans of the Gida family[edit]

Can anybody shed any light on the provenance of the table I have inserted in this article? I have modified it from the table provided in the article Matran family of Shamizdin. This article consists for the most part of unsubstantiated assertion, and its tone does nothing to inspire confidence; but the table, which was presumably sourced from elsewhere, may well contain genuine information. The names of the churches are correct, the burial places are plausible and the dates of birth and death can in some cases be matched with reliable information from other sources. I am inclined, provisionally, to accept its evidence. None of this material was included in David Wilmshurst's The Ecclesiastical Organisation of the Church of the East, 1318-1913 (Louvain, 2000), and if it is genuine it adds considerably to our knowledge of the mutrans of Shemsdin.

Djwilms (talk) 09:10, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

More Info[edit]

1 Shemsdin was previously part of Beth Begash, who also had a Bishop Mar Khnanishu.

2 Mar Dinkha of Tees is the current Patriarch's great uncle.--Shemsdin2010 (talk) 19:41, 25 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I've just looked at Fiey's list of bishops of Beth Bgash, which contains one or two bishops I haven't yet included in my article Adiabene (East Syrian Ecclesiastical Province), which covers Beth Bgash, and I can't find any Hnanishos. Nor would it be particularly significant if I could, as before the fourteenth century several dozen Nestorian bishops named Hnanisho are known (e.g. Hnanisho of Gazarta, murdered by the Mongols in 1266, according to Bar Hebraeus), and the name was not yet associated with a particular diocese. But you intrigue me; what is your source for a bishop Hnanisho of Beth Bgash?

Thanks for the information about Dinkha of Tis.

Djwilms (talk) 01:42, 23 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Rawanduz[edit]

Neither Badger nor Cutts mentions that Rawanduz was part of the historic diocese of Shemsdin, though there were of course Nestorian Christians (and Chaldeans) living in Rawanduz in the nineteenth century, and its location makes it likely that they would have come under the jurisdiction of the mutrans of Shemsdin. Do you have a source for this?

Djwilms (talk) 03:49, 23 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The Christrians in Rawandus were brought there in 1830's by Pasha Kor for labour purposes from Iraqi Bradost area and where converted by the chaldean priest in Shaqlawa related to the Sher family.

There were however Nestorians in Diyana, which is part of the Rawandus district. Since the article mentions districts, Northern Rawandus district would be more proper. I'll leave that to you, my source is Rawandiznaye themselves and the Priest of Shaqlawa.--Shemsdin2010 (talk) 20:04, 25 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Suffragan dioceses[edit]

Mar Dinkha (Patriarch's great uncle) was never connected with Targawar, only Tees. However, he himself claims that his family was originally from Sat and probably arrived in Tees in the early 18th century.

Mar Yukhana responsible for a while of Tuleki, was of Dariyan village, his great nephew in 1953 became Bishop of Diyana.

Also, a fourth Suffragan dioces is not mentioned, Mar Abimalek of Mr Bishu, before going to India.--Shemsdin2010 (talk) 19:59, 25 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Neri[edit]

1 Shemsdin was centred around Neri only after 1750, with the arrival of Sheikh Neri family prior to that Shapatan in Rustaqa was the capital of Shemsdin, today the village of Navshar has become the capital.

2 Derrenaye, is not an area it means people who belong to Derreneh, an even better English spelling would be Dairaneh.--Shemsdin2010 (talk) 22:38, 26 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Spelling[edit]

Could you please explain spellings, if one was to read them as English words, then they sound nothing like the original Assyrian. Can you elaborate and give list of equivelant English alphabets.

For example shemsdin, any Assyrian who knows the correct pronounciation would write it as Shamizdin.--Shemsdin2010 (talk) 22:44, 26 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]