Talk:Manipur/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Lionizing Militants

"We are fighting for Manipur,"Sovereign, independent Manipur. You see, Manipur was never part of India." says a freedom fighter of UNLF.[8]

Delete this unnecessary quotation. Of the many militant organizations, why quote UNLF as if you are endorsing its position? This amounts to lionizing the extortionist militants of Manipur. Please delete it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 143.117.230.193 (talk) 14:34, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:ManipurSeal.gif

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BetacommandBot (talk) 21:25, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Burmese Refugees

How come there is no mention about the Burmese Refugee problem in Manipur. I donot know exactly but i guess there are more than ten thousand Burmese Refugees in Manipur, now. -dinesh

Title does not give any relevant accounts of Poireiton. Poireiton was one of the renown historical figure who migrated to Manipur in the early part of the 1st century. He migrated from Khamnung Sawa, a place near the southern part of Yunan Province of present China. The place also mention in the manuscript of Poireiton Khunthokpa as Leikha, in the geneologyn of Poireiton it is mentioned as Leikha. The place Leikha can be found in the old map of Burma as southern Leikai and Northern Leikai.According to the SageiSalairon Puya or Manuscript another name of Poireiton is Tangkhongtek

name of Manipur

Manipur is a new name given to the present state during the time of King Garibniwaz (1709 to 1749)when Hindu religion became the state religion. Before this name was given the land was known with different names according to the reigning Kings of this land. The land was known as Poirei Meitei Leipak(meitei=Mei=man, tei=Tai=Tai community) (Poi=the Poi ethnic people, Lei=land)or Meitei Poirei Leipak , Kangleipak (Kang=dry, leipak=land), Poirei Namthak Sarokpung (nam=water, thak=above,sarok=hunting ground, pung=hill). The Burnese called Manipur as Kathe or Cathe, to Tai people of Kabo Valley as Cassay, to Ahom as mekale or Mogle(=mounglei, Moung=country in Tai words), Kabui tribe of Manipur called Meitei as Taimei, Kukichin cvalled meitei or Meitai.On the other hand Meitei or Manipuri called Assam as Tek-khao,Tripura as Takhel or Thoungnang, Burmese as Ava or Khamaran, Yunan province as Khage ie Kha-khe (khe means Yunan in Tai words or Maung Khe), KaboValley peoples were known as Senbi Kabo.

Here the question arises, from the Poirei Meitei Leipak, this means the land of Meitei and Poi people or the land of Tai and Poi people. Poi peoples belongs to the group of people migrated with Poireiton or Tangkhongtek(this word Tangkhongtek has close affinity with the forefathers name of Lapchas of Sikkim). Poireiton migrated to this land before the ascend of the first historical King Nongdalai Pakhangba(Nong = heaven or Sky or high place, Da=descende,Lai= God or King or the Lai ancestoral people, Pa=pha=god or father,Khangba=recognised)at Kangla of Manipur in 33AD.He was the First Historical Tai king. Before him the Kha-ba ethnic groups were the ruling family of Kangla. Kha-ba or Kha means non Tai according to Tai langauge.

Before the comming of Poireiton to Manipur, the valley of Manipur was divided in different principalities, namely Kha-ba, Ngan-ba, A-ngom, Moirang, there was a conflict between the Khaba Nganba and Angom, the Angom massacred the two princepality

WP:INDIA Banner/Manipur workgroup Addition

{{WP India}} with Manipur workgroup parameters was added to this article talk page because the article falls under Category:Manipur or its subcategories. Should you feel this addition is inappropriate , please undo my changes and update/remove the relavent categories to the article -- TinuCherian (Wanna Talk?) - 05:52, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Problems facing Manipur

I have doubts about the factual accuracy of the ==Problems facing Manipur== section. --Hemanshu 20:02, 20 Sep 2004 (UTC)

I have grave doubts about that section's neutrality. I am going to remove the assertion that Manipur is the most corrupt state in India. Shorne 03:35, 3 Oct 2004 (UTC)
Hemanshu, please specify the parts that you feel are not factual -- Mutum
This section in particular needs edits, of language, precision (e.g. "a few years back" is not reliable Wiki language - what years?), and past/present tense issues, also some POV and colorful prose which need to be made consistent with other Wikipedia tone. I'm happy to help, but I don't know the facts - contact me if you want to collaborate on edits. Bruxism 03:50, 28 November 2005 (UTC)

The section titled "Problems Facing Manipur" is still not neutral. The tone of the piece demonstrates a clear leaning, and poetic language and anecdotes do not belong in Wikipedia - Camilo

India itself is highly corrupt country. No doubt, there is lots of corruption in Manipur but it will be wrong to say that manipur is the msot corrupt state in india.

The word 'corrupt' is not mentioned in the article. Where did you get it? --GDibyendu (talk) 17:02, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

NPOV dispute[history]

The discussion of the Hindu religious text Mahabharata and Manipur does not belong in history. Mahabharata is not a historical text and a priori not clear what is and what is not historically accurate in this text, and secondly it is not clear the Manipur in Mahabharata and the state of Manipur are the same. The whole discussion of Mahabharat characters does not belong in the historical section.

A historical text referring to the state of Manipur as such prior to the spread of Vaishnavism would be more appropriate to establish Manipur as the name in earlier times. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cosmicstring (talk • contribs) 20:19, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Mahabharata is not a history book, but it is a piece of literature. And it was written years ago, so, the fact that Manipur was mentioned in Mahabharata is notable enough to mention in History section. However, rest of the details of that paragraph (except the first sentence) can be removed as they appear in the wikipages for the characters: Chitrangada etc. And because that details is 'literature details' not 'history details'. BTW, Mahabharata does not claim these characters to be Hindu as far as I know. And, can you cite a website (preferable) or book (google book would be better as anyone can check) which disputes that 'Manipur' of Mahabharata is not the same 'Manipur' of today? Then we can include a sentence about that dispute, too. --GDibyendu (talk) 07:05, 25 June 2008 (UTC)
I think the onus of the proof rests with the person claiming the Manipur of Mahabharata and the state of Manipur as same. Is there no other city or place in south Asia that is named Manipur or has been named Manipur in the past? Its a giant leap of logic to find a name in a religious text, and associating it with names of places as found today.
In addition do we even know that the Manipur in Mahabharata referred to an actual place anywhere on the planet, and not just a name of a place imagined/conjured up by the author/s. This possibility cannot be ruled out until it is proven that Mahabharata is always historically accurate, in the absence of other historical evidence. Cosmicstring (talk) 19:07, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

GDibyendu, please read my comment in the new section regarding Historical names of Manipur. I want to keep the discussion about Mahabharata and Manipur separate from the discussion of the names used for the state of Manipur in the past in historical texts, chronicles. Cosmicstring (talk) 21:06, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

Why is Manipur linked to Mahabharata?

Manipur was a name given to Kangleipak only when Hinduism arrived in the early years of 1700. Whereas Mahabharata was written way before that. Please remove this from the history section and please stop trying to relate Manipur with the Hindu Aryan civilization.

Mahabharata is just a myth, there is no historical record, archeological evidence, and scientific proof that Mahabharata actually occured. Trying to link thet state of Manipur with the place called Manipur in Mahabharata is the work of hindu cultural nationalist and also an attempt to blackmail the racial origin of Manipuri people, both the meeteis, nagas and kukis etc.. So Wikipedia must remove the mythical origin theory of history of Manipur based on Mahabharata as fabricated by the hindu nationalist for the sack of historical accuracy. 


—Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.107.165.183 (talk) 00:40, 25 June 2008 (UTC)
Please read previous section. If you have a proof, then please state it. Thanks. --GDibyendu (talk) 17:08, 25 June 2008 (UTC)
The OP presents a view held by some that Manipur was never named so before adaptation of Hindu religion few centuries back. At the same time, the first sentence linking the state Manipur and Mahabharata needs a proof that is more than finding reference to the name Manipur in the Hindu religious text. To assert the claim by the OP about Manipur and Kangleipak we will need some historical reference. Cosmicstring (talk) 19:18, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

The name Manipur for Kangleipak was adopted by the British. Even after the king of Kangleipak was converted into hinduism, the name Kangleipak was still retain. It was the British with the help of hindu Brahmin who migrated to Manipur during the mediaval pariod. The Brahmin were used as informers by the British and these hindu Brahmin had their own aspiration of hindu cultural nationalism. So some British account also contain some concoction about the history of Manipur. The migration of Brahmin into Kangleipak was a result of the islamic onslaught. Assam and Manipur served as safe heaven for these hindu Brahmins.

The actual size of Kangleipak before the British arrival was much bigger than the current Manipur.In fact it can said that manipur today is just a part of ancient Kangleipak. Several British records confirm that the country extended far into the current Burmese territory and souhthern China. In fact the entire Naga hills and Lushai hills , now Mizoram accepted the suzerienty of the Manipuri rulers who ruled from the Kangla, the capital of ancient Kangleipak in Imphal.Please refer to the account of James Jonestone( Manipur and Naga hills), the political agent of the British crown to the court of Manipur.

In other words, there was no other highly organized kingdom or civilization between India, Burma and China except Manipur.Manipur the ancient kangleipak is perhaps the oldest south east asian civilization with written historical records for 2000 yrs. It is one of the oldest civilizations in the world which is still not lost with a considerable degree of originality. Its script based on human anatomy is neither borrowed from India nor from China. So the mythical story of Mahabharata and the history of Manipur(Kangleipak) are two completely unrelated and unconnected events.

The whole idea of messing the history of our state with so called Mahabharata, which is entirely based on myth is lame. We have our own history. The content of this article is immature and irrelevant. ```` —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.225.242.194 (talk) 05:43, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

Rather than claiming so much, write that history with citations in History of Manipur article. BTW, the article currently has no section on Demographics, Administration, Geography, Culture, Sports, Divisions (districts etc.), Transport, Education, Media. There is enough topic to work on: concentrate on a topic of your choice. That will be much more fruitful than this discussion. --GDibyendu (talk) 06:11, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
I was thinking of adding a section on Geography actually. Trying to get hold of a book. BTW I.P. 220.225.242.194 is not me.Cosmicstring (talk) 13:29, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

Dear GDibyendu, please stay away from this topic. We don't actually need to add Indian/Bengali views to the Manipur section or try to relate it with hindu/hindi, cricket or bollywood. -JIT —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jleishan (talk • contribs) 07:09, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

Who are 'we'? Wikipedia article is not owned (ref:WP:OWN) by anybody. BTW, Manipur is part of India, whether you like it or not. Cheers. --GDibyendu (talk) 08:39, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

We here refers to everybody who is reading the Manipur wiki article. All I'm telling you is that we should publish genuine text here. Not some fabricated article trying to relate Hinduism with ancient Manipur. Like it or not Manipuri's and/or the North-East are not ethnic Indians(South Asians) and they have a different ancestry/history(that belongs to South-East Asia) very different from that of Mainland India. And no one can deny this fact. Being in India and/or being annexed/administered/ruled by India, or being part of India is a different story and has got nothing to do with Manipur's history before 1947. It wont be too long before bollywood lovers start claiming that Beijing was mentioned in Mahabharata. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.107.248.220 (talk) 06:05, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

I think no body should add a POV. Lets stick to history here. Cosmicstring (talk) 17:06, 29 June 2008 (UTC)
True. But NPOV does not mean that each statement has to be neutral. It rather means presenting different views with citations. I am not for the Mahabharata view, but the whole point is: just like adding Mahabharata story is POV, removing it wholly is also POV. Rather a neutral thing to do would be that it was mentioned in Mahabharata, but scholars dispute whether Manipur mentioned there is same as today's Manipur state or not. I also agree that there is no need of details of Mahabharata story in this article. --GDibyendu (talk) 18:36, 29 June 2008 (UTC)
I am sure lot of things are mentioned in Mahabharata but how is it historical and what makes you think both the Manipur are the same. Glad that you agree removing the characters. Mentioning the characters takes it to a whole new level, establishing those as historical figures from the state of Manipur.
Let me just ask this: what is the problem with sticking to strictly historical texts? I don't see how thats a POV in History.
If you really want to insist on Mahabharata, can you provide the relevant sections (with a English translation) that establishes the positive identification with the state of Manipur.Cosmicstring (talk) 21:01, 29 June 2008 (UTC)
I am not insisting on Mahabharata, I just raised this issue as I found it to be a potential issue and some editors were busy in edit wars on that rather than concentrating on content development. Lets stop this discussion here, unless someone else raises it again. ANd the article looks great now contentwise and good images are added. Lets work on copyedit, wikilinks, references etc. See whether it makes sense to add any other topic and whether related articles are also in good shape or not. Great improvement, really. BTW, if any section looks verbatim copied from any other place (I am not claiming that it is so), lets work on rephrasing sentences before any issues on that comes up. --GDibyendu (talk) 13:38, 30 June 2008 (UTC)
Okay. I can remove the POV tag. I think the new sections need citations. I will ask the author. I had seen similar content on websites, and hesitant to add due to issues you mentioned.Cosmicstring (talk) 14:42, 30 June 2008 (UTC)
Start rephrasing the sentences. Thanks. --GDibyendu (talk) 15:29, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Restricted Area Permit

The "Restricted Area Permit" section in the intro sounds a bit awkward to be at the top of the article. Could we either remove this or put it somewhere else? Madan | Talk 17:12, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

In 2011, Restricted Area Permit has been Removed.

Article TOO long?

The article is very exhaustive but sometimes it gets just too long, full of endless text, maybe someone could synthetize it a little bit, and make it more reader-friendly? ArquiWHAT (talk) 00:18, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

There is a lot of flowery language, but then, it's a beautiful state :) Nshuks7 (talk) 14:43, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Leadership

A new section on leadership and governance is required. Representation in the state and central governments, ties with neighboring states should be included. Please contribute. Nshuks7 (talk) 14:44, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

Name

Why is the name of the state written in Bengali and Hindi, when neither of these are official languages of Manipur? --SameerKhan 09:13, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

  • Script is different from language. Bengali script is used to write Manipuri and Assamese language. Similarly, Devanagari is used to write Hindi, Gujarati etc. --Tabish q 15:09, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
To Sameer Khan. Manipur has its own script invented by the ancient Manipuris. This script is neither of Chinese or India Brahmic origin. The script is based on humane anatomy. However during 18th century in an attempt to bring Hinduism, one king made historically tragic decision to ban the script. Several books writen in this script were burn but still the script was in used untill the British came to introduce the Bangaly script because modern prnting system was there in Bangaly script.

Now the old script has been revived and the majority of the younger generation can use it effectively. And also upon translation of several books written in the old script, it is found that the religious phylosophy of the Manipuri people especially the meeteis is consistent with the equality of Mankind as opposed to casteism in Hinduism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.3.15.151 (talk) 17:14, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

Absolute nonsense, the form of Hinduism in Manipur is Gaudiya Vaishnavism which does not believe in caste-birth ideology.--86.28.122.48 (talk) 21:44, 18 February 2010 (UTC)

When there is already an own script for Meitei/Manipuri language and the Unicode font has been developed, why it is not used? Why Bengali/Devanagari script? The native script should be respected. --ସୁଭପାSubha PaUtter2me! 12:16, 20 June 2011 (UTC)

Historical names of Manipur

The author Saroj N. Arambam Parratt of "The court chronicles of the kings of Manipur: the Cheitharon Kumpapa", ISBN 0-415-34430-1 claims in the court records from 33-1763 CE, Manipur is not an ancient name associated with the state of Manipur. The relevant parts are accessible from google book. In this book, it is claimed that as late as 1868, the king of Manipur in a letter to the Viceroy of India refers to his country as Mahe. Several other names have been used including Kathe, Moglei, Meklee. One would think if the name Manipur was really associated with the state of Manipur in the distant past, it should be there along with the other names in the chronicles of Manipur, and also in the chronicles of Assam and Burma. Cosmicstring (talk) 21:25, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

OK. Can you give the google books result link here? Thanks. --GDibyendu (talk) 05:11, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
Lets see if this works http://books.google.com/books?id=oDQ2HMmU8_MC&printsec=frontcover&dq=manipur&sig=ACfU3U0SqR3ccjB0ZcKqz6faXnU2C1ZOjA Cosmicstring (talk) 13:31, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

Just a request to sign in or use a handle so we can talk without confusion. Cosmicstring (talk) 21:33, 25 June 2008 (UTC)


I went through the above discussion recently. And I was very upset to see the comments. It's very sad to see the people of our own country says Mahabharata as "so called Mahabharata". And what makes us think that the meitei people have been blackmailed in the past? I have been to Manipur and I respect the people of that place. I saw how religiously they are following their culture and religion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Luckyyou123 (talk • contribs) 20:53, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

Haydn's Dictionary of Dates and Universal Information Relating to All Ages and Nations  By Joseph Haydn

History under British rule.

http://books.google.com/books?id=IrcyAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA615#v=onepage&q&f=false

Rajmaan (talk) 21:24, 18 January 2013 (UTC)

Deletion of content from WP:RS

@2a02:c7d:93ee:6f00:3c04:8885:c83d:f1e4: why did you delete History section content summarized from many reliable sources? What is your concern with these sources? Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 19:41, 3 August 2016 (UTC)

Deletion of content from WP:RS

@2a02:c7d:93ee:6f00:3c04:8885:c83d:f1e4: why did you delete History section content summarized from many reliable sources? What is your concern with these sources? Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 19:41, 3 August 2016 (UTC)

@81.97.226.200: why are you deleting or distorting the same thing as above? Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 00:33, 14 November 2016 (UTC)

incompletquot

Over 2010–2013, the militant insurgency was responsible for the violent death of about 1 civilian per 100,000 people, each year.[11] The world average annual death rate from intentional violence has been 7.9 per 100,000 people.[12]213.49.133.183 (talk) 20:28, 24 December 2016 (UTC)

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Apples and oranges

The statement: From 2010 through 2013, the militant insurgency was responsible for the violent death of about 1 civilian per 100,000 people, each year.[13] The world average annual death rate from intentional violence has been 7.9 per 100,000 people.[14] is firstly incorrect and secondly is comparing two completely different things. First of all, look at the source: 1025 people died directly due to the conflict in the last 10 years, which is 3.5/100,000. Second of all, the first figure only talks about those stories which made the news and cannot hope to cover every case of murder in the state, which are surely higher.Brinerustle (talk) 12:33, 27 April 2018 (UTC)

Manipuri Cuisine page

The Manipuri Cuisine page is linked to the page Meitei people, but not to the page of Manipur. I realise that the Meitei are only one of the ethnic groups of Manipur (though in the majority), and that having this page present their cuisine as typical Manipuri may not be entirely correct. But as this page is attempting to present at least one strong aspect of the cuisine of Manipur, and as at present the Cuisine pages are organized by administrative areas, then I believe it is appropriate to have it linked to on the Manipur page Brunswicknic (talk) 12:05, 16 April 2020 (UTC)

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Sora MDJAHANGIR12345 (talk) 08:55, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 31 July 2020

The picture of Manipur Museum depicted in the page is wrong. So I do request the editors to take a closer look to it. MoBicot (talk) 06:53, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

 Done. Replaced with image of Ningthoukhong Gopinath Mandir, file rename request filed on Commons. ◢  Ganbaruby!  (Say hi!) 13:32, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

Governor

Padmanabha Balakrishna Acharya (PB acharya} RameshSirji (talk) 19:03, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Manupur is a state in the north eastern part of India

Many of the indians in north india use to discriminate northeastern people because of their apparence and language wgich should not be done.. i only want to tell you that please don't do that because if you will discriminate them then in return they will descriminate you back which should not be done because we are all from a sibgke country name india Cdt. Abhishek Kumar (talk) 13:57, 5 June 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 8 December 2022

Hello, I suggest an edit, in the section of official language of this state there’s an error: It says “state language” instead of official language, what is more common way to put, and in the state language it says Meitei language (Manipuri language), for short just put Meitei. In short, please replace "state language" with official language, and make the official language only Meitei 190.110.48.42 (talk) 18:55, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

You're referring to the infobox, right? I've changed that as requested. Let me know if there are any other instances that need attention. – Uanfala (talk) 21:58, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 January 2023

Zogamstmt (talk) 06:47, 2 January 2023 (UTC)The Meitei represent around 53% of the population of Manipur state, followed by various Naga ethnic groups at 24% and various Zo (Kuki/Zomi) people at 16%.[1]
 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. WP:CIRCLE Lemonaka (talk) 07:34, 2 January 2023 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ Wikipedia contributors. (2022, December 26). Zo people. In Wikipedia, The Free Encyclopedia. Retrieved 06:46, January 2, 2023, from https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Zo_people&oldid=1129555938

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Semi-protected edit request on 4 March 2023

Correction: Capital and largest city must be indicated. 49.146.22.36 (talk) 06:03, 4 March 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. M.Bitton (talk) 14:44, 4 March 2023 (UTC)

Infobox replacement

The {{Infobox settlement}} used on this page is going to be replaced with {{Infobox Indian state or territory}} as per the Proposal and Consensus of RFC. Any questions/suggestions? Discuss Here.

You can also contribute by replacing Infobox settlement with Infobox Indian state or territory on other pages , or by improving this one. Tojoroy20 (talk) 18:49, 12 March 2023 (UTC)

 Done Replaced — Tojoroy20 (talk) 20:13, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
Infobox Replacement was undone by Haoreima at 14:46, 13 March, without any proper reason or discussion on the Talk Page. Tojoroy20 (talk) 11:50, 14 March 2023 (UTC)
Tojoroy20 Don't feel bad. Please see my reply here. I expressed my concerns here. I have no bad intentions upon you. --Haoreima (talk) 11:54, 14 March 2023 (UTC)
Do not revert or make any changes that are against the consensus of the RFC. Tojoroy20 (talk) 12:02, 15 March 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 19 June 2023

The Meitei people[26] represent around 53% of the population of Manipur state, followed by various Naga ethnic groups at 24% and various Kuki/Zo tribes (also known as Chin-Kuki-Mizo people) at 16%. The Meitei Pangal people represent 8.04% of the total population.[27] Manipur's ethnic groups practice a variety of religions.[28] According to 2011 census, Hinduism, Christianity, Islam, and Sanamahism are the major religions of the state.[28][29] Between the 1961 and 2011 censuses of India, the share of Hindus in the state declined from 62% to 41%, while the share of Christians rose from 19% to 41%.[30] Deheave (talk) 18:50, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. 𝙳𝚛𝚎𝚊𝚖𝚁𝚒𝚖𝚖𝚎𝚛 𝚍𝚒𝚜𝚌𝚞𝚜𝚜 13:14, 21 June 2023 (UTC)
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