Talk:John Iorweth Hughes

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Requested move 20 May 2020[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: move John Hughes (soccer) to John Hughes (soccer, born 1965), but no consensus to move John Iorweth Hughes. DrKay (talk) 16:08, 21 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

– Incomplete disambiguation as there are other footballers named John Hughes, see John Hughes#Sports. Redirect John Hughes (soccer) to John Hughes#Sports Jerm (talk) 05:42, 20 May 2020 (UTC) —Relisting. Steel1943 (talk) 14:47, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose second. We use "soccer" for association football players from North America because that's what they use. I would prefer "soccer, born 1965", given it's also sometimes known as soccer in the UK, but that seems to be opposed by general consensus, as "soccer" is apparently considered to be sufficient disambiguation. As to the first, do we know he was commonly known as John Hughes? His article is titled John Iorwerth Hughes, but internally calls him Jack Iorwerth Hughes. So, was he commonly known as John Hughes, Jack Hughes, John Iorwerth Hughes or Jack Iorwerth Hughes? -- Necrothesp (talk) 16:55, 20 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

If it's Jack Hughes then Jack Hughes (footballer) would have to move to Jack Hughes, (footballer, born 1866), but I'm just guessing though. Jerm (talk) 17:08, 20 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Jack Hughes (footballer) should be moved anyway, since it is clear that John Hughes (footballer, born 1855) and John Iorweth Hughes were known as Jack Hughes. —BarrelProof (talk) 19:31, 20 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related page moves. Giant Snowman 17:27, 20 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose second - first should be at John Hughes (footballer, born 1913) per this, whereas the soccer player should remain where he is. Giant Snowman 17:39, 20 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Support per above.--Ortizesp (talk) 19:25, 21 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - Regardless of the outcome of this discussion, the current title is wrong as his middle name should be spelled "Iorwerth", not "Iorweth". – Pee Jay 21:04, 23 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Support (soccer, born 1965), per newly established consensus at WP:NCSP that "soccer" is insufficient disambiguation. -- King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 04:03, 31 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Support removing the middle name from the first and adding dates of birth to both, per King of Hearts. BD2412 T 03:59, 24 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. John Iorweth Hughes was Welsh, and three-word names in everyday use are common in Wales (see e.g. Dafydd Elis Thomas and Ieuan Wyn Jones), so the default assumption of a two-word common usage should not be applied to Welsh people. I oppose stripping out his middle name unless there is evidence that he didn't use it. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 04:22, 25 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@BrownHairedGirl: he is 'John Hughes' at this and this (the latter also lists his full name, but the headline is just 'John Hughes'. I also note he is called 'Jack Hughes' at ENFA (if you use the player search function). Giant Snowman 18:45, 28 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the links, @GiantSnowman ... but they are modern databases which give clue whether their use of "John Hughes" is based on actual research or is just an application of house style. Contemporary news reports would be helpful. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 18:52, 28 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Do something, the status quo is not OK, these two are ambiguous.

John Hughes (soccer) --> R. John Hughes would work.

John Hughes (soccer) → John Hughes (footballer, born 1965) works.

Deleting John Hughes (soccer) for being non-notable would work too. --SmokeyJoe (talk) 05:00, 29 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.