Talk:Everybody (Logic album)

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Albums

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Overall editing[edit]

Could it please be encouraged to utilize language suitable for an encyclopedia, as well as ensuring the grammar and punctuation are proper within the page. The content for specific sections needs to also be retained to that specific part, rather than to expand upon in a more generalized format.

Common words[edit]

@Apokrif: Words such as "rapper" and "studio album" are everybody words that people already know, they don't need to be linked. TheAmazingPeanuts (talk) 19:21, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

"Words such as "rapper" and "studio album" are everybody words that people already know": no. See Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Linking#What_generally_should_not_be_linked and in particular: "However, try to be conscious of your own demographic biases – what is well known in your age group, line of work, or country may be less known in others.". Apokrif (talk) 19:22, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Apokrif: I know what the damn the guidelines says, that still don't have anything to do what we talking about. Everybody in the WikiProject Albums knows what a rapper and studio album is, which why they not linked in the first place. You clearly don't go around in music-related articles. TheAmazingPeanuts (talk) 19:36, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Pinging @Walter Görlitz: @Binksternet: Everyday words such as "rapper" and "studio album" should be linked? TheAmazingPeanuts (talk) 19:45, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

At least "studio album" is not an everyday phrase. Apokrif (talk) 20:09, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Apokrif: Maybe "studio album" can be linked, but I'm pretty sure that everybody knows what a rapper is. TheAmazingPeanuts (talk) 20:19, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Do we have a reliable source for this? Apokrif (talk) 20:58, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Apokrif: Do you even understand what I taking about? Everyday words such as rapper, singer, songwriter and producers don't need to linked, especially in album-related articles. Did you even look at the music articles that are in the good article criteria? TheAmazingPeanuts (talk) 21:39, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Did you read Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Linking#What_generally_should_not_be_linked and in particular: "However, try to be conscious of your own demographic biases – what is well known in your age group, line of work, or country may be less known in others." ? Apokrif (talk) 21:58, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Apokrif: I already know what the guidelines says, I think linking "studio album" is okay but linking common words such as "rapper", "singer" and other well known things are not needed. TheAmazingPeanuts (talk) 22:07, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Pinged, so here I am. Everybody reading the article should know what a rapper is, and what an album is, and what a studio is. "Studio album" isn't a new concept; we don't have an article about it other than just album. Really, it's an album made in a studio – the usual kind of album. These concepts are worldwide, not specific to one demographic. Binksternet (talk) 22:35, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Also pinged. I doubt that anyone who comes to this article would not know what a rapper is, and they likely know what a studio album is as well.

The point of linking is not to create a WP:SEAOFBLUE, but to link terms that are 1) likely unfamiliar to the reader, or 2) are likely deeply linked to the subject. In other words, we don't link American here, but we would in an article about a national sports league. Neither guest, appearance, nor the phrase guest appearance are linked because the reader clearly understands what those words mean in common use. That would also apply to reading about an album by a rapper. The reader should already understand what those terms mean. If they honestly do not, there is the search box on every page.

The question I find most useful in helping determine if a link is needed is, "would a reader think, 'what's that thing, you know that was important to Logic's Everybody album?' and t hen come to this article to find the term and a link to the article. If the answer to that question is not obvious, then a link is not obvious either. Walter Görlitz (talk) 23:26, 20 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Binksternet: @Walter Görlitz: I pinged you guys because I think one of you would explain to Apokrif better. Yes I agreed with both of you, common words don't need to be linked, it's seems that Apokrif doesn't understand what I taking about, that's why I asked for a second opinion on this topic. TheAmazingPeanuts (talk) 06:57, 21 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

"it's seems that Apokrif doesn't understand what I taking about": I do, that's why I referred you to the relevant MOS section.

Regarding "Everybody in the WikiProject Albums knows what a rapper and studio album is": our articles are for a general public, not some wikiproject's members. Apokrif (talk) 07:23, 21 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Apokrif: You are not making any sense here. You seem to be the only one who are making a big deal about this. Binksternet and Walter Görlitz has clearly explain why linking common words such as "studio album" and "rapper" are unnecessary. It's three against one in this discussion, I can pinged a lot more editors who work on album articles and they will agree with me, not you. TheAmazingPeanuts (talk) 18:48, 21 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Apokrif No one wrote that everybody in the project knows this, what was implied is that every human who would read this article about a rapper's album would know what both of those terms mean. That includes the general public. At this point, you are not in favour with consensus about linking these terms here, or anywhere. Walter Görlitz (talk) 20:58, 21 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I replied to what you wrote (about the project, not the readers). Looks like you misphrased. Anyway, if you mean that every reader of this article knows what a studio album is, you're wrong. Apokrif (talk) 21:41, 21 March 2021 (UTC)I[reply]

I'm sorry. I did write that. I do mean every reader of this article. The other editors would not have bowed so far. You're simply deluded if you think otherwise. No one is going to come to this article who does not not know what the term means. Perhaps a more popular work, but certainly not this one.

As for consensus, care to explain that? Walter Görlitz (talk) 22:26, 21 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Walter Görlitz: I think Apokrif was taking to me, anyway this editor clearly don't know what they taking about. Lot of people very much knows what "studio album" and "rapper" means and yet Apokrif keep on arguing about it. TheAmazingPeanuts (talk) 21:56, 22 March 2021 (UTC){[reply]

Walter Görlitz's point (which I just replied to) was not about "lot of people": they claimed that "No one is going to come to this article who does not not know what the term means", which is wrong. Apokrif (talk) 22:00, 22 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

And you do not know what a rapper is either? Walter Görlitz (talk) 05:18, 23 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, looks like I mixed up two differents people's comments when I replied. Anyway at least one person (me) read this article without knowing what a studio album is. AFAIK there is no obvious link between lexical knowledge and the popularity of works one reads about so I don't get your point about "a more popular work". Apokrif (talk) 21:53, 22 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]