Talk:Early Israelite campaigns

This article was nominated for deletion on 1 January 2015 (UTC). The result of the discussion was keep.

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Moral and political analysis[edit]

Since there was concern with refs for this section @Editor2020:, I've put in more detail about the Zionists and Havrelock's fine analysis, before putting in Prior and the anti-Zionist viewpoint. In any case, this ethical angle on the topic (i.e., Israelite military campaigns) is certainly notable and has reliable sources; there's some related stuff on literary analysis, not sure why this section was deleted. After all, can't something be let standing in a WP article, with a citation needed tag, until various volunteers a chance to improve it? Thanks! ProfGray (talk) 03:30, 13 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Rename[edit]

Could this article be expanded and renamed to Israelite conquest of Canaan? Editor2020, Talk 22:03, 18 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Seems plausible but there may be drawbacks. Are you thinking that the term conquest is more common than campaign? I like the focus here on the military activities. In what way(s) would conquest expand the scope or meaning of the title?

I would be reluctant to expand into the entire arena of Israelite settlement of Canaan, even though here we do need to refer to the alternative hypothesis to actual battles, because then it balloons into all the archaeological sites and maybe time periods. Do you see my concern with that? Thanks, ProfGray (talk) 22:24, 18 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Early Israelite campaigns seems....incomplete. Campaign for what? Just trying to think of a way to provide some context. Editor2020, Talk 03:40, 19 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, the title needs to be a little bit more specific like which campaigns? — JudeccaXIII (talk) 03:59, 19 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

We might look at Category:Hebrew Bible events, which uses narrative well. Maybe we could try: Conquest of Canaan narratives or Conquest of Canaan narratives in the Book of Joshua or Military campaigns in the Book of Joshua. By using narrative and/or naming the book, the title would create critical distance (NPOV) and still keep this article from getting drawn into all Israelite archaeology.

Btw, I left out Israelite from Conquest of Canaan narratives because it's obviously Biblical. ProfGray (talk) 04:42, 19 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps Biblical campaigns of Joshua — JudeccaXIII (talk) 04:45, 19 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Conquest of Canaan narrative in the Book of Joshua? Hmmm. Editor2020, Talk 00:59, 20 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Does "hmmm" mean yes, Editor2020? I know it's long, but it fits a reasonable model. ProfGray (talk) 01:40, 20 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

That means I'm thinking. Don't want to rush into anything. Editor2020, Talk 01:42, 20 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

If anyone were to change the name of the article I wouldn't complain. Editor2020, Talk 01:06, 9 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Suggestions for improvement[edit]

I've added a few touches to bring the article more into line with the better Wikipedia articles on OT subjects. One is simply to add a Bibliography section. Within the bibliography, it's useful to have links to the books in google-books (assuming google books is being used). It's also useful to use sfn format for individual books, though many editors dislike it because it means you need to click twice, once to find the name of the book and the page number, then again to find the link to google books.

I also rewrote the lead because I felt it wasn't accurately reflecting the current scholarly consensus - only the most conservative of scholars today hold that there really was a conquest, and we need to give the majority view top billing.

Finally, to make this article worthwhile, I think it would need to be retitled as Israelite conquest of Canaan or something like that - start with a general article, and if there's enough data a more focused article could follow.

Hope this helps. PiCo (talk) 00:33, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

(P.s. - Kennedy is mentioned several times, but he's not a reliable source (this is a dissertation held in a university library, not a peer-reviewed paper and not from a front-rank scholar) - we need to stick with the mainstream).PiCo (talk) 00:40, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]