Talk:Bachelor's degree/Archive 2010

Canada

Canada

"Depending on the province, a bachelor's degree takes either three or four years to complete. Traditionally, a three-year degree is also called a pass degree or general degree, and a four-year degree is also called an honours degree. In provinces that grant three-year bachelor's degrees, a student may choose to complete an additional year of studies to obtain a four-year honours degree."

I go to UVic, and a general degree relates only to the lack of a specific program of study. It's still four years. A four year degree is NOT an honours degree here, unless it meets very specific course and GPA guidelines.

"An honours bachelor's degree is generally a prerequisite for admission into graduate studies in Canada."

This isn't true at all. In the arts, a graduate school cares more about completion of a degree in combination with a submitted portfolio. In other areas of study, sometimes only GPA and the application information matter. I think everything in the Canada section should be revamped. Maybe with some actual sources rather than some know-it-all.64.251.85.182 (talk) 18:34, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

In Ontario, an "Honours" Bachelor of Arts/Science is simply a four year Bachelor's degree (distinguishing them from the three-year programs). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.231.56.158 (talk) 05:49, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

At every Canadian University I know of, an honours degree requires an individual to take a higher than normal number of courses (for example, sixty credit hours instead of thirty six under a credit hours program) in a specific program, and to achieve a minimum GPA. Most also require the completion of a thesis. 67.68.24.58 (talk) 22:12, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Question regarding degrees

I have a quick question about degrees. When honours is after the degree, does that mean the person graduated with a higher than 80% average in the course?? Like "English Degree, Honours?" If not this, what???-Dylan Bradbury 21:10, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

It's somewhat specific to the university and the degree. Sometimes honours is an extra year and extra coursework in the first three years, sometimes honours is a one-year standalone program post-Bachelor, and sometimes it reflects the grade. This would be a worthwile addition and clarification to the article.--Limegreen 22:45, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Some schools prefer not to use Latin. Honors mean Cum Laude, Highest Honors means Summa Cum Laude. One example is my alma mater Georgia Institute of Technology, which also says "Cooperative"on some degrees. That gets a chuckle out of some who don't know what it means. 184.36.114.200 (talk) 21:11, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

There is also High Honors which means Magna Cum Laude. Siriuskase (talk) 21:16, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

Use of the term "Four year degree"

I'm curious about the American use of the term "four year degree". Certain US employers list having a "four year college degree", or a "four year BS or BA degree from an accredited university" as a requirement. Does the use of the phrase "four year" literally mean the course must have lasted four years, or is this due to some feature of the US education system? (E.g. all Bachelor's degrees in the US last four years, and anything less than that is some lesser degree?)

So, for example, would a three-year BSc Hons. degree from a UK university be equivalent to what these employers are asking for? Is this something which should be explained in the article? Adam McMaster 21:39, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

"Four year college" or "four year school" or "four year degree" is used to distinguish regular universities, and the degrees they confer (e.g. the BA, BFA, BSc) from junior colleges. I would imagine that a Bachelor's from any UK, Commonwealth, or European university, regardless of how long it took to earn, would be considered a valid equivalent and would be accepted. 66.43.86.226 (talk) 20:02, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

Ummm, well, maybe. You can get a 3 year or 4 year bachelor degree in Canada (depending on geography, school, and discipline), and employers there definitely make a distinction between the two. Furthermore, as someone with a Canadian undergrad (4yr) and US graduate degree (JD) who lives in the US, I can say with some certainty that US employers scrutinize foreign degrees. While I don't doubt that a 3 year honours degree from Oxford is impressive, I would not assume that it is equivalent to a 4 year degree from Harvard (just as an example - note that I am not saying they are not equivalent, I am simply saying that one cannot assume). Most large US employers are informed enough to know that there are 3 year bachelor degrees in much of the english speaking world; asking for a 4 year degree specifically addresses this issue. Otherwise, they would simply specify a bachelor degree, as the lesser degree in the US is called an associate degree. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.14.67.251 (talk) 06:45, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

I have regularly come across the requirement for four years of higher education as a "hard" requirement from the Americans. I believe this is probably justified because frankly there's no compelling reason to accept that three years of UK education for example is equivalent, when especially given the requirement for some kind of dissertation in American B.S. degrees etc, the four year so-called Masters in the UK would be more equivalent. Obviously one can't generalise, obviously quality and quantity cannot directly replace each other, and obviously focus and generality have their own pros and cons. Having studied in Delft in The Netherlands, I often feel short-changed because while the B.Sc there is three years on paper, it is rarely completed in much less than four, and in any case comprises longer academic years than in either the UK or US.

Anyway, the Americans often consciously specify four years to exclude foreigners who at least in their view haven't got equivalent qualifications. I agree with the above analysis that they would say "bachelors" if it was the title they wanted and not the content. They say four years because that is what they want. Princeofdelft (talk) 09:41, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

The term "four year degree" distinguishes the bachelor-level degrees from the associate-level degrees. In the US, one can obtain an associates degree (AB) in two years. Associates degrees are granted by separate institutions (typically community colleges). Whereas a single institution might grant bachelors, masters, and doctoral degrees, associate degrees (also called "two-year degrees") come from these separate institutions. Wikiant (talk) 14:10, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

I agree that the term "four year degree" is, for the most part, is inaccurate and an anachronism. The point is, really, that the amount of time it takes an individual to complete the requirements of a degree is irrelevant in the current day - and has been for some time. While "four year degree" may have had some currency at one time, the reality is that the number of credits one has to complete determines whether or not an individual earns a degree and not the amount of time they spend in an institution. Indeed, in the US at least, the majority of students are considered "non-traditional students", and many of them attend part-time, which necessarily means in most cases that they will not fulfill the requirements for a degree in four years. Without question the use of the term "four year degree" is still in popular usage both inside and outside of academic circles, but the reality is that it does not accurately describe anything and is really an antiquated reference. Shoreranger (talk) 16:48, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

I wouldn't go so far as to say that "the reality is that it does not accurately describe anything and is really an antiquated reference," particularly if one is working with full-time, traditional undergraduates. But it's certainly very limited outside of that population. Incidentally, I think that this is why some of us prefer the-more-cumbersome-but-more-accurate term "baccalaureate degree."

This is truly a bizarre conversation being held over a three-year timespan. ElKevbo (talk) 17:16, 24 November 2010 (UTC)