Talk:List of doping cases in cycling

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Major Taylor[edit]

This section doesn't make any claim that Major Taylor doped! The first sentence claims he feared someone knifing him. The second one claims Nitroglycerin was used by cyclists. What's the connection between the two? Did nitroglycerin cause paranoia, too? Was he making cloaked reference to the knife as metaphor for nitro? --Zachbe (talk) 07:41, 4 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You're right, the original para was about nitroglycerin and used Taylor as an example (following the shape of the source material), but an edit to reorganise by name made them appear to be nonsequitors. *Nitroglycerine was used to stimulate the heart after cardiac attacks and was credited with improving riders' breathing.[1] Riders suffered hallucinations from the exhaustion and perhaps the drugs. The American champion Marshall Taylor refused to continue a New York race, saying: "I cannot go on with safety, for there is a man chasing me around the ring with a knife in his hand."[2] Autodidactyl (talk) 09:37, 5 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I'm removing the Major Taylor section: it is tenuous to the absurd. The introduction states: "The following is an incomplete list of doping cases in cycling. It contains doping cases and those who have tested positive for a illegal performance-enhancing drugs, prohibited recreational drugs or have been suspended by a sporting body for failure to submit to mandatory drug testing." Nowhere does the passage on Taylor does it assert that he tested positive or was suspended, therefore it doesn't belong on the list.Amanda bee (talk) 12:00, 4 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Have you actually checked both references. They are neither tenuous nor absurd. The para clearly stated and referenced that nitro caused hallucinations. This was an early example of what humans will try to improve (their own or other's) performance. It does not claim that Taylor knowingly ingested the substance and makes no reference to cheating or illegality. His was not an era of positive tests or suspensions, so we cannot use contemporary criteria. Therefore I am sure that it should be included. Autodidactyl (talk) 14:22, 4 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ Novich, Max M., Abbotempo, UK, 1964
  2. ^ Bearings, US, 24 December 1896, cited Ritchie, Andrew, Major Taylor, Bicycle Books, US, 1988

1896[edit]

  • Marshall Taylor of the USA was the American champion. He refused to continue a New York race, saying: "I cannot go on with safety, for there is a man chasing me around the ring with a knife in his hand."[1] Nitroglycerine was used to stimulate the heart after cardiac attacks and was credited with improving riders' breathing, but they suffered hallucinations from the exhaustion and the drugs.[2]

References

  1. ^ Bearings, US, 24 December 1896, cited Ritchie, Andrew, Major Taylor, Bicycle Books, US, 1988
  2. ^ Novich, Max M., Abbotempo, UK, 1964

Unsubstantiated Doping Accusations[edit]

There are a number of cases listed here that predate testing, and while they may be compelling, I don't think it is fair to list them as though they are as verified and verifiable as modern cases. Perhaps a section with a discussion of possible doping in the distant past would be a more appropriate for these early cases? Amanda bee (talk) 12:27, 4 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Careful reading of the original intro (It contains doping cases and those who have tested positive) shows that it is not a list of shame or illegality, and thus not an issue of fairness. I have redrafted the intro to try to make this much clearer, but I don't expect it to be the final draft. Autodidactyl (talk) 14:29, 4 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
If rumors are to be included, the header should also clearly state something along the lines of "Rumored drug use may be included, as well." sinneed (talk) 13:29, 24 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
In the case of living persons, I should think the that Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons would preclude rumors being listed. I am not an expert and would be led by Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard response. sinneed (talk) 23:25, 24 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]
"not a list of shame or illegality"? This is a page on doping cases, how can it be anything BUT such a list. Why is Lance Armstrong included at all? This list needs a major rework to fall within the acceptable realm of proof as stated by Wikipedia's guidelines. Far too many rumors, unsubstantiated claims, and worse, vindicated cases are included in this list and should not be here.RTShadow (talk) 01:24, 4 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
If you are going to link to this page right off Lance Armstrong`s Wiki page, it is not going to require "careful reading of the introduction" here for a reader to realize that at least one person listed here, the American rider Lance Armstrong, was never convicted of even one doping infraction in a very long and (still vibrant) career.Jack B108 (talk) 00:03, 18 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Page Formatting[edit]

While I'm here, it seems like this page needs formatting help. I can't find instructions for "lists by year" in general, but this is the only comparable list I could find:

and it seems cleaner. I'll organize by decade ... is there an actual template or formatting guideline for "lists by year"? Timelines don't seem to apply. Amanda bee (talk) 12:27, 4 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Much better. Autodidactyl (talk) 13:18, 4 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Additions to make while the page is protected[edit]

Gabriele Bosisio's 2 year ban has to be added to the end of the 2010 section. Copy and paste the text below please.

  • On 28 April, it was announced that Gabriele Bosisio would be suspended from professional cycling for 2 years. He tested positive for EPO in an out-of-competition test in September 2009. He was provisionally suspended by the UCI on October 6, and so his ban will end on 5 October 2011.[1] —Preceding unsigned comment added by Lckyby (talk • contribs)
The page will be unprotected in a few hours. You can make the change then. The page was protected in response to off-wiki discussions that made it clear that a number of editors were making (or planning) edits that clearly violate Wikipedia's policies on biographies of living persons. That is the reason for the protection: if it continues after unprotection, the page will be re-protected. Sourced and verifiable information (as provided in the main Bosisio article) is welcome, innuendo is not (this is a general comment, and is not specifically directed to Lckyby). Acroterion (talk) 15:04, 30 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ "Bosisio banned for two years". CyclingNews. Retrieved 30 April 2010.

Michael Rasmussen: Tour de France 2007[edit]

Can anyone find a source which confirmes that Michael Rasmussen did miss dopingtests and not only failed to report his whereabouts? Tøndemageren (talk) 12:20, 22 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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The length of this article[edit]

is scary. The computer feel like it's going to explode when it loads. Maybe we could separate it into multiple articles, say, "the before 1980 era", "the eighties", "the nineties", "2000-2010", "2010 onwards". What do you think? Mattaidepikiw (Talk) 05:17, 10 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Newly revealed doping cases[edit]

It's come out that Giampaolo Caruso was caught doping during an Australian road cycle race back in 2003, fined and given a suspention, and as such a mention should probably be added to to the page.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/national/cycling-body-in-disgrace-after-tour-down-under-stage-winner-exposed-as-drug-cheat/story-fndo471r-1226495035747 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:470:1F07:2A6:8E89:A5FF:FE1A:4C37 (talk) 07:36, 15 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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W52-FC Porto doping case[edit]

The W52-FC Porto doping case is missing from the list. They were caught cheating once again; some wins have been stripped. SLBedit (talk) 15:52, 3 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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